Well its done, just like they said it would. I just got home and found out my DSL is down, so I'm typing on my cell phone. I picked up the car and for the first three hours I couldnt really tell the difference because of heavy traffic and my girlfriend didnt want to hear the exhaust..
But once traffic was clear and dropped her off and a quick kiss goodnight, I let my foot smash the pedal. WoW!!!! There is a major difference and the cars pulls hard all the way to redline. I raced my buddy in his BMW M Coupe and we were pretty much even. I used to be 5 car lengths behind him. He was impressed as well with the work of Fireballed Racing.
My pre dyno was 167whp and 4 daysl later my car is now 208whp. 41whp gain!!!!. I'm not sure what my next mod will be but I'm sure it will be with the FBT guys. My only mistake of the day was riding shotgun with Brian in a Twin-Charged Mini, now my thoughts are on a TURBO! This is truely a sickness.
Thank you to everyone at FBT for a great job and keeping their promise of only keeping my daily driver for only 5 days.
Mario

 

Wow. Well I guess I know where my money is going to go.

Brian, when you write that the car is "untuned" you mean that it still has the same map that you put in before the header, head and cam were installed? Or is it flashed back to stock for some reason?

Also, Mario, noticed any ping, knock or timing retard?

Thanks, Mario. Thanks, Fireballed.

By the way, Brian, speaking of money, how much of mine do I have to give up for a Fireballed head and (Schrick?) cam, installed, with tune? (I have a 15% pulley, not a 17%. Would you recommend a 2% crank pulley and 380 (or 400?) injectors to go with it?).

 

Mario, any idea of the gain in torque? If you can post a dyno sheet, I think there will probably be at least a thousand views! Congrats!

 

Congrats, and great work by FBT.

Although, I must be honest with you, 167whp with 17%, Header, Exhaust and FBT software is a little low if you ask me, and I would not be surprised if that was not a correct dyno pull. (But even if 177whp was your base, ending up with 208 is an excellent outcome) As for the 208, I don't doubt that one bit. Gj guys.

 

How much for the head package? I looked on the web page, but didn't see anything, yet...

Also, does this have to be done at your shop in CA? I live in Indiana, so this might not be for me....

 

Don't worry Mike, we got your back!

 

41whp over your baseline is awesome, a testment that those doodes know what they wered doing. I am happy for anyone who can break that dam 200whp barrier.

I would love to see your dyno sheets so we can see how the car makes is power and what the torque curve looks like.

 

here was ours before our 7500rpm limiter and evo tech and also before our header...

so it is completly possible... we actually did 224 with the header and 7500 limiter but i can't find the file to upload the image...

 

since these engines don't really stop breathing or float valves up to at least 7500, simply running the dyno session to 7500 compared to 6800 can show a 10hp gain; even more if the head/exhaust is a heavy breather. Though it requires a chip mod to do it, I wouldn't call changing the rev limit a "tune"

 

whoops, don't confuse my dyno sheet with Marios... i don't know if you are or not... but i just want to make it clear that that IS NOT MARIOS dyno!

 

Well I'm sure you can get a head from them and have it shipped to you or Chad from Detroit Tuned also said that he could get one for me. The software/tune would be the only thing. You can get the head here I'm sure, but if you want FBT's software I dunno. I'll be placing a request/order for the head around Christmas and will more than likely be getting an M62 when they are released. The only thing my car doesn't have on it is a header, but I am recieving that(Larini) for Christmas, so with the right ecu tune and a head I'll pushin some whp. I'm already having front tire wear issues right now...

Mikey

 

I'm not sure what "untuned" means. My car already had the FBT software about 3 weeks ago so maybe it was good enough for the Head and Cam no to be adjusted. Maybe there is more HP to be made, but I do need the car to be reliable.

So far there is no Ping or Knocking. I know they put 380 injectors and colder plugs. I have a feeling Zero timming was pulled since the car is running on the same software download I got a few weeks ago.

So far today I have had four other people drive my car, one who owns their own Mini Shop. All of them were amazed of the power increase and how much fun the car is. Most everyone finds it funny how much I have put into this car in a months time.

Tonight I started Dynomating the rear of the car to quite down some of the exhaust notes. I love the sound of the car, people say it has a F1 or an old Ferrai sound, but it is a bit loud for the my lady. If someone wants to trade a quieter exhaust for my Magnaflow with custom 3.5 dual tip, I'm open. The Magnaflow was perfect with the CAI, Header and 17% pulley, but now with the Head/cam it does seem a bit too loud for a daily driver that I do work calls in.
M

 

hahaha i can't wait for this head and larini header lol, did it sound like that before? Everyone says my car is loud now... but i think they're full of crap.

 

It was fine before and lound under load, now it is very loud but in a good way. There is even a pulse when the car is just idling because of the extra flow and the larger cam.

 

You might try this, when I was running a Magnaflow it was a little loud on long trips, so I had an extra 30" Magnaflow bullet resonator added just before the "T" in rear.

This put some stealth back in the sound and didn't seem to cause any power loss, Cost about $60 installed at a local muffler shop.

Still sounded good, but not as good as my present M7 exhaust system.

Bill

 

*manly grunt* hahaha that's sick as hell im ordering one

 

the F1/ferrari sound was that there before the head?

 

Mario,

What are your impressions of just the larini header? Did you feel much of a gain?

 

The look, fitment and sound are the best! As far as hp gains it would be hard to judge with out a dyno. I would guess maybe 5 whp or close to. I would guess the real gains are from tunning, Head/Cam and or M62 swap. The Larini has one 200 cell cat instead of the two 400 cell cats that come stock. Victor at MiniWorks gave me a good deal and installed it in about an our. It was hard to say "no" when the header looked so good and it could be installed by the time I got back from eating a burritto.
I will be in town the 7th, 8th, and 9th or Nov, we should meet up with Mike and who ever else. Maybe you can help me, yesterday my DSC, ABS and TPS lights all came on at the same time. Do you have any idea what this is caused from? I have done the battery thing and had an OBDII scanner reader and it say "there is no codes".
M

 

Mario,

Nest time you are in town, we will try a larini cat back with the extra larini resonator, this might be a great combo to quiet in down just a bit.
Glad you are having fun, hope to see you soon
Cheers

Victor

 

awesome thanks mario!

Give me a call or PM when you are back out here!

 

" Although, I must be honest with you, 167whp with 17%, Header, Exhaust and FBT software is a little low if you ask me,"

I agree with you . Those mods should be good for the mid 180's without ecu tuning but you say the FBT tune was inplace at this time? That bares looking into.

 

If you haven't already, check out the "Heads" thread that SpiderX started, you'll see that matching header flanges and gaskets to head exhaust ports is critical to maximizing power from ANY header (including the OEM header). Installing an aftermarket header without a head exhaust port job will only yield optimum horsepower if it is matched. If you plan to only bolt on a header, then at least you should make certain that the installer matches it to the existing head, or you will probably be disappointed with the result. No disrespect to the guys who manufactured, sold and installed the header, but this may be why the Larini addition was only a few HP improvement prior to Fireballed integrating it with their worked head. (I am speculating, of course.) It wouldn't make any sense to go to the time and expense of matching the header flange o the exxisting head ports, knowing that the head was going to be reworked or replaced in a couple of days.

I've decided that when I get a header, I will also get at least an exhaust port job on the head -- if not a fully worked head -- at the same time. I think Mariokart did the right thing getting his mods all done close together and finally integrated by a shop of some renown (Fireballed). I am assuming here that Fireballed DID match the header and exhaust ports as part of Mariokart's head installation.

I think that all of the really good shops, Detroit Tuned, WMS, Fireballed, Precision, Madness -- and many others all over the nation -- probably know how to make our engines scream, given the chance to properly integrate the OEM and aftermarket parts and components into a whole system. That means taking care with port matching and using many other well-known (among "pros") engine rebuilding techniques that a lot of DIY jobs may overlook or just not have the tools or know-how to do (or do correctly). I think that is why so many MINI owners may have installed relatively expensive headers and gotten disappointing results -- at least until they get into the head, which has usually come later on.

While I think there are some items that can just be simply "bolted on" in separate operations to yield power and/or torque gains that offer exceptional or at least "fair" "bang for the buck" (SC pulley, intakes, some IC work or IC substitutions, for example) I do NOT think that the addition of a header is one of them.

My conclusion from reading the "header" and "head" threads here on NAM is as follows so far:
> If one is NOT planning on eventually having head work done, but one wants some extra power from exhaust improvements, then I believe that the optimum way to get bang for the buck, is to "blueprint" the OEM header and gasket (and maybe remove the "guts" of the pre-cat, depending on one's climate and local smog laws) and get a "one-ball" job done on the catback system.
> If one IS planning to eventually do head work, then a more free-flowing (read 2.5" diameter pipe) aftermarket catback system investment is worthwhile, followed -- minimally -- by a head exhaust port job, and an aftermarket header CAREFULLY MATCHED TO THE REWORKED EXHAUST PORTS. Otherwise, I think one is pretty much wasting money on an aftermarket header.

As for myself, after waiting a long time to take the "next" modding step, I have finally decided to go the route of an OBX header, ceramic coated and wrapped, with a good aftermarket cat welded in to match with my existing Milltek catback on the output side and a good head, valve enlargement? and (mild?) cam job on the other side. Since Fireballed is the closest "renowned" tuner to me, that is where I plan to go to have the head and the integration work done, as well as an ECU tune following the install. I am going for mid-range improvements above all else, so I am also thinking of going to a +2% lightened crank pulley to spin the revs up faster from 0-5000, and definitely 380cc injectors. I'd LIKE to get hold of a Dinan fuel supply/regulator system to go with it, but that is another story. Anyway, I'm gonna shop to see how it will be least expensive to get all the components I will need and buy accordingly, but I willl have ONE INTEGRATOR help me plan it all out and do the assembly at the same time, once I have everything I need.

If for whatever reason, I cannot get Fireballed to do this (who knows what kind of stuff can happen in this business) my next alternative would be to ask another well-known tuner such as WMS or DT or Precision to prepare BOTH the OBX header and their favorite source/method reworked head together for me (matched at the exhaust port) and ship them to me unassembled for a local installer (maybe Steve?) to put together here (in SoCal) on the car.

I'm only building a street machine, but I want to have a car that works really well AND for which I feel I've spent my $$ to good effect.

What I know for sure is that I'm NOT going to order a header from one source, a head from another, a cam from still another, and so on, and then try to put them together myself. I know I would botch the job and be really disappointed with the results (unless I got REALLY lucky).

I'm going to call Fireballed this week and make an appointment to see them about this plan.

Thanks to all you guys for this thread (especially to Mariokart for being the "guinea pig" on the Fireballed head).

 

aside from the novice doing work for the first time, any "reputable" shop would be performing a hack job if they didn't address port/gasket/manifold matching when assembling, whether it was their headwork or not, wheter the head was stock or not.

 

I am going to try to answer the last few posts.

As the importer of the Larini exhausts and Larini header, and also the installer of Mario's header, I feel that I need to clarify a few points.

As Mario said in one of his post, the header install was done in one hour, that's it, what we call bolt on.

What you guys are talking about would take 10+ hours.

Why the hell would someone want to remove the head, just to match the header ports, for what? to gain 1 HP

I have built my share of racing heads, including many 1275 0ld mini racers, the work involved (skimming the head, reworking the combustion chamber, indexing the plugs, porting the intake and exhaust ports, shortening the valve guides, installing larger valves, flowing the head, installing titanium retainers and dual springs, ......) Each head would take 10 to 20 Hours.

But were de we stop,
there is only a handfull of customers that will pay for this kind of work.

Also remember, installing a Larini header does not completely void your warranty, now as soon as you touch the internals of the engine, including messing with the ports, or installing a ported head, that's it.

In regards to dyno numbers, or increase of performance with a Larini header or any other header out there, our goal is to improve the exhaust flow, and as a result increase both hp and torque.

The dyno results are only good for the specific car that was tested.
Any other car, in any other location, in any other type of dyno might have different results.

And to finish,
As long as Mario is happy with his header, I'm happy

Victor