This forum (like many others on the net) is a professional community designed for information sharing and to be educational in nature so we can all become more knowledgeable about our vehicles. But often times, this forum has been consumed by one vendor claiming superiority of his product over everybody else's parts... and I'm tired of this argument over whether Turbo R53's or Supercharged (SC) R53's are faster on the track.

To settle this argument once and for all (and so we have no more bashing on this forum over this subject), I proposed a challenge to Jan at RMW. Bring your fastest supercharged MINI to the tracks and let's settle this on the tracks like professionals.

On the side representing the Turbo MINI's: Mynes Performance (Jason and Mike) and ABF Performance (Hubie Fuh).

On the side representing the SC MINI's: Revolution MINI Works (RMW).

Track selections: Willow Springs (Rosamond, CA)
Date: May 30th-31st, 2009 (Redline Time Attack Event)

Rules: Each team can bring their representing vehicles and we'll settle this on the track...

Classification: Competing cars must be in the same class (you tell me which class you're running in and we'll accommodate).

This gives you 3 full months of preparation to get your SC MINI ready. Let's stop all this going back and forth on this forum and back it up.
We await your response.

Please refrain from posting your opinion on this thread. The only response we need is from RMW - either a "YES" or "NO"!!!
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Comments added 2/23/09:
So what was the whole point of this thread, someone may ask...? The whole purpose behind this thread is this...

The Premise: If I was a MCS customer who's itching to spend 8k-10k to make my MINI 300whp, what should i choose. The common consensus on the street is to go turbo... and we have done a few cars with the turbo setup and know the in's and out's pretty well. But there's also the option of going with a bigger SC. It's understood that the Turbo setup is a better option on the straight track, but others have argued the lagginess of the Turbo setup is not ideal for Road Racing.... which lead me to start this post and settle the question on the tracks with actual results instead of going back and forth arguing on the forum.

Why all the restrictions or rules for the "Street Class"? => In order to keep it under the 8-10k budget, one must spend it wisely. The best way to prove this is to limit as many varibles as possible. If you remember from high school that in order test out the effectiveness of the changes being made, one must limit the varibles.

For a Turbo Setup, one is looking at $6-7$ for the turbo kit, plus labor and tuning, and maybe squeeze in $800 for a good set of pistons... that pretty much max out the 10k budget.

Similarly for the bigger SC setup, i'm assuming it should run around $5k-6K for the parts, plus labor and other necessary mod (maybe a good set of pistons for $800)... and that pretty much put it close to reaching the 10k buget as well. There's unlikely any room left in that 10k budget for a complete built motor, with a full Standalone and the swap.

And that's my reasoning for pushing so hard to keep the motor and Standalone off the table. Now if a full SC upgrade kit along with a 2.0L motor AND a Standalone can all be had for under $10k installed, then my hat goes off to RMW. The rules should be kept as realistic as possible.

If someone is willing to upgrade to a full standalone, i don't think he's going to give a rats a$$ about the stock interior, AC, power steering or the radio... remember, i'm speaking in general terms here...

 

***Reserved for Jan's response***

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Revision (2/23/09): Since we can't seem to agree on the definition of a Street Car, we are proposing two separate class of competition:

1) Unlimited Class: Anything goes as long as it's a R53 MINI. You can have a professional driver, slicks, stand-alone, whatever mods you can throw at it.


2) Street Class - defined as follows:
- Must be MINI R53 with title and registration,
- with the stock ECU
- stock displacement of 1.6L
- stock AC
- stock interior

Acceptable mods listed below:
- Replacement of the stock Supercharger with a larger SC is allowed.
- Replacement of the stock Supercharger with a turbo charger kit is allowed.
- Larger fuel injectors are allowed.
- Header and CAT can be replaced with aftermarket header and high-flow CAT.
- Max octane on the track is 109 Unleaded
- Safety harness and harness bar are allowed.
- Tires can be R-Compound (with a minimum treadwear of 50)
- No limitation on the suspension system
- No limitation on the driver
- Minimum weight of the car is 2800LBs w/o driver.

That's it. Mynes/ABF will bring two cars (one in each catergory) and we can run it on the tracks. Fastest laptime wins

 

Like my opinion? I can bring the fastest Cooper too... Sorry..couldnt resist..Carry on!

 

I will be doing my 2nd track day at SOW this year on the 6th next month so even though I would ove to join I don't think I can afford it. You are more then welcome to come to SOW on the 6th and see what you can do VS two RMW equipped cars that are going to be there.

 

My money is on RMW!!!!!

 

I'm not sure about that bet, man...Mike sounds pretty confident about his team's cars.
I don't know a whole lot about Mynes Performance, but I know Hubie...he don't mess around.

 

I plan on being at Buttonwillow if all goes right....

hope you have a street legal street car

 

Will the 2.0L TVS show up? hmmm...

 

I have know Mynes for a few years...and if they do up a Mini like they do up Subies and EVO's....its GAME ON...Sorry Jan.

 

Since it's a street car... PLAN ON DRIVING IT THERE.... with current tags.... registration..... a/c if it came with the car... and if it's not on the car... better have the sticker from the dealer that show's it didn't come with a/c

full interior trim with all of the seats etc.............


you wanted this.... you got it........

 

Great job on causing some competitive progression of our cars...

This will only bring better products and more involvement!

 

Honestly... who cares which is better.

 

I will definitely be going to this

 

Everyone.

Like Chris says, competition like this is what gets more stuff developed and out on the market.


Let the games begin!!

 

When you coming back to see me? I miss you...

 

We won't be at Buttonwillow b/c we've signed up to be at AMVIV, and that's why i suggested Willow Springs in the original post.

But Bob Scheers has a benchmark of 2-minute flat at Buttonwillow and you can use that as a milestone. I understand Bob's car is in a different class so the time can't be used as a direct comparison.

 

Is that what your base comparo is going to be judged on? I stock EVERYTHING except motor? No suspension no brakes no nothing..right down to a brake caliper bushing or green tree air freshener..... is what I am hearing? Kinda sounds silly to me not to change the tires and everything else if your putting the power down. .....

 

will the winner be giving out free tunes afterward? I'm going to need one around then.. driving out to come watch may be worth it regardless

 

It has to be a street registered car........
you can put aftermarket parts on..... I'm saying you have to have your a/c, 2 seats minimum and full interior trim.... didn't know that was so difficult to understand


air fresheners and diapers are optional

 

I will actually take time off from work and drive out to watch this cause I know what both Vendors are capable of...

 

I am coming out for this as well.

 

Jan, not a problem. We'll be driving the car to the track with the AC, power-steering, etc... So i'm assuming your car will have the stock-sized 1.6L motor with the stock ECU, correct? Should we limit the driver to be 'non-professional'?

Modifications that are allowed:
- upgraded engine internals
- ported heads with internals
- bigger injectors
- upgraded SC for you; turbo charger for mine
- max of 116 Octane fuel to be utilized at the tracks.

Feel free to add to the list so we can work out the details.

 

no, you will see the 2.0L
pick your driver... I have mine

and I'll be running our NEW ECU

 

I understand....but I am wanting to see a brung what you made..race....old school style. None of this...oh you got A/C so I need the 1/2 track...PINKS! bs....

 

Within each classification (Street, Modified or Unlimited), there are usually tire and weight restrictions that need to be adhered to... that's not uncommon.

We just need to fine-tune that for us so we can agree on the specs that are strictly applied to the MINI's.