Hello friends!

I come here again seeking advice (sorry ) and eventually I might have a story for you here in a couple weeks so make sure you have popcorn in the house .

So I got my r53 ('04 S) a few months ago and I've just recently been experiencing a horrible noise when turning at low speeds. Unrelated to that, I also apparently sprung a coolant leak. It got the the point where one day I was driving and I overheated about 1/4 the way to work... I literally spent 45 minutes starting and stopping it in order to get home without blowing my engine so I could refill it (it's was 5 minutes from home).

So I decided that my broke college self had wasted enough time putting off the repairs and I took it into the local Firestone Complete Auto center (I've been there before and they always treat me well... except Charles... he's a sarcastic... ahem). Had them do a pressure test on the system and it wasn't leaking anywhere... they noticed a bit on the bottom of the car, but upon closer inspection... it was the AC line that was leaking (they had those fancy glasses and light). While they were down there also, there was a thick coating of oil all along the bottom of the car and dripping from various parts. I had the oil changed 3k ago and the oil was at the bottom of the stick. Even further than that, my control arm bushings were ripped and the bastard that was causing the noise was the struts. We looked around for both a leak from the cooling system and a leak from the engine and we couldn't find anything..

Firestone gave me a quote for the struts and mount kits that came out to be $882.10 with labor and they couldn't do anything about the control arm bushings, oil leak, a/c leak, or the coolant leak. They were straight up with me and suggested I just go to a Mini dealer to find out what all was wrong with it and what they would charge to fix it.

So I called up Mini of Indy (1.3 hours away) and checked to see when their next available appointment was... Jan 29th... nope, can't do it... only available M-F day is Jan 19... Call Mini of Louisville (3 hours away) and they have a spot open on the 19th at 1pm. Bingo! I ask if they have to keep it overnight, what I need to do since I don't have another car... They said they will give me a complementary loaner while it's in the shop and put in a reservation for me. Sweet! But then I get a little concerned... since... you know... TINSTAAFL... and now I'm a little concerned that I'm going to get screwed somehow for accepting the "free" rental.

On top of that... I'm concerned that I will end up with a 3k-4k bill that I won't be able to pay and if they put up a 3k-4k estimate.. that I will end up paying out the butt for them to figure out that I will have to pay them that much... Maybe I'm just freaking out a little too much because I've never been to a Mini dealership before and I have a horrible impression of dealerships in general.. and maybe I'm freaking out because Minis and BMWs are considered more of a luxury car... but I'm kinda really freaking out about this visit to the dealer.

Can someone who has been to a Mini dealer (or maybe even this actual one) give me some advice (or warnings) of things to watch out for or avoid or point me in the directions of some stories that might help? Also, if you have any pointers on how to address some of the issues I am having and/or where the issues may be stemming from... that'd be grand.

Thanks friends! I appreciate and thank anyone in advance for the help/advice they give.

 

Don't let them intimidate you. Just tell them that you want a detailed estimate of what's wrong and what they charge to fix each item. The oil on the bottom of the engine is, in all probability, the Crank Position Sensor O-Ring leaking. (Do a search...Plenty of threads on this.) Don't let them con you into having your oil pan gasket changed unless it can be proven to be the culprit. If you need struts, in all probability, there will be some good used ones from one of the NAM members who've swapped out perfectly good ones for coil-overs or KONI Sports. Way Motor Works has plenty of good used parts for sale, too. Any indy shop can change them out or you may have some friends who can wrench for you. Not a big job. Stock control arm bushings or poly bushings aren't expensive but somewhat labor intensive. Still, an indy or good amateur can do the job. Not rocket science.

 

Check the club directory, find a club near you and inquire with them for where a reliable independent shop can be found...a heck of a lot less expensive than a dealership.
The dealership mode of operation is to throw new parts at a problem 'till things work as they should. A good indy will troubleshoot the system and repair or replace what's needed. I thought I had a set of low mileage struts for you but there's a bit of difference in stock number between the '04 R53 and '06 R52, oh well.

 

Is your coolant tank leaking? I've read in the forums here that the coolant tanks fail quite a bit.
Check your local area for an independent mechanic. Mini dealerships charge ridiculous amounts for parts and labor.
Also, who ever changed your oil maybe didn't know how to change oil on a Mini and got oil all over the underside of your car. The Chevy dealer that I bought my Mini from got oil all over mine. I thought I had a bad leak, because there was oil all over my driveway.

 

I find myself in the same predicament as you, though what I have done from my personal experience is gone to a dealership and asked for a multipoint inspection, which gives you an estimate on what you need. Then use the info provided and start finding parts for cheaper. Indy shops do help a lot with this because labor is a lot less here and don't charge you for just checking out a problem. The rental is like a rental, just return it with a full tank and no charge is made. As long as they repair something on your mini.

 

I believe there is a 120.00 diagnostic fee and they can go through the car and see whats all wrong with it. Give you an estimate.... which prolly wont be a pretty number at all. They will probably include stuff that depending on mileage believe will be serviced here soon or has already expired. So if you get a estimate of 5k... dont be surprised.... dont even be alarmed. Take the estimate they give you and start calling indy shops to see how much they will charge you for the work. It will prolly be around half of what the dealership will charge ya.

 

Nothing really to be scared of..the dealer will give you a diagnosis and cost to resolve. The loaner is a courtesy.. Lower control arm replacement from an independent shop is 400-800..it's just tons of labor to drop the subframe. Mini will go by the book hours and it's a lot of hours.

I don't think the squeaking would be cause by these. The more likely culprit would be a bearing or the hub. $400 ish?

Parts and labor on struts and the upper mounts all around at MINI isn't gonna be cheap...my guess. $800 minimum..but I haven't priced out OEM struts..aftermarket would be a better choice....better handling etc...I did this job in my friends driveway... if Firestone quoted at $800 figure at least 50% more from MINI. Yikes thats a lot of cash for struts and upper strut mounts. I think my parts came to about $300..not OEM.

Coolant leak that can't be visually found is odd. Google mini coolant expansion tank failure and see if you have the symptoms. The coolant tank is $89 from the dealer install takes 30 minutes..expect to pay about an hour of labor and maybe a bit for lost coolant.

Oil leak...this can get pricey...monitor your oil if you can't afford whatever fix they propose. Losing only about a quart..middle of stick to bottom of stick over 3,000 miles isn't uncommon on these cars.

So if you add it up $2000-3000 would be an expected bill on the things you stated. The one that poses the biggest risk is the coolant..lose all that and your engine is toast...control arms aren't great to have worn but I don't know if it would pose eminent danger...I fathom that many minis are running around with blown bushings. Oil leak like I said if it isn't catastrophic meaning there isn't a huge puddle of oil in your driveway...you could manage through for a little while. But religious checking and filling of oil will be necessary....if it gets worse you MUST repair it...oil = engine life blood.

What kind of mileage and service history? Where are you located - better off going to a independent shop as stated by markjenn. I am guessing at this point you did not do a pre-purchase inspection which would have led you to either pay $3000 less for this car or walk away all together.

The silver lining if any: these are manageable problems they just won't be cheap.

 

 

If you have the time you can save $$$ shopping for parts. Good luck.

 

If your near Indianapolis you can go to Reggies Motorworks in Noblesville. I personally know the guys there from when I lived in Indy and trust them. They also get aftermarket parts from us. So they can do all the repairs you need and do them more affordable than the dealer. Also they won't have a problem using better than OEM parts like the powerflex control arm bushings.

http://www.reggiesmotorworks.com/

 

Wow I got quite a few responses overnight! Thank you all so much, you're really kind!

So the reason I even decided to go with the dealer initially is because I didn't know where else to go and I haven't found a club nearby to join yet. (the good news on that front is that I am moving to Houston this summer and I hear that they have a huge club) After coming to my senses a little bit and hearing what you guys said, I started to look around a bit and I put in a request for an appointment at Reggies Motorworks. I'm about 1.5 hours away from them still, but it sounds like a better option at this point.

I'm not completely ignorant when it comes to cars and I would check out some of the things you all suggested with the oil, but I live in an apartment right now and don't have a garage.. on top of that it's around 3 degrees F right now and that doesn't really work too well with me. Haha.

It might be the coolant tank, but wouldn't it leak while the pressure test was being done? I'll go ahead and try to see if I have any warning signs of the tank failing with this page's instruction. As for the post about the oil being left over from a oil change.. if that's the case, I have bigger problems because my mini would be burning through oil instead..

Thanks again for your help everyone, I'll let you know when I get an appointment scheduled somewhere else and the one at Mini cancelled. I'll also post if I find the source of any of my problems. You all are awesome!

Edit: Oh and the reason I didn't have it inspected before I bought it was because: A) No close Mini dealers and B) I bought it from a friend. I know I probably should have.. since it's an '04 and has 157k, but my last car was about to crap out and I needed to ditch it before I had to throw a lot more money at it.

 

Just be sure to tell them Way sent you.

 

Alright guys, I am back (and with estimates already!). So I contacted RMW and set up an appointment for next Monday and was able to get my Mini up there yesterday in order to actually have them figure out what they need to do.

The coolant leak is apparently coming from the Thermostat Housting. The oil leak is coming from the valve cover and oil filter housing. They made me up quotes for that and the struts. I've included them below:



First quote is to fix my leaks. Shop labor is $100 something and some change so the math makes sense... but will it actually take that long to do the repairs? I can understand some of it will take a little while, but I'm wanting to make sure I'm not being overcharged here. Also, since this is an estimate, if they go over or under on the time quoted will my final cost be more/less? This is the first independent shop I've dealt with so I just wanted to make sure.



This is the second quote I got and (unlike firestone) it includes the bushings as well. What do you all think of this one?

Sorry if it seems like I am asking a lot of you guys! I'm still young and this is my first truly foreign car. I'm still getting used to the fun life of owning (and repairing) an import.

 

I've done all those jobs myself so my first impression is that, for an indy, both estimates are reasonable and pretty much on-target. Using aftermarket parts could save you some money and, of course, DIY could save all that labor but, in the long run, OEM parts have a warranty and, in the absence of having skilled amateur labor to DIY, you have received a fair quote. No matter how they do it, those control arm bushings are no fun and getting to the thermostat housing is half the battle.

 

http://repairpal.com/estimator/ I like to use this site just to get a feel for price ranges. I'm a bit spoiled because my mechanic is $70 hour, works fast and efficiently, doesn't use any extra parts. He treats the car as if it was his own.

What I've found with some BMW or Mini indy shops is that they charge just enough less to entice you to use them but you don't get a great deal. Consider that they don't have the army of people sitting around to support, nor the advertising and rents and it becomes a head scratcher as to why the rates they get are high.

Not implying anything about any shops mentioned in this thread !! Haven't really run the numbers.

 

I would tend to agree but feel like the front strut and tower replacement is a little long on the hours. There are essentially 5 bolts to each side that hold it together and with a wall mounted spring compressor I don't see 2.5 hours on that job. I feel like even within my own driveway I could do this in 45 minutes a side (and have). However, the rate for the lower control arm bushings is very good -- so it kind of balances out.

As for $100 an hour -- seems kind of high... I think the mini dealer near me charges $120 an hour..what was the rate near you?

 

Thanks again for the advice/help guys! I was planning on putting the struts off until I move to Texas this summer anyway and I was going to try to do it myself one weekend because of the expense to have someone else do it. I hope I'm capable of doing the control arm bushings since they are no fun! I'll let you all know if the work they do takes care of my leaks or not. Hopefully it does! I can't take many more hits to the bank like that with my upcoming move/wedding.

Apparently they are about 10% less than the Mini dealership on labor. One of their guys used to work at Mini and a lot of them are "specialized" so that is probably why the rate is so high.

Also, in case I didn't get it across earlier... I love you guys. You all are super helpful and nice! I really do sincerely appreciate it sooo much!

 

You can definitely postpone the struts and control bushings.

I think these are reasonable and fair estimates, but it begs the question of just how much it costs to maintain these little cars. You're essentially fixing a couple minor leaks as well as getting struts and bushings replaced. For this, you're having to spend $2500 which is probably about 1/3 the value of the car. I just sold my 04 and as much as I still enjoyed the car, I sold it in large part because I didn't want to continue to own such a high maintenance expense car.

- Mark

 

Labor is a pretty heavy component of his costs. Save the Lower control arm bushings most of those items are straight forward DIY projects. An r53 is a at best 9 year old car....and not a vehicle you want if you don't have the time, patience, and skill set to wrench.

 

Even though I know that you aren't directly attacking my choice of buying the car, I can't help but feel like I need to defend myself here... so I'll explain where I came from in my choice to purchase my R53.

I originally had an '00 Mitsubishi Galant (which is honestly.. a very "American" import when it comes to repairs) that I owned and tore up since I was 15 y/o (I'm 21 now). I did most of the service that I could do on it myself or with the help of my father so I'm not foreign to the concept of wrenching a vehicle. Previously I had a large set of tools and a garage for working (along with someone else's money to purchase the stuff I needed) and now I'm just about to finish up college and have a very limited set of tools and nowhere to work on it. My (now) old car had over 225k on it and a list of repairs that I've been having to put off because of money (this list was over half of the cost of the r53).

I ended up jumping on the opportunity to acquire this vehicle from a good friend of mine that I worked with because: A) anything is better than the ticking time bomb that I had, and B) because I've always admired Minis. I had the plan and intention of doing all the work that I could myself and even did a complete tune up (spark plugs/wires, coolant flush/refill, air filters, oil change [and a radio/subwoofer install]), but when it's the middle of winter and you don't have a garage, and you're about to move across the country and are trying to sell things as opposed to buying more things... it's a bit difficult to take on these larger jobs.

 

@phil -- to the contrary -- I was defending your choice and addressing the prior poster's reason for ditching his R53. A used car is a used car, seals dry up, metal fatigues, rust happens. You can't walk into any used car not expecting to make some level of maintenance or repairs.

I used to live in NYC ... I know your plight completely... it was lame having to drive to my friend's house in NJ to change out my struts....and who is to say you even have anyone who will let you do it.

A friend of mine who lives in Boston and doesnt have a garage actually got caught changing his brakes in the underground garage of a mall. The security team was less than please but really couldn't do much as his car was torn apart with bolts all over... was humorous to say the least. They ended up checking on him a few hours later and told him firmly (but with a smile) get the f out of here.

 

I certainly understand the principle that older cars are more expensive to maintain. That's not the point. The point is that Mini's in general have MUCH high maintenance/repair costs once you get out to 10 years or so, much higher than most small cars. Little things like oil seal leaks, sensor replacements, door lifts, window lock actuators, wiper/washer motors, suspension attachment bushings, etc..... the list just goes on and on and each is relatively expensive as these things go, either in labor of the mechanic or labor of the owner. If you love this stuff, no big deal, but for most of us, things like this just gradually wear you down. I just decided I wasn't into the car enough to justify the continued heavy involvement in trying to keep costs under control. That and dealing with Mini USA on some warranty reimbursement stuff where their customer service was almost comically incompetent.

In a $60K M3, I understand very high upkeep costs, but not in a $25K hatch.

Regardless, to the OP, enjoy your new car and best of luck getting this stuff fixed.

- Mark

 

I think it's really just a function of the design. Small, compact work space means everything needs to come off to reach anything...most of the parts don't cost very much but getting them out or in is an absolute mission....and racks up the hours quickly. It also leads to a lot of "well while I'm in there..."

 

So I made my own trip to the dealer this weekend as the dealer near me was having a FREE service clinic, and I needed to have the coolant flushed and filled.

I wanted to make sure that my diagnosis and views of the condition of Nigel were correct.

So -- an hour later here was the prognosis and overall cost to repair:
1) Side marker out and rear license plate lights not working
2) Valve cover gasket, CPS o-ring (I just replaced it), Oil Filter Housing gasket, Oil cooler gasket
3) Both upper motor mounts - I am assumin this means the upper mount and the support bracket on the shock tower
4) Power steering hose (minimal leaking -- as I check the level almost weekly after dumping a lot of fluid from a loose clamp

Total cost for parts and labor $2000 -- yikes. So I said thank you as I do most of my own work..

I went ahead and ordered everything besides the power steering hose and upper mount (I have a TSW sitting in my garage).

Total cost shipped for parts $93 from ECS tuning. I know that I'll be slower than the dealer but I need to take off the intercooler to change the boots and install an oil catch can anyhow so...the only real work I am not looking forward to is the oil filter housing (which mind you has been leaking for over a year).

Just goes to show that MUCH of the maintenance cost on these cars is labor...some of the labor and diagnosis charges were beyond obscene -- I love this dealer (which will remain un-named) but I just can't justify spending that much cash on a 12 year old car... to quote my 75 year old Mom (who is hella conservative with money)...at that price just go buy a new car...I have been eyeing a B7 S4 for a long long time. Will probably continue to eye it for a long long time given the overall "great condition" rating the dealer gave.