Hey Peter, did your cell run out of gas when you were talking to me?

Steve

 

Hooray for nardo!!

 

Why... I think all of the Ewok comments were right!

 

Details.....details......

yeah...there too

Actually, this is the weekend of the debut of the 62 kit..... since there is nothing to see on the car, it will be a static display (isn't that right Peter...I have to check my facts these days) but you will see all the parts of the prototype...... in Nashville it will be on my car that Dave and I will be driving up from Atlanta. I'm very excited about next week... I have not had my Mini for one month tomorrow

 

will the m62-mini join east coast legs of MTTS?

I'm eager to see the car in person

 

I have a great job that I have been at for over ten years (AudioQuest). I get over 20 vacations days + 5 sick/personal days a year. I also travel to Asia two or three times a year earning comp days.

I usually use these days for a surf trip vacation with the wife in the winter. Get this! I told the wife about the M62 and she told me I should cash out my time at the end of the year and get the M62. You have to love this women . No surf trip but I still have local waves.

The last time she pulled something like this I ended up with a DFIC.

I really can't wait till January.

LongBoard

 

I'm sorry there are no plans.....I have to work and so does Dave......there will be a pretty good bit of info and pictures coming and I live in Atlanta if you want to visit....Airtran rt is usually about $200 which is cheaper than driving te car up.....there are several people that want the kit and I am sure like the DFIC that the good reviews will travel fast and there will be a car in he NE before long.......

 

Spider on a stock car with no mods you don't think the car will dyno over 200 whp? I thought I heard you say that. I would have thought that the performance gain would have been greater. For the 3000ish dollars the kit will likely cost + install you can certainly break 200 whp with other mods. Is this mainly to cool the intake charge and produce a more reliable 200+ whp?

 

200whp with a few mods are the proverbial wifes tale......

We have proven it over and over again at our local dyno shoot outs that
anything over 195 whp... takes some serious tuning and coin.
As for reliabillity when it comes to the M62 system, the lower
boost combined with higher CFM's will produce a cooler, denser intake charge
thus preventing knocking and detonation while still produce a substantial amount of power. But as always....the proof is in the pudding and we will have #'s to substantiate that the M62 is a fantastic way to produce safe
reliable power.

peter
Team M7
562-608-8123

at large in Monterey

 

Peter is not only right he is being very honest with you..... 200 whp out of the Mini engine with the stock M45 blower is extremely difficult. I was indignant with Eric at Helix who said the dyno is "free" to anyone who can make or break 200 whp without a turbo (or nitrous) Eric was right (damn it ) if I have one problem with Randy Webb it would be that his website led me to believe that the mods were additive in power..... if I buy this that adds 10whp and that that adds 20 and that that adds 10 I will add 40 whp..... you can research my posts over the last few years and nothing is further from the truth....(this is not Randy's fault but rather my ignorance about modding engines) there is serious "compression" in factor..... you can have subtraction by adddition...yep some mods I did felt like I went backwards......what I mean by this is I would expect say 10 more whp and I would get 2-3 which is in the +/- range of most dynos...so I did not go backwards but $1000 later it sure felt that way.

at this point I truly believe that you have to either TC or go 62 to start getting big numbers.... TC is proven..... I think Eric goes for a conservative 265 whp but I am told the kit is capable of much more.... the WMS "mule" I thought I read was doing 300whp. The 62 kit on a stock car in over 100 deg heat took a car from the 140s to the mid 180s... 40 whp for $3K with so little labor is a deal I would take in heart beat. The best guess is that the bottleneck of the stock car with the head/header etc and is what is choking down the engine after 5500 rpm..... my car being as free breathing as it can get (for practicality) should be able to take full advantage of the increased blower.... we are hoping for 250-265whp.....with a very nice torque curve giving it V6 like grunt.....

The reason that Eric could make his challenge and Peter makes his statement and I mine is tha all of us (they more than me) have a stack of dyno graphs (for me many disappointing.. I thought I would be at 265whp with what I have) that bear this out...... Eric knew early that the 1.6 needed more air (as well as Hubie) and did something about it..... one more thing.... the 62 SC we believe/are hoping based on experience with other engines will make all your other mods that much better.

My hobby is stamping out my own ignorance and I never lack for subject matter

Bob

PS I hope the boys at Laguna Seca - Peter, Randy, TonyB and Nardo are having fun

 

I see once again that you are promising to show numbers. Will you keep this promise? This is not meant as a slam but please don't say you will and then claim later that dyno's don't prove anything. It hurts your credibility.
Looking forward to this great product for the mini community!

 

Thank you Bob....

It's 6:40am and I feel groggy from a healthy exposure of sun and fresh air.

It's of to the races, and crowds......

Peter, Randy and Nardo

At large in Monterey

 

Let me clarify this..... DDM is producing the kit and they will be responsible for the numbers......Dave (DDM) has told me he has every intention of publishing numbers and I am sure he will.....this is not M7s responsibility but I would imagine that M7 will probably post them (DDMs numbers) on their site.

Bob

 

Thanks Spider. I guess I was just spoiled by my old car, the last owner dumped some ridiculous cash into the car to get the numbers he did, and I don't really expect to reproduce them for 1/4 of the cost, but I was hoping for better numbers from this kit.

My basis for the comment about being able to put down ~200 whp with basic mods was something that stemmed from reading Steves Performance Auto.

They list on their site a Stage 3 kit that claims to produce over 200 whp. This kit includes the following

ECU Re-Map, "One Ball" Exhaust System, Cold Air Intake, 180 degree Thermostat, Supercharger vacuum tube, 15% pulley, Cold Spark Plugs, Enlarged Throttle Body, Shrick Camshaft, and Intake Manifold Port Matching.
$2717.50


I was under the impression that the 62 kit would be close to that price, hence my surprise to learn that it likely would barely add up to the same #'s

 

we figure/hope the 62 will give about a 30% increase to what you have....as for Steve's, I am not going to comment as I have no knowledge of their package......

 

Sounds good. I know you said septemberish release. Guess i'll just have to plan on some additional mods, sounds like a good head would be the best way to go.

 

rememeber that anything I say is not "official"..... I am just giving you info that Dave at DDM and I talk about.....

 

Ya I don't expect numbers to be exact, but it gives me an idea of where to go with mods and how to budget what i'm going to do with the car. Somehow I have a feeling upgrading to an M62 kit, with it's cooler instake charge and lower boost, and spending 1-2k on additional mods to help it breath would be a lot more reliable than just bolting a twincharge kit up.

Exhaust, Intake, Throttle body, a new head, maybe a pulley depending on which one was included with the kit, seems like that would probably reliably produce at least 215-220 HP, more reliable than a twin charge kit, with less complexity.

 

What's going on at Laguna Seca? How about a report with some pictures?

 

Heya Bob, this might help a little:

https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...62#post1095262

 

Thanks Tony.... went over and saw the pics.... wish I was there and can't wait to get the 62 back and on my car......YES!!!!!

 

Just spoke Peter, and had to tell him that I won't be making it today

I don't know how it happened, but I'm feeling really under the weather! Didn't sleep well, and woke-up with a sore throat, and my face is throbbing from a sunburn. Go figure as I was feeling cold a good portion of the time...

My wife and I are leaving for Seattle & Victoria, Canada on Wed... so I'm staying home trying to make sure I get better (or don't get worse).

That all said, the interest in the M62 was strong! Peter has a binder on this table where folks can supply their name and contact information to be notified when it's ready for prime time. I recall 3 or so pages being completed as of the end of yesterday...

As much as we all love NAM and spend a good part of our time here, it was a pleasant reminder how few people have heard of our Community! I guess that is a good thing for the likes of the vendors there who were gaining exposure this to new audience. With that, the M62 was a surprise to many as they didn't expect such an option for the MINI...

The M62, while it won't make the ultimate in power, I'm guessing that it will appeal to a broad range of folks who want to up the performance, with certain qualifiers or requisite needs.

It tops my list for the next mod!

 

Thanks for the report... I'm sorry your feeling bad.... rest...get well and enjoy your trip this week......

Bob

 

"...200 whp out of the Mini engine with the stock M45 blower is extremely difficult. I was indignant with Eric at Helix who said the dyno is "free" to anyone who can make or break 200 whp without a turbo (or nitrous) Eric was right (damn it) ..."

There have been quite a few cars that achieved the >200 whp mark without a turbo and twin-charged set up. Yes, they may be fairly modified, but the whp levels were quite real. I do believe there are a number of posts on NAM dealing with this. Yes, the contribution of the various mods is indeed not additive; but this has been a topic of extensive discussion on NAM and elsewhere.

BTW, my last dyno yielded 225 whp (@255 at the crank, assuming a 12% drivetrain loss), and while the car is highly modified, it is sans turbo or t/c. Also, I believe that Randy Webb's mule was in that range before he went the t/c route. After the exhaust system for my Mini is finalized and after a few more tweaks, including re-tuning the ECU, I'll get some more dyno data and post them here.

With all that said, the M62 supercharger route is indeed very attractive, and may be an important performance modification for the "powermongers"...

 

250whp + without TC or Turbo, plus the pure supercharger whine..
that is VERY insane..