Doesn't anyone like mb quart or the like offer drop in replacemnt speakers for the hk upgrade sound system. While i'm sure the speakers are ok, they can't be the best quality or most efficient.

 

Then why did you get the HK in the first place?

 

You might check out the other thread on audio about "what is the best amp"
We discussed different amps and one MCO member- Pooky13 kept the HK speakers/head unit and added two amps and a sub. So Pooky13 can comment on how good the HK speakers can be if given enough power and the help of a subwoofer. The sound is quite good.

As for the HK speakers, they are well matched to the Amp and DSP for the HK system. I would recommend leaving the HK alone and adjusting the settings for awhile. Discuss with Pooky13 about your options. I would not suggest changing speakers as a first choice.

We are doing some technical work on checking the HK speakers and will post info when we get it all done.
So far you should consider the HK speakers to be fairly good and efficient. Maybe not the very best but good enough for decent sound.
If I had to choose a weak point it might be the amp/DSP.

 

Yes, thank you (found the other post on replacement speakers as well). Maybe the best start would be to dynamat the front and rear areas very well.

 

>>Yes, thank you (found the other post on replacement speakers as well). Maybe the best start would be to dynamat the front and rear areas very well.

I believe the MB Quarts are fine speakers, but another favorite brand of mine is the Infinity Kappas (reasonably priced) or the more expensive Allumapro speakers. But since you already have the HKs, I would stick to those and add a sub and a muti-channel amp to power everything. Don't use the HK amp unless it's for the tweeters only.

The dynamat material is on flooring, side door panels and rear side panels as well. So far the sound in my MCS is exceptional. If I were to replace my speakers in the future, I would replace my head unit and go with the speakers I've just mentioned. Good luck!

 

The spec's published on the MBQuarts suggest to me that they are of poorer quality than the speakers that come with the BASE audio system. I've tested the speakers from the base audio system, and run some simulations with the data from the MBQuart speakers, and they have some serious deficiencies. Namely, their efficiency is 4 dB lower than the stock speaker. This means you'll need more than double the amplifier power to play at the same level. Their fundamental resonance is higher, double that of the stock speaker. This translates into much less bass and mid-bass output than the stock speaker. At 50 Hz, the MB Quart would require 16 x the amplifier power to keep up with stock, assuming it didn't burn up. Finally, in my opinion, their crossover point is too low for a 2-way speaker, in the confiuration used in the MINI (woofer low, tweeter high). The HK uses a mid/tweet in the high location to remedy this, somewhat. Now that my MINI is here, I'll be testing the HK speakers soon, and providing data, to those interested, on performance parameters to look for in replacements.

Keep in mind that the HK system has custom filtering and EQ specific to its interior acoustics and speaker drivers. This doesn't rule out speaker upgrades, but you need to consider carefully what you are changing and what the system impact will be.

 

Tacotim,

Thanks for your post. I had sent Tacotim a full set of stock MINI speakers to test. He is comparing them to the specs from MB Quarts ( I think Discus line DSD 213 (front) and DKC 169 (rear)). MB Quarts make much better levels of speakers as Discus is the basic stuff,while Reference line and Q-Line are much better but also cost much more and might have trouble fitting as nicely in the MINI door.

Leaving the HK speakers for now is not unreasonable. To me, they are not average speakers that can be pulled and replaced. They are matched to the amp/DSP in the HK system. Yet, they are versatile enough to keep if you replace the amp (or get two amps) and add a sub like Pooky13 did. Results can be good. Later if you want you can replace the speakers.

Other good choices for speakers besides the infinity Kappas might be Focals 6.25" or even 7" (or Bostons) with special adapter/spacers so they can fit in the doors. No real need to use anything but 6x9 in the rears and doesn't really need to be the best unless you plan to sit back there all the time. Put the better speakers in the fronts.

Looking forward to the testing of the HK speakers and system.

Tacotim-
Good to hear from you and that you finally got your MCS. Keep us informed and thanks.

 

The rear 6x9s in the HK are very sensitive (low impedance, so lots of output for a little voltage input), AND have high excursion. It's this sensitivity and excursion that add up to bass producing capability. Each speaker is a dual voice coil speaker, with 2 Ohm (I think) impedance per coil. This means that th HK amp (8.5 VRMS) amp is able to deliver about 70-80 Watts continuously, or 140-160 watts peak into each of these speakers.

If you replace these with a common 4 ohm speaker, you'll only be able to connect half of the amplifier channels. In additionbecause the connected channel is connected to a 4 ohm, instead of 2 ohm speaker it will be delivering only 15-20 Watts, instead of 70-80 continuously, into each speaker. Delivering 1/4 the power means 1/4 the bass (and overall output).

It may not sound like much of the bass is coming from the rear, because the crossovers, etc., were chosen to establish a front sound-stage, but if you're not careful a speaker swap in the rear can have a detrimental effect.

As far as excursion, I haven't had the speakers out for testing, yet, but I expect that the excursion is among the better aftermarket drivers, somewhere between 5 and 10 mm.

I'm not familiar with all the aftermarket offerings, but you may find it difficult to find a full-range driver, with dual 2 ohm voice-coils (for good sensitivity), and 5-10 mm xmax. If you're unable to find such a driver, you need to expect to choose to compromise one aspect of performance for another, like trading better high frequencies for less output overall and a lot less bass.

I haven't yet had the MINI in the lab for measurements of the sound system, but my ears have led me to the following settings:

Bass: -2 clicks
Treble: Detent
Fade: Forward 1 click
Balance: Left 2 clicks
Effects: MINI h/k
Driver: ON

Speed Vol doesn't seem to work on my car, but I do notice, on some music and especially pop FM, the bass can sound a little boomy. I think this is 60-80 Hz, primarily, and lesser accentuation to 150 Hz, as voices can sound boomy. With the volume relatively loud, I think the bass is much better. I think it has more to do with the radio loudness compensation being a little to agressive (accentuating bass faster than hearing percieves the lack of bass due to overall level), though the system does sound a little bass-weak at 40 mph, on nice roads, with the windows down. Perhaps the boomy bass, that is a common complaint, is HKs best compromise assuming MINI owners will be driving around with their windows open???

 

i've been thinking about this a lot, and overall i'm quite satisfied with the HK system but agree that depending on the material being played, it can be a bit boomy around 80hz. This is especially true with deep voices on podcasts / talk radio. I don't like turning bass down too much (about -2) because then the bass starts to get weak.

I'm wondering if adding dynamat or some other sound absorption material would lower the resonance frequency (putting the 6x9's in an "effectively" larger volume)?

Has anyone had luck in this approach?

btw, did you ever get some detailed measurements?

 

Wow, holy thread revival!

At any rate, there are lots of discussion about the H/K settings. There is a blog entry somewhere that goes into some detail. it concluded (and I agree) that fading forward some (I think I am usually 3 levels forward) in addition to a slight reduction in Bass level helps with the boominess. One thing to make sure of is to never set either the bass or treble above flat or the H/K amp will reduce the max volume as a speaker protection measure.

 

Sorry to revive an ancient thread, again. Hopefully TacoTim is still around, or someone else could chime in.

I have an 05 MCS with the H/K stereo. One of our front door woofers has been water damaged and needs replaced. In the spirit of cost, I'm looking to just replace the woofer (I'd like to do both doors for cohesiveness), but I cannot find any confirmation on what impedance the front woofers are. Does anyone know if the tweeter/mid and woofer are summed together to the H/K amp, or are they on separate channels?

I can be persuaded to go either a coaxial in the bottom of the door, or straight mid bass driver if it's a 2-ohm factory woofer. I also am not opposed to buying a complete component set, but would need direction on wiring the sets crossovers from the H/K amp, or skipping it altogether and allowing the H/K amp to handle that.

I'll eventually replace everything, radio, amp, speakers etc, but for now I'm OK to spend a minimal amount to get the sound back up and going.

Sorry for the rambling thoughts!

 

Each speaker is on a separate channel with no crossover (electronic crossovers in the HK amp). 2 ohm impedance. The HK amp also applies equalization to each speaker for frequency response correction. If you install an aftermarket speaker, the sound will be somewhat off but might be acceptable.

 

Do you know what the range is that's sent to the woofer? It may only make sense then to go with a mid-bass driver rather than a coax that won't be utilized.