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mmm interesting yeah i asked about this a while ago because once i added the sports cat (miltek) my car became a bit more loud on startup but during cold start i didn't love the sound until the warm up cycle was complete.
When I contacted BT about this they asked did I remove the cat and i told them no i just replaced it with a sports cat and thats when i was informed that you would code that feature when removing the cat (because you no longer have cats that need to be warmed up).
o well ive just learned to live with it since then....
If you still have a CAT on the car, then it's best-practice to leave cold-start CAT-heat routine in place to quickly get it up to operating temperature.
But seriously … racing series in Europe run with catalytic converters (though often moved waaaaay down the exhaust stream for heat management). This ain't the 1970's; modern cats are pretty free flowing. Why not leave them in place and let them do their job? Does it really make that much difference in actual power output?
But seriously … racing series in Europe run with catalytic converters (though often moved waaaaay down the exhaust stream for heat management). This ain't the 1970's; modern cats are pretty free flowing. Why not leave them in place and let them do their job? Does it really make that much difference in actual power output?
Current cat designs do not hurt power nearly as much as people think. A 100 cel cat vs no cat would be little to no gain.
Thank you John Totah for your contribution to the MINI Community
John is truly a super MINI fan and the F56 is his 3rd or 4th MINI. When he approached us in July 2017 wanting to be a Beta Tester for the F56 tuning, we really had our reservations. Our concerns were three folds:
Concern #1 = He came across as a "power freak", meaning he wants his MINI to make power 'safely' (which is a slippery slope).
Concern #2 =His F56 Manual was stock with two unusual mods (full 3" intake system & Custom 4" to 3" Turboback exhaust system).
Concern #3 = Poor 91 octane California gas (and Sacramento heat).
He knows quite about cars and is a gear head, but does not have a thorough understanding of the F56 platform.
Since our shop JCW is an automatic and John has a manual; we reluctantly agreed to have him be a Beta Tester for us. We went over the above concerns and he was willing to work with us. With the OBD2 flashing module, we can make necessary changes to his tune based on data logs from his car using the Bluetooth device. He is a seasoned car enthusiast so he can provide us with user feedback in addition to the data logs.
Below, we will go over the "issues" that have been brought up in John's post and provide our take, as well as our solution (or pending solution).
Issue 1: Torque dropping off sharply after 5k RPM. Our take: We couldn't tell if that was cause by the tuning or was it a byproduct of the oversize intake or exhaust system (see Concern #2 above). The over-sized 3" down pipe could have been too big for the turbo; turbo losing back pressure at the higher RPMs. Solution (pending solution): We only test on our own cars and stop using Beta testers or setup that is a "one off" - unless this one off item is about to be mass produced. We have turned away quite a few customers who have one off upgraded parts (mainly turbo upgrades) from buying our tune
We just tuned this 2017 JCW Auto yesterday with the Stage-1 Flash and it does not have that drastic dip. 2017 JCW Auto with Cravenspeed CAI & BT Stage-1 Tune
Issue 2: Boost Spike to 21PSI Our take: This was due to the "over boost" function in the mapping. Solution (pending solution): We have since disabled this feature in our tune to keep the boost level consistent.
Issue 3: "I felt the car was being pushed to hard" Our take: We felt the same way; the octane level is too low to safely keep this power level.(see Concern #3 above)
Solution: None was reached. We proposed to dial it down the power level, but the customer refused and requested more power.
We wanted to turn down the power level to make the car safer and to avoid the clutch slippage. On the contrary, the customer wants to even more power :(
Issue 4: Clutch Slipping on the BT Tune by not on the RPM Tune Our take: The RPM tune is making almost 60 wheel torque LESS than the BT tune; so the clutch should hold up. Solution: The power and torque level is lower on the Stage-1 Tune; there has been no other reported clutch slippage from our current customers. BT Tune is making almost 60 extra WTQ; so that's probably causing the clutch slippage.
Issue 5: Car feels jerky and throttle feels ON/OFF Our take: This might be related to Concern #2 above. Unable to corroborate. Solution: Our customers are reporting smooth throttle response and that their cars are smoother than OEM.
Issue 6: Threw a rod through the block Our take: Related to Concern #3 above. The ECU wrote a check that the engine couldn't cash. We wanted to turn down the power level but customer refused (see Issue #3 above). Solution/Response: We now have set torque targets for 91 octane and 93 octane. They are tailored to the customer's vehicle based on their tuning checklist. And we recommend Shell V-power fuel over Chevron or Costco. If you use Arco gas, do not buy a tune from us.
Issue 7: Car is not consistent on some pulls.
Our take: The key to making good power are Octane and cooler Charged Air! Doing exhaust side upgrades will yield some HP gains, but for consistent power, one should focus on upgrading the intercooler. Airtec is one that we highly recommend. Solution: In order to get the Stage 2 tune, one must have a quality upgraded intercooler (not the eBay knock offs).
Yes, hindsight is indeed 20/20. John's efforts and testing has provided us with some insight and data for the F56 platform. Had his setup been more stock, we think the results would have been much more valuable and favorable. We all have our own viewpoints and we can agree to disagree. As one of the Tuners here on NAM, we have not been shy with sharing our testing results and findings and we encourage other F56 tuners to share their results as well (of course, we have to keep some of our IP and not share everything).
John is a cool guy who wants what's best for his car and we wish him the best. Motor On!
John is truly a super MINI fan and the F56 is his 3rd or 4th MINI. When he approached us in July 2017 wanting to be a Beta Tester for the F56 tuning, we really had our reservations. Our concerns were three folds:
Concern #1 = He came across as a "power freak", meaning he wants his MINI to make power 'safely' (which is a slippery slope).
Concern #2 =His F56 Manual was stock with two unusual mods (full 3" intake system & Custom 4" to 3" Turboback exhaust system).
Concern #3 = Poor 91 octane California gas (and Sacramento heat).
He knows quite about cars and is a gear head, but does not have a thorough understanding of the F56 platform.
Since our shop JCW is an automatic and John has a manual; we reluctantly agreed to have him be a Beta Tester for us. We went over the above concerns and he was willing to work with us. With the OBD2 flashing module, we can make necessary changes to his tune based on data logs from his car using the Bluetooth device. He is a seasoned car enthusiast so he can provide us with user feedback in addition to the data logs.
Below, we will go over the "issues" that have been brought up in John's post and provide our take, as well as our solution (or pending solution).
Issue 1: Torque dropping off sharply after 5k RPM. Our take: We couldn't tell if that was cause by the tuning or was it a byproduct of the oversize intake or exhaust system (see Concern #2 above). The over-sized 3" down pipe could have been too big for the turbo; turbo losing back pressure at the higher RPMs. Solution (pending solution): We only test on our own cars and stop using Beta testers or setup that is a "one off" - unless this one off item is about to be mass produced. We have turned away quite a few customers who have one off upgraded parts (mainly turbo upgrades) from buying our tune
We just tuned this 2017 JCW Auto yesterday with the Stage-1 Flash and it does not have that drastic dip. 2017 JCW Auto with Cravenspeed CAI & BT Stage-1 Tune
Issue 2: Boost Spike to 21PSI Our take: This was due to the "over boost" function in the mapping. Solution (pending solution): We have since disabled this feature in our tune to keep the boost level consistent.
Issue 3: "I felt the car was being pushed to hard" Our take: We felt the same way; the octane level is too low to safely keep this power level.(see Concern #3 above)
Solution: None was reached. We proposed to dial it down the power level, but the customer refused and requested more power.
We wanted to turn down the power level to make the car safer and to avoid the clutch slippage. On the contrary, the customer wants to even more power :(
Issue 4: Clutch Slipping on the BT Tune by not on the RPM Tune Our take: The RPM tune is making almost 60 wheel torque LESS than the BT tune; so the clutch should hold up. Solution: The power and torque level is lower on the Stage-1 Tune; there has been no other reported clutch slippage from our current customers. BT Tune is making almost 60 extra WTQ; so that's probably causing the clutch slippage.
Issue 5: Car feels jerky and throttle feels ON/OFF Our take: This might be related to Concern #2 above. Unable to corroborate. Solution: Our customers are reporting smooth throttle response and that their cars are smoother than OEM.
Issue 6: Threw a rod through the block Our take: Related to Concern #3 above. The ECU wrote a check that the engine couldn't cash. We wanted to turn down the power level but customer refused (see Issue #3 above). Solution/Response: We now have set torque targets for 91 octane and 93 octane. They are tailored to the customer's vehicle based on their tuning checklist. And we recommend Shell V-power fuel over Chevron or Costco. If you use Arco gas, do not buy a tune from us.
Issue 7: Car is not consistent on some pulls. Our take: The key to making good power are Octane and cooler Charged Air! Doing exhaust side upgrades will yield some HP gains, but for consistent power, one should focus on upgrading the intercooler. Airtec is one that we highly recommend. Solution: In order to get the Stage 2 tune, one must have a quality upgraded intercooler (not the eBay knock offs).
Yes, hindsight is indeed 20/20. John's efforts and testing has provided us with some insight and data for the F56 platform. Had his setup been more stock, we think the results would have been much more valuable and favorable. We all have our own viewpoints and we can agree to disagree. As one of the Tuners here on NAM, we have not been shy with sharing our testing results and findings and we encourage other F56 tuners to share their results as well (of course, we have to keep some of our IP and not share everything).
John is a cool guy who wants what's best for his car and we wish him the best. Motor On!
Thanks for the post! I do appreciate the time we had together and the information stated here. I know it was catastrophic but it is all part of “beta testing”. It’s risky on both sides. Honestly, I do not regret it one bit! We learned a ton about this car!!
Your tune still reigns my car a destroyer of other cars I raced!
I think Stage 2 requires upgraded internals and of course better cooling. No idea how expensive it would be to build the 3rd gen engine with forged parts.
Good news! We can now offer direct shipment of Airtec intercooler to your door. Just send us an email (info@bytetronik.com) with your needs and we'll get the order filled.
From time of payment to order delivery is approximately 5 to 6 working days.
Get ready for the Summer with a Bytetronik Stage1 Flash... Running the $750 Special (Stage1 flash with the OBD2 Flashing module).
Stage1 Flash ONLY = $550 (if you want to send in your ECU and save on purchasing the OBD2 module); or if you want to drive down to our facility in Austin to get it flashed in person.
Upgraded NGK One-step colder plugs are required for our Stage1 Flash.
Proven power and torque gains... many happy customers here on NAM!
This is the software/hardware combo that gave us issues in the past; we call it the PITA Version. If you don't have version, then you would have no issues with the OBD2 Flashing/Programming:
This is the software/hardware combo that gave us issues in the past; we call it the PITA Version. If you don't have version, then you would have no issues with the OBD2 Flashing/Programming:
HWEL : 000011D9_002_019_007
BTLD : 0000208C_002_059_005
SWFL1 : 0000360A_109_030_001
I was thinking of ordering your tune for my 2015 F55 with auto sport transmission (paddle shifter). How can I tell what code it has? Do I need to go the dealership? I'd hate to order a tune and have it not be able to load on my car and maybe frap out my ECU.
I was thinking of ordering your tune for my 2015 F55 with auto sport transmission (paddle shifter). How can I tell what code it has? Do I need to go the dealership? I'd hate to order a tune and have it not be able to load on my car and maybe frap out my ECU.
Thank you,
Jason
You would need a specialize tool to query the ECU and find out what hardware and software versions are on your car.. Option 2 would be to send us your ECU and have us bench flash it for $550 (save $200 and not have to get the OBD2 device)... just another option.
Bench flash NOW available for later 2018 & 2019 models
For those customers with 2018 and later models F56, we now have the capability to back up and unlock your ECU without opening it; we just need to have it on the bench and can perform the unlocking through the pins on the ECU.
Bench flash NOW available for later 2018 & 2019 models
