>>Graham,
>>Glad your back, what is (phobols)
>>see you Friday
>>Jan

what is (phobols)

Page 14 of this thread around the 14th post.

 

Guys: what happened to this thread??? It felt like we had such great momentum a couple of weeks ago, and now everything has just fizzled...maybe everyone turned their anger on MINI-Legal or something and forgot that *OUR CARS ARE STILL STUMBLING OVER HERE* -- Maybe MINI USA started this whole "Playing hardball with MCO" thing to distract us from the stumble. I don't know, but I hope everyone is still doing the weekly Service Manager call that I am at least.

 

I've noticed that this issue has fizzled too...but without any resolution to the problem.

Graham, now that you've been driving for a few weeks on the re-installed ECU, what's your opinion. Also (and most importantly), did MINI ever give you any information on just what was supposedly changed/fixed when they had your ECU?

 

>>I've noticed that this issue has fizzled too...but without any resolution to the problem.
>>
>>Graham, now that you've been driving for a few weeks on the re-installed ECU, what's your opinion. Also (and most importantly), did MINI ever give you any information on just what was supposedly changed/fixed when they had your ECU?

Just so everyone knows. I had a fellow stumble sufferer drive my car today following my ECU's visit to England. While I had thought my stumble was better than it was a month ago, apparently it's exactly the same as the newer cars. All MINIUSA did was reflash mine with the stuff the factory is using today. I'm not going to put the $700 EvoTech mods on top of this software version. Instead, Randy told me that the Powerchip remaps appear to fix the stumble. I'm willing to try cos' I'm sure fed up with tearing up my clutch.

Graham

 

>>>>I've noticed that this issue has fizzled too...but without any resolution to the problem.
>>>>
>>>>Graham, now that you've been driving for a few weeks on the re-installed ECU, what's your opinion. Also (and most importantly), did MINI ever give you any information on just what was supposedly changed/fixed when they had your ECU?
>>
>>Just so everyone knows. I had a fellow stumble sufferer drive my car today following my ECU's visit to England. While I had thought my stumble was better than it was a month ago, apparently it's exactly the same as the newer cars. All MINIUSA did was reflash mine with the stuff the factory is using today. I'm not going to put the $700 EvoTech mods on top of this software version. Instead, Randy told me that the Powerchip remaps appear to fix the stumble. I'm willing to try cos' I'm sure fed up with tearing up my clutch.
>>
>>Graham
>>

mckinneymini, forgive me if I already asked this, I can't face digging back through the 16 pages of this thread.... At any rate, is your stumble the quick lurch when engaging first stumble (the hiccup stumble) or the more prolonged 2-3 second crawl with the clutch fully engaged stumble (the snail stumble)?

cheers.

 

>>>>>>>>mckinneymini, forgive me if I already asked this, I can't face digging back through the 16 pages of this thread.... At any rate, is your stumble the quick lurch when engaging first stumble (the hiccup stumble) or the more prolonged 2-3 second crawl with the clutch fully engaged stumble (the snail stumble)?
>>
>>cheers.

I've (still) got the lurch, hiccup midway up the clutch release in first. Sucks! My car was fine for the first 50 miles after the reflash in the UK. Now I'm back with the same problem.

Graham

 

Picked up my July 03 build MCS Friday. I now have about 600 miles on it and so far no yo-yo, no stumble, no lurch, no lights on that shouldn't be, no rattles, no leaks, etc. Only problem I've had is staying below the 4500 RPM for break in. The car is a blast to drive. I was very concerned due to the posts here. Not sure of the software version but maybe this is an indication that the newest version works. (Or that the car doesn't have enough miles on it yet).

Best,
WPS

 

I had software version 34.x installed the end of last week. Been somewhat mum on it since I've had my car in the garage working on the DEI CryO2 setup and some other fun little things. Only driven the car home from the dealer since the software update. Appears better, but there was still a little hiccup there. Time will tell. I'll let you know after a week of driving.

R

 

I have had the stumble since my dealer upgraded my software to try to fix my cold start problem. I haven't had the cold start for awhile (mainly since the temp is always over 70 in STL now) but I still have the stumble. I have asked my dealer about progress on new code twice. All I get is "they are working on it". It's been over a month now with no progress. I'm calling 866-ASKMINI today to complain and try to get some answers. I am not optimistic.

That being said, I am super-happy with the car even with the stumble. I go to the track with it again on the 30th and can't wait!

_________________
--MCS (named "Flash&quot, St. Louis, MO
Co-founder-St. Louis Mini Club STLMINI.COM
<img src=http://www.aarongeiger.com/mcosig.jpg>

 

I'd read folks on other forums mentioning the hiccup stumble occuring at 1900 RPM, with a similar hiccup while deccelerating through 1900 RPM and never really paid mutch attention to it. My hiccup stumble seems to happen at whatever RPM I let the clutch engage. Last night though, I was driving in some heavy traffic and I let the car drift down though 1900 RPM range. At least twice there was a noticeable lurch right at about 1900 RPM while deccelerating with the clutch fully engaged. I can't remember if I was in first or second gear at the time.

Anyone else with the stumble see this 1900 RPM lurch while deccelerating?

 

Yeah, yeah, I'm "happy" with my car too...but resent the fact that it doesn't drive the way I think that it should without my trashing my clutch to an early (and if just out of warranty, very expensive) death. So, it definitely stinks that the newest version of the ECU -- which is what Graham apparently now has -- still has this problem.

Sorry, I think that my car should run properly without my having to install the Powerchip aftermarket solution. Unless MINI wants to pay to do this (yeah, right), I think this car is still friggin' broken. :evil: And yes, just in case it's overlooked, I ALSO STILL have the long-cranking, weak starting, problem which was brought on by the version 33 software. I'm fully anticipating that this will turn into a real pain once the weather gets cold.

Oh, no, I haven't noticed any stumble on DECELERATION. Sorry...

 

>>Picked up my July 03 build MCS Friday. I now have about 600 miles on it and so far no yo-yo, no stumble, no lurch, no lights on that shouldn't be, no rattles, no leaks, etc. Only problem I've had is staying below the 4500 RPM for break in. The car is a blast to drive. I was very concerned due to the posts here. Not sure of the software version but maybe this is an indication that the newest version works. (Or that the car doesn't have enough miles on it yet).
>>


This is my current theory: that they have better software out there now--that's why I started the survey that didn't get nearly as many responses as I had hoped, but still, you can see the trend. Basically, everyone who has picked up since the end of June/beginning of July on has had no stumble.

What I don't understand is:
Q: If there IS such software at the factory, why are we not seeing it over here yet?

Possible solutions?
A:Some sort of emissions issues in the US? Siemens software vs. BMW software problems? Anyone? Bueller? Bueller!??!

 

I just e-mailed this to Askmini. Cross your fingers and let's see if I get some real info.
--------------------------------------------------------

Hello,
On 6/25/03, I e-mailed *** at MINI of St. Louis about my problems with cold starting and a first-gear stumble on my MINI Cooper S. He advised me to bring the car in for new software. They loaded the newest version of the software (33.2 at the time, I believe) on my car. This may have fixed the cold start problem (too hot right now to be sure) but it made my stumble problem much worse. Every time I start off from a stop, the car hiccups in 1st gear just as the clutch is being released. This problem is well documented throughout the MINI ownership:

https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...51&start=0

I e-mailed him again on 8/1 asking for an update. He said that he forwarded my comments to the MINI field engineer. He said that they were still working on it.

I realize that **** at MINI of STL is powerless to do anything about this until MINI engineers release a version of ECU software that corrects the stumble. I have been very happy with the service I have received from the MINI of STL service dept.

What I would like from MINIUSA is:
1. An update on current progress on fixing this problem
2. A definite ETA for when I can bring my car in and have this problem resolved.

This problem has been unresolved for close to two months now and MINIUSA really needs to come up with a solution. Myself and lots of other MINI owners are becoming annoyed with our car’s performance and with MINIUSA for not providing us with useful information and updates.

Thanks for your time.

 

I hate to be a pessimistic but I said it before, I don't think MINIUSA has a solution to the problem. I think they are just playing it off with the coming soon waiting game. Gosh I would imagine Kia would have solved a problem like this by now, and we're dealing with BMW. So, it only leads me to believe that they will not fix it. It came with the car too bad attitude. I hope I'm wrong b/c I have this problem. I myself will eventually get an aftermarket ecu upgrade from Randy but would still like the problem taken care of by MINIUSA.



Peter

 

My car is a July 4 build S. I guess it does "stumble" in first. I can feel it, sometimes it is worse than other times, but it is there.

If mine is as bad as everyone else's here, (it must not be) then I think people are making a big deal out of a small issue. I can certainly live with it the way it is.

I did mention it to my service advisor when I was in getting my lights installed last week. His reply was "We get a lot of complaints about it, and we expect a recall when they have a fix. You will probably get a recall notice."

So if there is a recall, I'll go have my car fixed. Until then, I'm not going to go around bugging my service manager every week. Somewhere, I'm sure there are a few engineers working tirelessly on this problem. Being in the automotive industry, I know how frustrating it probably is for the engineers, and how much testing has to be done before they can release a major change.

This is the most fun to drive car I have ever owned. And I'm not even out of the break in period yet.

 

But remember that Graham's ECU supposedly went to England (although there's evidence further back in this thread that MINIUSA or his dealer may have lied about that :evil: ). If it DID go to England, wouldn't it have gotten whatever the factory was flashing...since the factory too is in England?

Unless of course they sent his ECU to some other part of "England".... This whole thing is just too weird. Redbird, let us know what sort of response (if any) you get. You summed up the problem nicely. My bet (and I should put $ on this) is that the auto-drone at MINI will send you a "we're working on it and will let you know" response. Heck, even when they apparently take it seriously enough to send engineers from der fatherland to examine -- not to mention sending parts of our cars back to England (Graham) or spiriting them away to MINIUSA HQ (Phobol) -- STILL NOTHING HAPPENS.

 

>>My car is a July 4 build S. I guess it does "stumble" in first. I can feel it, sometimes it is worse than other times, but it is there.
>>
>>If mine is as bad as everyone else's here, (it must not be) then I think people are making a big deal out of a small issue. I can certainly live with it the way it is.
>>
>>I did mention it to my service advisor when I was in getting my lights installed last week. His reply was "We get a lot of complaints about it, and we expect a recall when they have a fix. You will probably get a recall notice."
>>
>>So if there is a recall, I'll go have my car fixed. Until then, I'm not going to go around bugging my service manager every week. Somewhere, I'm sure there are a few engineers working tirelessly on this problem. Being in the automotive industry, I know how frustrating it probably is for the engineers, and how much testing has to be done before they can release a major change.
>>
>>This is the most fun to drive car I have ever owned. And I'm not even out of the break in period yet.

YellowMINIS,
Your stumble is probably not as bad as what the rest of us are dealing with. My car stumbled ever so slightly wehen I got it (like yours now) and then I got the software upgraded. The problem is now 10 times worse. That's why it's a big deal. Believe me, I hate making a big deal out of the problem. Something was changed in the software to cause this problem, so they should be able to fix it. I have been very patient for the last two months but am getting tired of waiting. I just hope the waiting is worth it. I can't wait to have my car back the way it was when I got it.

As said before, I still love the car! It is the best car I have ever owned and worth every cent and the minor issues (hood rub, stumble, etc...) Can't wait for track time to come again!


_________________
--MCS (named "Flash&quot, St. Louis, MO
Co-founder-St. Louis Mini Club STLMINI.COM<p>
<img src=http://www.aarongeiger.com/mcosig.jpg>

 

I was going thru the Book of Motoring today (I'm inside of a week to delivery and I needed a fix) and was savoring the irony of the section on putting a glass of water on the dash and practing launches with the clutch until you could do it without spilling a drop. Maybe that should be the lithmus test for the new software.

 

^ I guess I should have read this to indicate just how difficult it is to launch this car smoothly.

And I thought this was just more cutesy marketing hoohah.

(I've been driving standard for close to 30 years...so I can accomplish this trick in other cars)

 

Once the new ECU was installed in my car, the stumble at takeoff was gone completely. The slight stumble upon decelaration, however, is present. I will look for the recall notice. If I had a stumble as bad as everyone elses' then you should all go in and ask for a new ECU. An ECU re-flash solved my cold start problem but brought on the stumble. A new ECU eliminated the stumble and it starts at any temp now.

 

>>Once the new ECU was installed in my car, the stumble at takeoff was gone completely.

When? Where? What version? MC or MCS? Build date?

 

>>Once the new ECU was installed in my car, the stumble at takeoff was gone completely. The slight stumble upon decelaration, however, is present. I will look for the recall notice. If I had a stumble as bad as everyone elses' then you should all go in and ask for a new ECU. An ECU re-flash solved my cold start problem but brought on the stumble. A new ECU eliminated the stumble and it starts at any temp now.

The stumble or "tick" on deceleration (around 1500 RPM) is normal. This is caused by fuel being reintroduced to the engine. During no-throttle deceleration, fuel is almost completely shut off to the engine. Most fuel-injected cars have a similar behavior.

Please give us any details you have on where, when, how, etc. What recall notice? I would love to have some good info to give to my service manager for him to look into. Thanks in advance!
:smile:

 

I had the work done at Crevier in Santa Ana CA. The car is a 2002 S. I have no idea what the software version is, however. I did not ask when the new ECU was installed. My original ECU was sent to BMW for evaluation and a new one was installed after BMW was unable to fix the problem. Is there a way to discern the version number without the dealer hooking up the diagnostic display?

 

>> I did not ask when the new ECU was installed. My original ECU was sent to BMW >>for evaluation and a new one was installed after BMW was unable to fix the >>problem.


Whoa...I didn't realize you had had a whole ECU replacement...as in a brand new ECU? Wild...so when was all this done? I don't think that has been established yet.

Graham, if I understand correctly, your ECU was "sent to England" and was reflashed or something, but supposedly the one that's in your car now is the same one that was pulled out of it a month ago, right?

New theory: software alone can't fix the stumble (even though it brought it on?). To eliminate stumble and cold start, etc. it's going to be necessary for BMW to replace all of our ECU's entirely. And that's pricey. Hence, no gameshow.

C'mon BMW! Talk to us here! I'm no good at this Sherlock Holmes BS! Just fix the freaking problem already!!!

Maxwell

 

>>Graham, if I understand correctly, your ECU was "sent to England" and was reflashed or something, but supposedly the one that's in your car now is the same one that was pulled out of it a month ago, right?

Negative. Original ECU was fried by MINI NJ - car would not start when ECU received at the dealership. New ECU sent to England for programming. Supposedly got latest software. Car still stumbles. Dang!

Graham