Megan Racing is preparing to develop sway bars for several cars including the Mini Cooper. But before we just blindly design a sway bar, I'd like to consult the community to find out what you guys like/dislike.

I know that I want to have 3-Settings.

What thickness of a bar would you guys like though?

What type of sway bar bushings would you like to see as well? (I don't know the capabilities yet, but I'd like to know what to inquire about with the factory.)

Oh, and these will be made in the USA too.

So let me know what you guys would like, and I hope we can work to develop this just as the community helped me with other parts. THANKS!

 

We need a 25-27mm rear bar. The 22 mm is plentiful and is also not able to keep up with more serious suspension mods. The 22 is also only sufficient for a stock front bar matchup. Once you go bigger in the front the 22 is maxed out and just not quite good enough.
Why only 3 settings. How about 5?
Do something that is not the same old, same old. There are more and more Minis hitting the track that need serious parts.

 

5 you say? Well my concern is that the further out you go the less strength will be in the bar. How much spacing between each setting would you like to see?

26mm bar sound alright?

 

i agree... too many effective rate at 22mm... i think 3 would be good for most of us... the serious track guys would likely only need 2-3 settings depending on track... and how they drive...

i'd say 25mm SOLID... or about 26-28 mm hollow.. i think effective rates would be better than the 25mm h-sport... (which is basically a 22mm solid bar)

 

Being that I'm most likely building my own rear bar for racing, I should state that these are only my opinions and I most likely won't be a customer. That's unless you come out with a serious race bar. I understand though that may not be where the money is.
I do know that serious trackies do want as many adjustments as possible. Dry tracks, damp tracks, wet tracks, long sweeping tracks, short tight tracks, track temps, tire selection, and on and on all make changes in the rear bar, especially the rear bar.
This is where Webb did a good job with his bar. I think there is room for a better bar at a better price.

 

What improvements do you feel can be made?

 

Here's my list:
- High quality
- Cheap
(you asked)

 

3 holes = 5 settings if you have adjustable endlinks.

i think 3 holes is more than enough.

 

Like our dampers?

 

I second that. 29 for hollow, 24-26 solid.

Hey, Megan Racing, is this Calvin posting? If so, how's it going man? It's Tyler, the guy with the Spec V. I used to work with you and the group buys on the forums.

Now my girlfriend has a Mini Cooper S.


Take care

Tyler

 

Which would be preferred? The hollow or the solid bar?

Nope, this isn't Calvin.

 

Hollow, slider adjustable, 19-20mm, bushed with zerks, teflon hiem joint on the end links. Black

 

So basically Webb's bar but just cheaper? I'm not out to take someone's design and then just make it cheaper. I gotta give respect and credit where it's due. Webb motorsports has an awesome design and I commend the designers of that bar... but I can't go about taking their design and just making it cost less. That's steppin on toes.. and this early in the game, I don't think I wanna do that.

 

I'm with onasled on this one: a few more mm effective rate than the current 22mm effective-rate bars out there. Basically take the H-Sport comp bar and make it solid 1" and keep the 3 holes and that will be great for the racers/hardcore setups. The polyurethane bushings are fine, but toss the zerk fittings, they're useless.

That's my take on it,
Ryan

 

I've only looked at the picutres of the WEBB bar. I'm suggesting a more streetable bar. I have one on another car with all the same specs and it looks nothing like the WEBB bar. Actually, it's not hollow, so there's a big difference...in weight and cost. In any event, WEBB's bar ends are unique. A continuously round hollow bar would not be the same.

I wasn't suggesting, with any stretch, that you embark upon a project designed to undercut or copy someone else. I answered your query honestly and with zero hidden agends.

Keep in mind Megan, it is just as hard for me to answer your question regarding a swaybar flooded market as it is for you to differentiate yourself. In the end you may find the prospect not worth your time and considerable effort. If the fronteir is basically above and beyond 25mm, then you have your answer...because everything else below 25mm is covered as well.

May I suggest, your question was not narrowly focused enough?

If properly positioned, zerks will work; a channel is required in the bushing.

 

Note really. Those ends are an off the shelf item. You just would need to slot them or drill them. I'm not guaranteeing this, as the bends may have to be tweaked.
Most race shops buy those ends straight and bend them to their own specs, a relatively easy job. If in fact I just don't get the Webb bar (as I think it's the best one on the market) , I will just build my own.

 

...unique to a continuously round bar, and the others being sold for the Mini in our Vendors lists. Meaning, the bar and ends are of one coninuously hollow alloy. The ends do not require slotting either.

...perhaps a picture is better?

 

For those of you looking for the wider sway bars (25mm), I noticed the other day that the NOPI site had some wider ones like this for the MINI, FYI.

 

Okay, I'd like to know what is prefrence.

Hollow or Solid?

5-Hole or Slider?

What material Bushings?

 

webb already has a slider one. maybe the 5 hole would be cool? something different might be kinda nice?

 

I just ordered a Webb extreme bar but at the same time I told them that I thought they missed their target (market). The Webb bar goes from softer than stock to +348%. !st, who needs a bar that goes softer than stock? 2nd, H-sport comp bar is +383% with many bars in that area to way softer and R-speeds forged bar a little stiffer and now H-sports Race only bar at +500%(?). 3rd, as already pointed out by others, none of the existing solid 22mm rear bars works well with any of the upgraded front bars.

What I think needs to be out there is a slider bar that max's out at apx. +500% if it's going to work with bigger front bars but will soften up as much as possible. I think if Webb had just gone to a little thicker wall thickness on his bar it could have been +100% to +500% and then it would have been perfect, with the possible exception of price.

Steping on as few toes as possible? H-sport +383% hollow 27mm bar or +500% solid 25mm bar both with zerk fittings and three holes. Webb extreme +348%, hollow, splined end slider with no lube bushings.

Well if it's going to be cheap(er) it will probably have to be solid. If it's going to be more functional it will need to be a slider and at least +450%. Well, do the math but it looks like a soild 24-25 mm 4130 slider bar with zerk fitings to me.

 

Wheel rate comes from spring/damping rates and sway bars. Randy races cars and most race car's wheel rates are biased towards springs and dampers. This leaves a smaller proportion of wheel rate to the swaybar - for fine tuning.

Street driven cars cannot use heavy spring/damping rates, and so, these are typically way over-bared.

There are a million ways to slice and dice bread, but this is a typical race car approach - in general. Like everything, it's all relative.

Of course, racing rules can govern what you can and cannot do.

 

...thought about another reason Randy may have opted for a bar with a lighter than stock rate; It may work well with a car with no front bar...all else equal, to my way of thinking, a one bar setup is a viable direction, I've done it.

 

Back to your original question Megan... As we all know, the Mini market is flooded with 19-22mm solid bars with 2-3 holes. AFAIK, there are only 3 bars (WMS, IE, Ultrik) that use a slider style adjustment. These 3 bars also come with adjustable drop links. WMS is the only one of these 3 that has a 22mm effective rate bar, while IE and Ultrik have 19mm effective rate. The WMS bar is a work of art and priced accordingly. IE and Ultrik are value leaders, but the 19mm rate is their downfall, as most Mini enthusiasts want a 22mm effective rate.

I think there is room and demand for a bar that has a slider style adjustment and adjustable drop links (like WMS/IE/Ultrik), with a 22-25mm effective rate (similar to WMS), but with affordable pricing (like IE/Ultrik).

Several features can help keep the cost down: using a bent bar rather than a straight bar with custom CNC end links; using polyurethane bushings with zerk fittings rather than special metals or coatings.

 

i don't know if you already carry a product that matches the performance figures of the H-Sport Rear Race sway bar, but I've looked all over the market for a front sway bar that will match its performance. the race bar is +500% stiffer in the rear than the stock bar, while the most aggresive front sway bar is arount +30% stiffer than stock. obviously this leaves a large gap in performance offered for the front and back, and therefore a market waiting to be exploited. i'd appreciate you taking the time to consider this information, since it would benefit minis to have the performance gains of less sway, but at the same time a more neutral feel. minis are engineered with tons of understeer, that is why people go for the stiffer rear sway bar, but at this point the rear sway bars are so stiff they are producing unbalanced and undesired amounts of oversteer that could be corrected with a stiffer front sway bar.