After installing and testing the DFIC, I did not provide my numbers in this "numbers" thread for two reasons:

1. Dr O was going to do so...

2. And as previously mentioned, the data-logging equipment utilized (CarChip E/X) only captures data at 5 second intervals; which is not exactly ideal. I simply started another thread, where the numbers were not the primary focus...

That all being said, the testing methodolgy was quite sound. Comparisons were done on the same car (my MCS). Runs were done on the same stretch of rural and canyon roads where I live. These runs were done during very similar environmental conditions, namely temperature. And I put the car through its paces in a very similar fashion, as the recorded speeds, RPMs and elapsed times would indicate. The only difference of note was the swaping of intercoolers, and from previous experiments, scoops as well...

From previous data-logging (BiMCom) that was provided on NAM:

- stock IC at 68F saw a max IAT of 133.25F
- stock IC at 98F saw a max IAT of 165.65F
- GRS w/ stock scoop at 68F saw a max IAT of 127.85F
- GRS w/ Extreme Scoop at 68F saw a max IAT of 123.8F
- GRS w/ stock scoop at 98F saw a max IAT of 153.5F

From my most recent runs with the CarChip E/X:

- GRS w/Extreme Scoop @76F saw a max IAT of 134.6F
- DFIC w/ included scoop @78F saw a max IAT of 116.F

I've learned that ambient temps do make a difference on IATs, no surprise of course. And that getting that air, and putting it to effective use is paramount. The DFIC does that well.

 

purely comparing these two IC w/ stock scoop then the GRS was 9% more effective than the stock IC.

On this day the difference between the two was 16%.

Very cool - thanks for sharing

 

Bart, I just added another data point that I found...

I'm currently trying to get a gauge set-up that should help for real-time info, but I want to learn more about thermocouples. Greatbear chimed-in this morning, and I still need to get back to him...

https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...86#post1138186

 

Will it take the same amount of energy?

A flow bench is the ideal for sure.
The way I did the steady state cruising worked very well. If my ambient, inlet and outlet temps are stable within ±2º the results are pretty darned consistent. If I wanted a different inlet temp at X mph I just shifted into another gear.

Back to back day comparisons do suffer unless you're lucky enough to get similar days. I had many 88-90º days this summer although humidity was the most inconsistent variable.

Considering the gas I used a flow bench may be just a little more expensive

 

Puhleeese don't take this wrong.... You know I trust what you do, always have.

But without inlet and outlet temps this has less meaning.
Yes peak temps are meaningful but are only part of the picture.

I've logged enough of this to know it's easy to be mislead by peak alone. I'd think "man that should have been good" and then do the math and go WTF??

And again, to be clear, I am not saying the DFIC is a bad thing. It does a good job. Once the tinkering is done, better.
I am getting a bit tired of being apologetic though. I've done nothing wrong.

 

That's slight like the Grand Canyon is a ditch

Should have done them in lexan so you could be very Euro in showing off the motor

 

I understand obe, no offense at all. Temp is part of the picture, along with pressure (molecular density being the marriage). I am getting higher max boost with the DFIC than I ever got with the GRS, so temp takes center stage now...

This "testing" does not include inlet temps, and I understand the importance. I however did not neglect it either. Inlet temps are a function of conditions - ambient / environmental and driver input. I've controlled those quite well by:

1. Checking my home weather station before runs, and also with the MINI ambient temp gauge.

2. Hammering the car on a route that I drive daily in a similar fashion as I possibly can.

I am left with many WOT bursts in which to compare the IC's ability to cool what should be very similarly charged air. Until the other IC's have bungs to make for better comparisions of inlet temps, this is a valid method - in gear, and through gear WOT runs...

I think we finally have an intercooler that is better than a scoop alone .

 

I'm working on that...with greater opening as well

 

Should be fun

 

Hammering the car is good period
I understand the daily route test. Chunks of mine, although much more mundane than yours, are very familiar and have some nice features.
My biological, multidirectional asselerometer provides the feedback or lack thereof I need.

Speaking of scoop. Based on what I've found in measuring my IC with and without the asymmetrical scoop I have to give big creds toi the design.
It made enough consistent difference that I twisted ( well mildly twisted) Joel's arm until he sold it to me.

I'm sure that contributes to the effectiveness of the DFIC.

 

Indeed, it is a system; and the scoops make a difference, as with any TMIC, that's for sure. Joel is a nice guy, besides knowing his stuff! Refinement, I'm sure will continue, and I'll do my part there as well...

 

For sure.

The 1 important tool I can't find is my air dencity meter. It can be hot outside & you can have great air, likewise you can have the opposite. This summer the air quality changed by the hour.

 

Thanks Steve. That helped.

 

Can you elaborate a little more on this?
Do you have an idea of what it will look like and exit?
PM if you want. Thanks.

 

The scoop makes a HUGE difference. I have a DFIC with both ceramic coats on it. Yesterday, after almost a month with the stock scoop setup with the DFIC and not noticing alot of difference I put it on. WOW. That's all there really is to it. So much torque, so much fast (well it feels like it anyway). Before the DFIC got so hot after hard runs that it would burn ur hand, it actually did i mean like my hand was sore for a day. Today it was barely warm at all. The temp here is about 60*. I ran it REAL hard after school, for a good 30minutes. I mean like hard acceleration, everywhere I could. Got home popped the hood. The intake horn before the DFIC was almost too hot to touch. The DFIC, barely warm. The output horn to the intake manifold? Room Temperature. Not a bit of heat. This ***** is amazing.

Mikey

 

Here's my limited understanding of it.
You want smooth laminar flow into through and out.
Currently there's a god effort to improve the first 2 bits but the third has been ignored to a large extent.

The air pre entrance on an IC is flowing faster than what it will through the IC core. You want the exit duct to accomplish the reverse of this. Take the turbulent air, make it laminar and then get it to accelerate and ultimately smoothly reenter vehicle flow.

If this is done well you may find that a smaller or thinner core will work as well as a, or better than heavier unit using poor ducting.

This wasn't really possible until the DFIC came along. The entrance scoop was changed for this purpose, the same amount of effort for an exit duct will potentially push this kit over the top.

Getting really out there....
They may want to look into using a splitter to route the boundary layer air( think of this as slow moving air that's kind of stuck to object it flows over) over the top of the unit and just have the laminar air reach the IC core.

 

Thanks obe, for a little more insight.
Is there a way to find out where on the MINI is a good place for an IC duct exit? A location that might actually pull the exiting air out of the IC while driving.

What about routing the exit duct into a sealed air filter box or intake stream? The vacuum from the intake will help pull the air out of the IC. Pros? Cons?

 

The idea of smoothing the flow out of the DFIC could have merit, but I don't think you'd want to route it to the airbox... primarily because the air exiting the DFIC would be hotter than ambient, having just cooled the compressed air exiting the supercharger. Also, the faster you go, the more air is caught by the hood scoop and forced through the DFIC (to a point of course), so at a certain speed, the supercharger/engine assembly could actually become a bottleneck and hinder flow, especially at part throttle.

 

The simple solution is a nice clean line from the DFIC to an appropriate place in the hood.
Someone more clever than me needs to do the design. Ramp angle, width and a way to accomodate engine movement will need to be considered.

The other part p&s answered very well.

 

Ok ok okey......

We will have something very soon, my good friend JS is working on a solution
that will be visually stimulating and technically sound. Many of you DFIC owners, do own our Strut Tower Brace and this will also be considered in
the final product (space constraints). Will.......will (complicated) most likely have some CFD maps to show the exit scoops air flow characteristics and velocities.

M7 made the DFIC to be a system, with options like the bungs for testing,
and convenient pressure access (standard), or different coatings and future
uppgrades that will be available very soon. This makes the DFIC a very well rounded and thought out Intercooler system.

peter
Team M7
562-608-8123

 

Got the DFIC (polished/ceramic) on yesterday. The scoop has yet to be painted and installed and the thing still performed beautifully! You could really feel the power increase as you got going. It just kept wanting to go faster, as if that's bad thing. What the heck is this thing going to do when the scoop gets put on?!!! Great job M7!

 

Where will it exit? Will this interfere with my louvers?

 

Yup. Or so it looks like it might, from looking at your photos.

 

I guess this might be redundant for me then...

 

Joel, if you're still in a sharing mood (), will this require cutting into the hood ala Sid's project?