I'm seeing a few posts on here with Countryman S models stating they wish it was faster...seems like those are owners of automatics? Mine is the 6 speed manual transmission and it is quite fast. I'm always leaving people behind at the lights and had it up to 110 on the highway without really trying; backed it off because an accident or ticket at that speed would be scary. So is there a speed difference between the two transmissions? If not - damn, how fast do you want it? LOL

 

The manual is 3/10 of a second or so faster to 60 than the automatic. As for being fast, it all depends on your definition of "fast"
I would love for the CM accelerate to 60 in the mid to low 6's. The CM is still fun to drive BUT it could be so much more.

 

I think the only reason the 6 speed is a little faster from 0 to 60 is the RPM limiter on the automatic. I have about as many mods to my engine as anyone, but with my tranny shifting early (on a dyno) at 6600 it doesn't have time to develope the HP. My limiter has been set at 7500, but the tranny ECU takes over and shifts. The one good thing is I never miss a shift.

 

I wonder if it's the automatic shifting early or if the gear ratios are substantially different then a true manual.

I have the automatic, but I also have the paddle shifter option, and in true automatic mode it seems to shifts for economy versus speed. When I have it in 'manual' shifting mode I can get the engine much higher in the revs and the turbo seems to really enjoy that and the car gets up and go.

Enough for me to crack an evil smirk and fulfill that speed need and turn a head or two, but realistically it is a cross over and not a full on sport car.

 

Yeah, it's not a "true sports car", but if I wanted a Mustang, I would have bought a Mustang I think it's funny that some of the car websites list the Ford Fiesta as a comparable vehicle...yeah, um, no.

 

The CM is adequately quick for me, because I didn't buy it to race it. Once the revs are up, it's fine. I just think 1.6 liters, no matter how advanced the engine, is gonna struggle a bit to move 3000+ pounds without some effort.

 

[quote=J.Eaton;3269904]I wonder if it's the automatic shifting early or if the gear ratios are substantially different then a true manual.

I have the automatic, but I also have the paddle shifter option, and in true automatic mode it seems to shifts for economy versus speed. When I have it in 'manual' shifting mode I can get the engine much higher in the revs and the turbo seems to really enjoy that and the car gets up and go.

Mine's not a turbo, but it has the same tranny. I'm not sure how many miles you have on it, but mine stores how you want it to operate (shift patterns) and even in drive mode I can hold it in a any gear all the way to red line with out going to WOT. I do think you are right the gear ratio is different. Also I am sure when they tested the cars from 0-60 the 6 speed had a LSD and the auto didn't.

 

I cant hear the blow off, Don't the Auto stay in boost while shifting ? ( I know my auto 350z twin turbo does)

 

I test drove both an automatic ALL4 and a manual, and the manual was noticeably more responsive when I drove it. Perhaps that's what people are feeling. The ALL4 drops the acceleration time and top speed, and so does having the auto tranny. Also, I'm not 100% sure on how the sport button works on the automatic, but even with it engaged, it still wasn't as peppy as the manual was. I felt more lag between pushing the pedal and feeling the acceleration.

 

I didn't test drive the ALL4, so maybe that is the difference - especially an ALL4 automatic. I test drove an automatic S, but I knew I wanted the stick shift S, so that's what I got. Interesting! I think the dealership only had one ALL4 and it was on display

 

I'm not sure if it's just the weight difference (155 lbs between S and ALL4) or of there's a mechanical difference that would add to the effect, but the ALL4 has a higher 0-60 (7.3s vs. 7.0s) time and a lower top speed (130mph vs. 134mph) than the S. The automatic adds a teeny bit of weight too (43 lbs). Top speed of an ALL4 auto trans is 127.

So the difference between an S manual and an ALL4 auto is a full .7s on the 0-60, 7mph on the top speed, and 198 lbs. It doesn't sound like a lot, but that's a 10% increase in the time it takes to get to highway speed and over 5% loss in top speed. When you look at it that way, it starts to sound like a significant difference.

 

The manual and All4 is a good compromise. I would have goon S, except, I drive the beach with the kayak and got stuck a lot with the R56. Doing great with the All4. It is still plenty responsive and I have to wait for granny on the entrance ramp anyway.

Bill

 

For me, the ALL4 was a main selling point. Living in New England and commuting 70+ miles a day, I really wanted to be able to handle snow and our gravel access road. The CM was by far the coolest, most efficient AWD car on the market. Can't wait til mine arrives!

 

You need to drive a Subaru then...

 

That makes sense, since the auto has that torque converter, plus the extra 50 lbs. I'd really like to get an auto, just for the sake of being easier to drive... I just don't know if I can go back to auto. Driving a manual just puts you in so much control of the car's power.

If the auto was more on par with the manual, I'd go auto; I just don't think that is the case with this vehicle.

 

Regardless of the acceleration or top speed delta, a manual transmission is simply more engaging to drive. Add in the cost of the auto box ($1250 is it?), the long term chance of higher-cost repairs (and history supports this, especially as pertains to MINI) and it's not some lowly 5-speed Asian-sourced unit, it's a 6-speed Getrag!

If you can drive stick, why wouldn't you? Too busy texting, smoking, eating and doing your makeup?

Save the manuals!

Cheers,
Tad

PS- Did I mention better fuel efficiency?

 

Which Subaru gets better mpg? I've been car shopping for 2 years and checking different Subaru configurations the whole time. The Legacy gets 31mpg highway (same as CM ALL4 manual) and worse city (23 vs. the CM's 25), and it's not a hatchback.

Plus, any time you try to put any nice features on a Subaru, they make you go with the automatic tranny, but that's a whole other issue.

Subaru says that this fall's Outback Sport (Impreza hatchback) will get 33, but it doesn't exist yet.

 

Just to make your decision harder, the auto has a 'manual' mode with paddle shifters that let you decide when to shift. Think of it as a manual without a clutch. Now the computer will not let you do stupid things like downshift or stay in a gear that puts you over the rev limiter, and it won't let you stay in gear that would stall the car, but otherwise it is you deciding.

Been on the road for a long trip and come up to stop and go traffic, been a grueling day at work and traffic is just being a pain... drop it into automatic and just zone.

Now if you said you were buying a track car, true manual all the way. Chances are you need it to do also the mundane stuff too.

You live in the real world, on the real streets, and chances are you somewhat obey the traffic laws. So why not get the best of both?

If it is about staying to the roots of motoring I think we can mod the car to put a turn crank on it when you want to start it, remove the radio, AC, power anything, airbags.........

-Devil's Advocate

(tongue firmly planted in cheek, enjoy you car and get the best thats is for you obviously)

 

I agree with J.Eaton, since now All the cars and Minis (I owned 1 R50, 2 R56 and now R60) except CM are manuals, with R56 both of them gave me hard time with the clutch although I am very gentle to it , now I own ALL4 S Auto with Paddle shifters and when used manual still gives the same feeling except the clutch, I am looking for a way to put my Alta CAI and will see if I can get the same sound fm wastegate as I did at R56. Also to the ones who are thinking of buyin CM I strongly recomend sport suspension which is completely different from the cm all 4 I test drived. This one with ss is much more close to Mini feeling. I am very much glad that I bought the Auto and will not be thinking of the clutch all the time which costs a lot.

 

That was my experience. I'm sure for many people, the automatic with the paddle shifters provides enough control. As a long term lover of manual driving, the moderate advantages were important to me, and the disadvantages of the stick are minimized since I'm used to them.

I remember when I got my first manual car, people kept telling me "you're going to hate it in traffic." Well, I still hate traffic just as much as I ever did, but I really don't find it annoying to clutch in and out of first. Even my Jeep's long throw in the clutch pedal and finicky clutch (140,000 miles on the original factory clutch) don't bug me.

And I got to test drive both the ALL4 automatic and the ALL4 manual, and the difference was pretty huge, especially in that all-important first few fractions of a second when you ease on the gas. There's just a longer lag in an automatic when you start to go than you get in a manual, and I hate that feeling of wait and then lurch that I seem to get with all automatics, especially those that rely on turbos (though this effect seems quite minimized in the Countryman automatic).

 

I have driven manual and automatic over the years. Entering this purchase cycle I drove most my Honda Pilot (auto) and BMW 318i (manual). I have never enjoyed the lag and second thinking of what must be a dozen computers considering my request in the Pilot, and the auto in the All4 had some of that feel. I felt the driving experience of the CM4 with the manual was completely different and in line with what I was hoping for - so it was manual for me.

 

The car that had this problem the worst in my experience was the first round of Volvo XC90s. My dad got one, so I drove it a few times. 5 cylinder twin turbo. You'd push the pedal down...nothing...push further...nothing...push further...car lurches forward. I hated that so, so deeply.

There's nothing like taking a responsive car from a stop into first gear with the shortest possible time on the clutch. Driving the Cooper S and the CMS ALL4 for the first time was like falling in love with the manual all over again.