After debating with myself and getting a lot of input both negative and positive I decided to go ahead. What the heck. I am keeping my 15% and the Unichip until I am comfortable with the decision. I can always put them back on. Just for fun....I will Dyno the car soon. My mods are listed in my signature. Any guesses at what the whp will be?

 

Expect about +3wHP from the 19%. Not exactly earth shattering, but something. I hope GIAC has a tune that's somewhat close to your engine specification (the head and cam change the mapping markedly), otherwise you may want to consider heading up this way for a UNIchip custom tuning.

Overall WHP will be based on dyno operator competence and the "hotness" of your MCS.

Cheers,
Ryan

 

It is not the peak hp as much as the shift in the power curve. I would have said to stay with the Unichip (since you already paid big bucks for it) and done some custom dyno tuning with it. The custom work should have still been less than the GIAC and for your mods much more custom tuned than the GIAC would have been.

 

The problem is that there is NO one near Atlanta that does custom mapping for the Unichip. There is a GIAC dealer and they do custom mapping ( with GIAC help). The cost of travel to Detroit would be more than the cost of the GIAC. I am keeping the UNICHIP and at some point want to compare. It's only money.

 

They may dyno the car and download the files but the tuning is being done by GIAC in Irvine, CA....

 

Bob,

Do they do the GIAC fine-tuning with a dyno? That would seriously tilt me towards the GIAC. And the lack of local car-specific tuning is the main reason I didn't try the Unichip.

It's almost 5 PM - any results to report?

Also FYI - when I went from the Webb/Powerchip/15% to the Webb/Powerchip/19%, Charlie Rossier (Rossier Dyno Research) dyno'd the car before and after.

I can't put my hands on the dyno sheets, but I vividly remember the delta. The 19% added 8 hp and 13 foot lbs. torque. And it felt like it too!

And back then - Feb. 2004 - most of us hadn't thought about bigger injectors, which seems to have added another level of performance (and safety margin) up top.

 

I'm not surprised. Those "in the know" realize there's significantly more power to be had with a 19% over the 15%. Those dyno numbers still sound very optimistic but I wouldn't doubt you could easily gain 8lbs of torque. And 8lbs of torque is more power on these cars than an intake, exhaust and throttle body will make. Add to that the fact that the 19% will bring the boost and torque up earlier and make the torque curve fatter and you'd have to spend even more - maybe $2000 to get the kind of gains with a 15% that you can with just switching to the 19%.

What DOES still surprise me is that people who don't have the 19%, don't want the 19%, and have never driven a 19% have a lot of negatives to say about it. It boggles the mind.

Naysayers will say the 19% is too small a pulley. You'll break your belt (possible with some heavy track time), you'll overspin the supercharger (not at the stock redline), you'll create too much heat(the data says uh...NO!), you'll cavitate the water pump (this won't happen with any size pulley), etc...They all are basically saying the 19% is TOO MUCH. It's too big of a step...

THEN ON THE OTHER HAND, they'll also say the 19% doesn't create much more power than the 15%, it's only 4% smaller so it doesn't make much more boost, the peak numbers are the same it just moves the curve a bit.

You can't have it both ways. It can't be small enough to be tremendously more risky yet not small enough to created any real power gains. Give me a break already!

As for whether a speciifcally tuned Unichip is better than a generic tuned GIAC...who knows? It's apples and oranges. Yeah a specifically tuned Unichip is better than a generic tuned Unichip. And a specifically tuned GIAC would be better than a generic tuned GIAC. But until we know conclusively that either the Unichip is better than the GIAC, how can anyone say this one is better. Sure we all have our opinions and that's fine. But to say the specifically tuned Unichip will always be better is hogwash. The Unichip's maps were done over a long weekend. A specific dyno tuned UNICHIP is done over half a day, right? Garrett spent parts of two years learning all about the ECUs of our MINIs (no - not two whole years - that's not what I said. He had numerous other projects which also delayed the MINI GIAC release). I know for a fact that they regularly did days of dyno tests tweaking every tweak imaginable with these cars. He would change one tiny peice of data and run dynos and data log and see exactly what happened. Basically, they didn't release the GIAC until it was deemed "perfect". Unlike most ECUs sold to the MINI community, the latest one is always the best. That is until the next hot one comes out. First it was the Evotech, then the Powerchips now the Unichip. I thought the Unichip was supposed to be the end-all of ECUs but now I hear there's a new Unichip coming out that's supposed to be even better. How convenient.

In terms of power, driveablilty, fun factor, gas mileage and smoothness I'd give the GIAC a shot SpiderX. Even if it isn't totally specific for your mods, it's extremely specific for the MINI.

 

from everything I have seen on the dyno the Unichip just doesn't justify the expense. Until I see the numbers on a "real" dyno sheet I am not believing anything about the Unichip.(on a supposedly "properly" tuned unichip) Because everything I have seen is to the contrary.

obiviously we need a disclaimer on this.... "properly tuned" because everyone I have seen "must not be tuned right" lol......

 

wasn't there a dyno party last weekend...must have been some Uni-fans there, eh?

 

has anybody done a 19% with GIAC on a jcw mini that included the recent upgrade, specifically the larger fuel injectors? yeah, i know that's sorta crazy, especially with the $$$ factor, but it is just $$$ afterall.

when the 19% first came out and until recently, i was very hesitant about it. i waited and waited for those early users to report any ill effects. i also was hesitant because of the smoothness factor, which was very important to me.

but no ill effects have been reported, and the GIAC tuning seems to have smoothed things out greatly, as well as adding even more power all around.

if i could get even more useable power while maintaining the smoothness, i just might make the jump. and better yet, eric is supposed to be coming down to hawaii soon for a bit of a winter vacation.

i'm assuming this would be similar to downsizing from a 15% except i already have the larger fuel injectors.

 

Yes, that is correct.

 

I have some impressions.

First my car has had the SES light on and off for about a week. I'm taking it into Global tommorrow for a scan.

That being said and I know that all bets are off.

The GIAC/19%/380s are not impressive so far. Both versions of my car are running with the SES light so none of this is fair/scientific etc.

The GIAC version is smoother but not as eager and even with the 15% the Unichip was more eager. There are other subtle attributes but until the SES condition is gone who knows what is really happening? So before I get carried away (because right now I am not happy)I have decided to drive the car as is until a tuning date can be set for the GIAC. This will be with dynos etc. I will post results. I am also sending to Randy tomorrow the Unichip to remap given the head/cam/mods etc. I will then change back to the Unichip (keep the injectors and the 19%...) and then Dyno it. I will post both dyno graphs. I will use the same dyno and operator. I can't control the atmoshperic conditions on all dyno days but I will log them. Will any of this be conclusive? I doubt it , but it will be fun and my car (when I'm done) should run about as good as it is going to. If any of you have interest and would like to contribute suggestions for the methodology have at it.

I have way too much invested...a little $ more to get it "right" is worth it.

Bob

 

Cool.

 

I should add that the GIAC while it does not have a specific map to include head cam etc is does have adaptive properties so I hope that driving it some will help it to improve. And, I should have said that the one I like the best will stay on the car and the other will be "archived."

 

I have the GIAC/19%/380 injectors aswell. And during the first few miles, I was pretty dissapointed too, I was expecting a bit more. But after using it for a bit, it seems to have more power all around. I guess the ECU adapts to my car the more I use it, it definitely has an improvement over my previous setup, but by how much, it's hard to tell. Plus the stumble is almost gone and I lost the cold start issue. Actually, the car now starts quicker than before, maybe 1 or 2 turns less.

 

I have the 19% pulley-380cc JCW injectors-GIAC ECU upgrade. The GIAC replaced the MTH that was supposed to be for the 19% pulley and all my mods (Pipercross Viper CAI, 62mm TB, 19% pulley, ported-polished supercharger, port-matched intake manifold, ported-polished head, Schrick (264) camshaft, Comptech/Mini Mania header with OBDII catalytic converter, and Miltek exhaust). Even though there was previous discussion on NAM whether Franz actually did mapping for the various mods, I won't go there.

Before doing the GIAC software, I did a dyno run with the MTH. However, I did have a problem with inadequate boost levels (only 14.5 psi with the 19% pulley), and the car only pulled 189 whp. There didn't seem to be any gross leaks in the system, and the boost problem seems to have been solved by replacing the valve on the throttle body. I then installed the GIAC software, but the current set-up does not have the low-end punch that was present with the MTH., even after 600 miles of adaptation.

As soon as I get my new GRSmotorsport intercooler installed, I'll get a "fine tune" on a dyno through GIAC. Unfortunately, I won't be able to compare the MTH with the GIAC. Numbers will be posted after the specific dyno tune.

 

THanks,

My car was at 178 whp before the Miltek header/catback, head/cam. Sounds to me like our situations are similar. Please keep me up on your progress. I did notice boost at about 16 psi. My problem seems that at anything less than WOT it is rather puny in comparison. WOT seems to have some punch.

I'm off to the dealer this morning to check the fault codes. That could be it. I'm a little disapointed the heavey hitters of this forum have not been heard from.

 

If you do the search, somewhere last march I posted the results of tweaking my rig at Hubie's. It was putting out about 180 wheelhpm measured at Helix and the same at Hubie's. that was with 19%, One-click, TOO blower and head, BMP cam, header, intake, 62mm throttle body.

By simply adding the Apexi and tuning on the dyno, it went up to 198. That test also indicated the need for larger injectors, so the next week we repeated with RC 440's and got to 212whp.

so from basically where you are at, my car was tweaked to get another 30whp just with fuel management.

 

it's funny that people can't see that you need more fuel and proper tuning of the fuel to get the best bang for the buck out of the mods. I have yet to see a 200+whp car without the apex-i. So what does that tell you?

 

Have you seen what Bob at IDA Automotive does with the SMT-6? I mentioned this a long while back but nobody seemed interested.

 

Most of the ECU remapping software adds performance by increasing timing. I have been running supercharged vehicles for many years now and what I have found is that as you add boost you should decrease timing.
With boost being so unpredictable on each individual car, what I can’t understand is how these software companies can provide accurate adjustments without testing each car. Therefore the increase performance factor of these software companies must be set vary conservative and maybe this is why we don’t see the results we would expect.


Dave

 

Apexi?

 

My experience with the GIAC/Injectors/19% (there's gotta be a shorter way to express that, maybe 19GI?) has been very positive. No dynos to back it up, but the powerband comes on strong at low RPM, and continues to pull all the way to redline. Combined with the VGS to get rid of yo-yo, my engine now pulls the way it should have from the factory.

 

air/fuel controller

 

Thanks I just looked it up on google and saw the sight.

OK I know I'm ignorant but isn't this the function of the ECU GIAC/Unichip?

How does this implement with the UNichip/GIAC (if at all)?