No Problem, you are welcome to call me or Pm and and you can drive my car. You don't live to far away from me.
Mario

 

Can I drive it?

 

sure, I will be at the Mini Meet in Malibu Nov 4th. Will you be showing up?

 

Mini Meet in Malibu Nov. 4th ? Think you can give any info on this ? I am around Woodland Hills and I would love to show up for a meet and "perhaps" check out and drive your car...

 

I was invited last month but couldn't make it. The best person to ask is Scott of Central Coat Mini's in Oxnard. He is a vendor on the board. I know we meet in Thousand Oaks at 7am and then a cruise to Malibu for breakfast.
Mario
PS i might have to start charging for rides. lol

 

ok look... this whole blaming the dyno thing needs to go... we didn't do ONE pull.... we did a few... to make sure we had proper deltas... and guess what... some of the pulls were lower... but we put down the highest one... to make sure we were being realistic... we did write about the lowest pull... and say hey... our head made 8000 hp...

all in all it's time to realize the one thing that is consistent is the dyno... we used the same dyno... same conditions.... just strap it on and pull.... I don't care if it read 50 hp before and 90 hp after... the delta is the same....

 

Mariokart - Wow. Thanks for the offer to drive your car. Unfortunately I can't get to the 11/4 whingding. Dang!!

I'll PM you after the 10th or so. I am pretty tied up through then.

 

Awww, look at those cute little rotors! You need to figure out a way to get these to fit on a MCS engine:

http://www.whipplesuperchargers.com/...sp?ProdID=1162

 

sounds good to me! we can put a 5.0L blower on a 1.6l motor...


thats what im talking about

 

awesome..

 

Chris, you should know better. This forum will never change.

 

you aint lyin UK... i think it's getting worse these days

 

... a good thing for some. And for those that have a problem with NAM, the red X button is in the top right corner. But you know they'll be back...

 

Unless you have a Mac (as I do)... In which case the red X button will be on the top left corner...

However, I agree, this forum will never change and I think it is getting worse. All the flaming and nay-saying...

 

the best part is that this is one of the few communities in the car enthusiast world that dispute dyno's.

its actually quite commical

 

Are you kidding me?

Dyno's SHOULD be disputed. It's a BS technogy, that is equivalent to a wandering zero.

There are so many variables to Dyno's, I'm surprised people even take them seriously.

Let me put it this way.... if I were to put money on the fact that a dyno (any dyno) reading was inaccurate, what is the probability that I am right?

It's a safe bet. Thats the bottom line.

I am not disputing Mario's car's numbers. On the contrary. I am not disputing the dyno pulls either. I am questioning nothing. I just am not believing all of the information provided. And whether I'm correct in my beliefs regarding the situation, I guess we will never know.

 

I plan on seeing Mario soon. We raced many times here in Scottsdale, AZ. Before he did the head and Cam we were very close.,I think he could pull from me slightly. I am going to drive up to California and probably race him a couple or 50 or so times. I know my car is running strong and should be able to tell if it was all worth it. Especially if he walks away from me.

 

A little tangential, but there are enough posts on this thread already that are really tangential, so wth. It seems to me there's one performance measure that is significantly less prone to error, or has less error, than a dyno. That's a 1/4mile drag. The timers actually account for driver response, so that can be eliminated. The effect of altitude can be removed using NHRA's own conversion tables, the effect of strip surface and friction must be of small order, as is the driver's ability to shift gears. I almost did the whole 1/4mi in 3 gears (into 4th at redline with 20ft to go), so there's only 3 shifts at most to be done.
Isn't this a lot closer to actual performance than a dyno, especially given the apparently large variance among machines, smoothing algorithms, altitude adjustments and the problem of cooling a supercharged car?
Sorry, all this dyno stuff makes no sense to me.
I'm out.

 

id say the 1/4 is more real world applicable then a dyno test. The 1/4 mile will actually tell you the result of the improvements not just the numbers and what should happen.

The only flaw in this is that most of us do not drive our cars normally like we would on the dragstrip. IE dropping the clutch and short shifting etc.

 

Your forgetting one KEY aspect of drag racing. The launch, and unless you have a 2-step or launch rev-limiter, every launch will be somewhat different.

Dyno's are no good for comparing one person's car to another's. HOWEVER, when comparing the same car on the same dyno given the same conditions when the only variables (within reason) are the mods added after the baseline runs, then a dyno is VERY useful. As it is the DELTA that you are after, not the end numbers. The delta will be the same regardless of what dyno, conservative or extreme...

 

ohh for sure! And then you have a-whole dyno owners who load or unload dynos to sway numbers... absolutley each dyno reads different. It depends on the dyno... it depends on the latestest software... yada yada yada...

I agree that it is not away of measuring absolute hp... its mearly a way of measuring power... and it is a common way to measure hp. Not every dyno reads the same... just about everyone knows that now... so if one person makes 207 and the other makes 208 or 212... who cares! its 4 friggin horsepower. mainly we are looking at the delta not the ultimate output. Some of us do chase for the highest number... why not... its human nature. we all want to say we have the fastest this, or most powerful that etc...

And in the end i don't care... anybody who knows me won't be surprised by this comment... RUN WHAT YA BRUNG! I don't care how much power you make, or how great your new DFIC works, or how great your butterfly in your throttle body looks, nor do i care about VHP... lets run them... leave the rest to the bench racers and the fakers

 

thats what i'm talkin bout!

having said that, I know it's the Delta that matters in Mario's case, but some dynos are so goddamn whacked that for the SAME CAR, SAME DAY, SAME TIME, numbers are still all over the place. Tuls said it himself, they chose the highest number to be more "realistic", whatever that means. Blame temps and whatever else you like, but when it comes down to it, when silly things like the way ones foot goes down on the gas dictates a dyno's outcome, then there is definitely room for error. Which is what I was probably getting at in my initial post. I wasn't trying to call anyone or their methods out, I was merely, quite correctly so, saying that the initial numbers look funny to me. And having witnessed over 40 MINIs dynoed, I have seen my fair share of numbers, so it's not like my arsehole is doing the talking.

As for racing, next time any of you guys heading to the track this side of SoCal, send me PM, coz win lose or draw, that sh#t's always fun in a MINI.

 

For everyone looking to ditch the dyno - search for the "screw the dyno" thread. Interesting ideas that didn't take hold because the hegemony of the dyno is inherent and insidious.

Plus there's like a million variables in that method, too. So we all lose, good game though.

mb

 

The last 50 or so races that Mario and I did were rolling starts. That helps eliminate who launches better.(i do) Last week Mario and I did many many rolling starts from 25-30 to about 70-90 mph. We will do the same thing next time I see him. I will know instantly how much power he gained.

 

Haha go for it. One thing to note, drag racing is from a standstill. No matter how much fun racing from a roll is, it ain't the real thing. BTW becareful with what you say on this board about "racing"... Pretty soon you'll have a bunch of people saying it should only be done on the track and such (I would know I've gotten flamed for it before haha)... Let us know how it goes...