I have a '05 with factory Limited Slip Differential. I've noticed that I can adjust my line around a corner by moving gently on and off the gas. This is not 10/10ths, on the limit, reckless driving... just 5-10 mph faster than posted limits around normal corners. Do others experience this behavior too? I find that whenever I get on the gas, gently or not, I have to add a little more steering to compensate.

Maybe this is how all front-drive cars are? Or maybe I just have high standards after having driven an Audi for the last 4 years. In that car, you can just mash the throttle in the middle of the turn and it tracks right where you wanted it to go... no understeer, no oversteer. Try that in the Mini with LSD and it changes lanes.

 

My car is very similar to yours, but I don't experience such dramatic changes to my line when I make throttle adjustments as I corner. I can make three suggestions: 1) Check your tire pressure 2)Take your Service Advisor for a ride & have them check the alignment, 3) If everything checks out, be more gentle as you make throttle changes (abrupt throttle inputs mid-corner are a big-time no-no in any car).

This reminds me a lot of a thread a few months back. Try searching.

 

is in here somewhere. Read this thread and then let's talk.

https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...ad.php?t=43374

 

no....thats how a front wheel drive car feels with a diff......now on our SCCA mini which has an open diff you have to feather the sh*t outta the gas and and brake to get it to go around a turn good without wheel spin......


For myself being i dirve the race car ( with a sh*tty diff ) and my everyay 05 mcs, its like nite n day .

 

I'm not saying you're wrong, but my car doesn't change lanes under power the way he's saying his does. It does hunt around a little, so I am making some small corrections, but we're either describing different things or feeling very differently about the same thing

 

Well being im a very aggresive driver i tend to throw my car into the other lane makin the back end get alil loose ( DRIFT ) at high speeds. Anything slower than i normally drive i never noticed the car being hard-er to make a lane change. Im lost.

 

I beat on my car.....wooohooo

WoW...Ima dork!

 

I have no diff on my 05. When I'm driving at 8-9/10's thru a turn and close the throttle, I get understeer. When I get back on the gas the car follows my lead very nicely. I always try to keep even pressure on the throttle going thru any turn.

That said, I'm curious; can you elaborate about what happens to the steering when you close the throttle say mid turn at 8/10's with a limited diff?

 

Having driven a 2004 without lsd and buying a 2005 with lsd, I would add that the factory lsd creates a bit of torque steer, which was a very undesirable outcome. I still prefer the lsd 2005 model, but was surprised by this. However, I do not experience what you have described. Maybe the audi (which probably didn't have a lsd in front- but just one drive wheel at that end and one drive wheel at the rear end also??) behaved more like a typical front driver without lsd.... just some thoughts...

I'd say stop comparing, and enjoy the new MINI... (and maybe have your toe in checked if it is an allignment issue)....

 

True torque steer - pulling away from the center of the turn, or a tug resulting in the car following your steered direction? Curious.

 

I'm with you on this. When I had the open diff in the car, straight line or curve, hitting the throttle had the same result as hitting the carriage return on an old typewriter. With the '05 trans/LSD stuffed into the car, it tracks great through the turns under full throttle if the throttle increase is applied smoothly into the turn. This allows the weight to transfer to the front outside wheel for extra grip before you shock the tire with g forces.

 

Your additional torque steer from the '05 probably comes from the lower gearing and the 7 additional horses, not from the LSD

 

Tire pressures are good... 35f, 34r. Alignment was done right after the suspension was installed 2 weeks ago, so that should be ok too. I've had some track experience in the Audi, so I know (and generally follow) a few racing cliches, such as "smooth is fast" and "slow in, fast out". I was just playing around one day and gave it about half-throttle (starting at about 3500 rpm) in the middle of a medium-tight left-hander and I changed lanes without intending to. I don't remember being terribly abrupt on the throttle... My suspension is setup a bit differently now (shocks are much stiffer) which seems to have lessened the problem.

 

Generally, all I need is a small correction too, as I am usually pretty smooth on the gas especially around corners. Changing lanes is a bit of an exaggeration, but I can make it happen if I try. Why not try and see if you can make it happen? :smile: Seriously... find a nice 2-lane sweeper somewhere with no one around and smoothly mash the gas and see if you experience the same phenomenon. I'd like to know if I'm alone in this or if other folks experience it too.

 

I'm experiencing the problem when I get on the gas in a turn, not when I lift. Also, I'm typically not driving near the limit... maybe 6-7/10s. I could be wrong here but it feels different than understeer. Or maybe it's 3 parts understeer and 7 parts something else...

To answer your question, though, I don't think I have enough rear bar at the moment to cause oversteer if I were to lift mid-corner. I will be adding more rear bar soon, so it will be interesting to see if that changes the situation.

 

Actually, the Audi is incredibly stable when you mash the gas in mid-corner. Since the torque from the engine is distributed over 4 driven wheels rather than 2, each wheel does half the work. Also, the distribution of torque is balanced front to rear, so it tends to be very neutral under throttle rather than understeer (fwd) or oversteer (rwd).

(In case anyone is curious, the Audis have a Torsen center diff with mechanically open front & rear diffs. The front & rear diffs use the ABS system to limit wheelspin, making for a cheap and reasonably effective LSD. I'm sure it would drive much nicer with mechanical LSDs in the front and rear, though.)

 

Not sure... I need to experiment some more. If it's true torque steer, it should only ever pull to one side, right? If it's always tending to understeer regardless of which way I'm turning, it must be something else.

 

I have the Quaife and a fair amount of power. I think it is torque steer. If I roll out moderately in a straight line in first gear and then floor it the wheel feels like a live animal in my hands. It's not uncontrollable but it does require some grip strength.

 

Kinda unfair to compare our 2 wheel drive steeds with any kind of all wheel handling. For those that care, a friend of mine added LSD's front and rear to his Audi. Outstanding results!

 

I felt a lot more torque steer without the LSD, but I credit that wth the LSD getting power to more than 1 wheel.

 

My right-rear damper setting was off. Normally I'm pretty thorough about stuff like that... set it, double-check it, etc. I was adjusting it for the first time last week, it was getting dark, mosquitos were out, and I was wedged under the car trying to read the dial with my face about 1" from a hot muffler. I'm sure there's a moral to this story somewhere in there... like don't be in a hurry and leave yourself time to do the job right. Anyway, I took the same turn today, gave it some gas, and car held nicely and felt like it was supposed to feel. I could actually feel as the LSD sent more torque to the outside wheel, but it didn't understeer at all. Problem solved. :smile:

I can still adjust my line slightly by gently getting on and off the gas, which is where this discussion began. General concensus seems to be that this is a fact of life for a FWD car with an LSD and I should get used to making minor corrections to stay online?

 

The only time my car feels like that is if I'm on the gas hard and the road is bumpy. Since my suspension is fairly stiff (PSS9s on 2F/3R) it doesn't hook up all that well over bumps and feels squirrely. It's a bit hard to deal with if you need to take one hand off the wheel to shift, but nothing uncontrollable if you're prepared for it. As you said, it requires a bit of grip strength.

 

That creates a very funny mental picture. M Trying to control the car by wrestling with a medium-sized wild animal...

 

With my "animal" you have to squeez his huevos to honk the horn.

 

Glad you got it straightened out It's usually something small like that.


I just spent the weekend at the track doing exactly that in a RWD (Bimmer). So long as it's not excessive, I might consider it a positive attribute. It really depends upon the degree of adjustment required to stay on line when you have to make throttle adjustments. But I like a car that allows for a bit of steering with the throttle through the turns.