Drivetrain what is the optimum WHP and TQ
The point is that you missed the point. There is no bad mouthing going on. I am merely stating that if the tune was good they would show a dyno graph instead of a saying a number that it made. Anyone that understands what they are looking at would know the tune of the car. Many on NAM don't understand what a good tune is. Any vendor selling parts that work and are safe will show the dyno graph to show what is really going on in the car. That's what these boards are for, showing what works and what doesn't. You are clearly taking what is said over what is seen.
Bill
Bill
things take a lot more time than I am used to but the are progressing..... the lack of dyno graphs will be rectified when my car goes for tuning the week of the 16th......
with limited resources every turn takes more time.... ex waiting 1 month for the Milltek header....... experimenting with different headers..... waiting 3 weeks for Josh from Unichip to come to town to help with he tune.... discovering the injector issue... waiting a few days for the new injectors.... waiting a week to get on the schedule at the Unichip tuner in Atlanta on and on and on.......
with money and facilities and an unlimited talent pool at your disposal this could be doen in a week or two.......
the lack of dyno graphs is because it is not done and it is pretty silly to show some one a picture of their birhday cake when it is still batter... the cake is almost done......
I just swapped my 17% for a 15% - I could feel little to no difference in power down low, up top though, the car definitely feels stronger. When I get my new wideband in this week, I am hoping to get back to the dyno and see where I am sitting. I have a feeling I am going to pick up a few ponies, and hope to see my a/f mix look a little better than where it has been.
If anything, what I did notice going from the 17% down to the 15% is that the car's power feels much more linear - with the 17% it felt like I was getting a huge jolt of power around 5K (suprisingly where the car goes rich) wheras now it just progressively makes more power. It drives much smoother than before.
Personally, I do believe DMH and Randy Webb are right. But what you guys should keep in mind is that there is no "right or wrong answer" for everyone. While some people love their 19% to death, its probably not for everyone, especially those who are seeing track time. For those who never go to the track, live in somewhat cool climates its probably the ticket for cheap power. Again, whatever works for you is good.
If you are looking at it from a science/engineering perspective if you run a larger pulley, you are making more power up top by keeping from heating the air as bad, which keeps the IAT's down and in turn keeps the ecu from pulling as much timing. The smaller pulleys though have the opposite effect. Some people also tend to forget that the s/c pulley spins the water pump. Overspin it, causing cavitation and water temps go up. All this heat can't be helping you...Keep in mind when the ECU retards the timing, it runs even hotter costing you more power and possibly, if heated enough, pistons.
Again, YMMV so take it with a grain of salt. Just sharing experiences I have gone through and information I have picked up along the way.
If anything, what I did notice going from the 17% down to the 15% is that the car's power feels much more linear - with the 17% it felt like I was getting a huge jolt of power around 5K (suprisingly where the car goes rich) wheras now it just progressively makes more power. It drives much smoother than before.
Personally, I do believe DMH and Randy Webb are right. But what you guys should keep in mind is that there is no "right or wrong answer" for everyone. While some people love their 19% to death, its probably not for everyone, especially those who are seeing track time. For those who never go to the track, live in somewhat cool climates its probably the ticket for cheap power. Again, whatever works for you is good.
If you are looking at it from a science/engineering perspective if you run a larger pulley, you are making more power up top by keeping from heating the air as bad, which keeps the IAT's down and in turn keeps the ecu from pulling as much timing. The smaller pulleys though have the opposite effect. Some people also tend to forget that the s/c pulley spins the water pump. Overspin it, causing cavitation and water temps go up. All this heat can't be helping you...Keep in mind when the ECU retards the timing, it runs even hotter costing you more power and possibly, if heated enough, pistons.
Again, YMMV so take it with a grain of salt. Just sharing experiences I have gone through and information I have picked up along the way.
This is OT and really should be on the 62 thread but the tune is not optimum...... but still is pretty good..... getting DDM set up as a Unichip dealer and tuner took a few months.... this saves us a lot of money......
things take a lot more time than I am used to but the are progressing..... the lack of dyno graphs will be rectified when my car goes for tuning the week of the 16th......
with limited resources every turn takes more time.... ex waiting 1 month for the Milltek header....... experimenting with different headers..... waiting 3 weeks for Josh from Unichip to come to town to help with he tune.... discovering the injector issue... waiting a few days for the new injectors.... waiting a week to get on the schedule at the Unichip tuner in Atlanta on and on and on.......
with money and facilities and an unlimited talent pool at your disposal this could be doen in a week or two.......
the lack of dyno graphs is because it is not done and it is pretty silly to show some one a picture of their birhday cake when it is still batter... the cake is almost done......
things take a lot more time than I am used to but the are progressing..... the lack of dyno graphs will be rectified when my car goes for tuning the week of the 16th......
with limited resources every turn takes more time.... ex waiting 1 month for the Milltek header....... experimenting with different headers..... waiting 3 weeks for Josh from Unichip to come to town to help with he tune.... discovering the injector issue... waiting a few days for the new injectors.... waiting a week to get on the schedule at the Unichip tuner in Atlanta on and on and on.......
with money and facilities and an unlimited talent pool at your disposal this could be doen in a week or two.......
the lack of dyno graphs is because it is not done and it is pretty silly to show some one a picture of their birhday cake when it is still batter... the cake is almost done......
great anology and a perfect explination of why there aren't any dynos of it yet? has anyone posted pics of this setup?
whoops sorry... i post on so many threads... and everytime i see your name i always think i am on the m62 thread... i was asking if you had any pics of the m62 set up...
I think that once the kit is officially released.... which should be very soon.... (ave said he was very happy with the latest improvements and is finallly happy with the kit ......)
Pictures of some kind will probably be posted.....
I just swapped my 17% for a 15% - I could feel little to no difference in power down low, up top though, the car definitely feels stronger. When I get my new wideband in this week, I am hoping to get back to the dyno and see where I am sitting. I have a feeling I am going to pick up a few ponies, and hope to see my a/f mix look a little better than where it has been.
If anything, what I did notice going from the 17% down to the 15% is that the car's power feels much more linear - with the 17% it felt like I was getting a huge jolt of power around 5K (suprisingly where the car goes rich) wheras now it just progressively makes more power. It drives much smoother than before.
Personally, I do believe DMH and Randy Webb are right. But what you guys should keep in mind is that there is no "right or wrong answer" for everyone. While some people love their 19% to death, its probably not for everyone, especially those who are seeing track time. For those who never go to the track, live in somewhat cool climates its probably the ticket for cheap power. Again, whatever works for you is good.
If you are looking at it from a science/engineering perspective if you run a larger pulley, you are making more power up top by keeping from heating the air as bad, which keeps the IAT's down and in turn keeps the ecu from pulling as much timing. The smaller pulleys though have the opposite effect. Some people also tend to forget that the s/c pulley spins the water pump. Overspin it, causing cavitation and water temps go up. All this heat can't be helping you...Keep in mind when the ECU retards the timing, it runs even hotter costing you more power and possibly, if heated enough, pistons.
Again, YMMV so take it with a grain of salt. Just sharing experiences I have gone through and information I have picked up along the way.
If anything, what I did notice going from the 17% down to the 15% is that the car's power feels much more linear - with the 17% it felt like I was getting a huge jolt of power around 5K (suprisingly where the car goes rich) wheras now it just progressively makes more power. It drives much smoother than before.
Personally, I do believe DMH and Randy Webb are right. But what you guys should keep in mind is that there is no "right or wrong answer" for everyone. While some people love their 19% to death, its probably not for everyone, especially those who are seeing track time. For those who never go to the track, live in somewhat cool climates its probably the ticket for cheap power. Again, whatever works for you is good.
If you are looking at it from a science/engineering perspective if you run a larger pulley, you are making more power up top by keeping from heating the air as bad, which keeps the IAT's down and in turn keeps the ecu from pulling as much timing. The smaller pulleys though have the opposite effect. Some people also tend to forget that the s/c pulley spins the water pump. Overspin it, causing cavitation and water temps go up. All this heat can't be helping you...Keep in mind when the ECU retards the timing, it runs even hotter costing you more power and possibly, if heated enough, pistons.
Again, YMMV so take it with a grain of salt. Just sharing experiences I have gone through and information I have picked up along the way.
The 15% pulley works just fine, but to help out the ecu i put in an adjustable camshaft spocket. It adjust up to 3' degrees. It makes a differents, it can be set up for low or high rpms and help the ecu i timing.
Here is a link that might help http://www.wighat.com/fcr3/timing.htm
There is a ton more when you are looking for specific criteria ( learn as you go ). If you buy an adjustable cam gear there will be no need for offset keys, the old way, for the OE piece. The beauty of the adjustable gear is you can try many combonations untill the desired result is found ( it could be many ). Depending on the cam timing the ign will follow what the ECU sees, AF, EGT.........
The gear set up is the only time consuming part, as you need to find exact TDC ( not dificult ). Once this step is done it's one of those mods that's easy to get addicted to.
This discussion could be a new thread.
There is a ton more when you are looking for specific criteria ( learn as you go ). If you buy an adjustable cam gear there will be no need for offset keys, the old way, for the OE piece. The beauty of the adjustable gear is you can try many combonations untill the desired result is found ( it could be many ). Depending on the cam timing the ign will follow what the ECU sees, AF, EGT.........
The gear set up is the only time consuming part, as you need to find exact TDC ( not dificult ). Once this step is done it's one of those mods that's easy to get addicted to.
This discussion could be a new thread.
I got mine from GT tuning. com in the UK. they have several trick items. Take a look at the tensioner. There not the fastest place but they get it done. I think it real works well. It let's me help the ecu to change the power curve to low end or high.There is a deffinite differents. My car has more pull at the top from around 4000 rpm and up.
200 WHP seems about right for the mini.. It's not my objective to out-class the chassis and brakes. Besides.. it's FWD and it has it limitations. I prefer a "balanced" ride that is reliable with good everyday driveability.
I added a 15% pulley, JCW intake and Milltek exhaust. I'm done with power mods.. I will do a software upgrade to tie things together...
I added a 15% pulley, JCW intake and Milltek exhaust. I'm done with power mods.. I will do a software upgrade to tie things together...
I have done both..... when you are tracking and the car is constantly at the top of its rpm range the 19% overdrives/redlines the M45 to the point where heat robs the engine of power.... in this case the 15% is a better choice...allegedly
on the street and in the twisties where you are not close to red line all the time I found that the 19% gave me more tq down low and was a blast to drive.......I also threw 2 belts at very bad times..... if I was to go back to an M45 I would 15,16% just because I don't want to wait for the flatbed for 3 hrs again with my GF in the car
on the street and in the twisties where you are not close to red line all the time I found that the 19% gave me more tq down low and was a blast to drive.......I also threw 2 belts at very bad times..... if I was to go back to an M45 I would 15,16% just because I don't want to wait for the flatbed for 3 hrs again with my GF in the car
If you remove your fender liner and keep a belt tensioner tool and a long small screw driver and of course an extra belt you won't have to wait for the tow truck. Just turn the wheel to the right and viola. Plenty of room to work. Unless of course you don't like getting your hands dirty.
No problem. I went threw a belt every two weeks after snapping the first one. I was running a 19% supercharger pulley and a 4% crank. So when the belt snapped it bent the crank pulley and I didn't notice this. So it deffinately sped up the wear process.
The factory pulley seems to be much more durable to contact from the tensioner.
The factory pulley seems to be much more durable to contact from the tensioner.
Last edited by spillman; Jan 9, 2007 at 05:20 AM. Reason: Can't spell
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