OK, I've spent a few hours reading all the mushrooming / strut mount posts...

I think my MINI is suffering from mushrooming and possible strut mounts that are about to fail. I just want some experienced MINI owners to confirm it.

2004 MINI Cooper S / Stock Suspension / 17" rims / Run-Flats

From looking at pics of other people's strut mounts, mine look different. Other MINIs look like the cap on top of the strut is down inside the strut tower, under the lip of the open circle. On mine, it looks like the cap is above the lip of the open circle.

Is the strut mount supposed to be cone shaped towards the cap in the center? Hope so, mine is... or is it supposed to be flat? It doesn't look cracked or damaged from the top. However, looking at pics of new unused ones, it looks like new ones curve up and then down towards the middle, where mine are clearly going from the outside edges straight up to the cap on the strut in a cone shape.

Here's a collection of strut tower pics from my car:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/neufusion/tags/mushroomed/


Notice these other MINIs have the cap below the lip of the circle opening:
http://www.mini2.com/galleries/data/...62806634-L.jpg
http://www.lonestarminiclub.com/gall...ameBowingL.JPG
Check out how mine are poking out the top:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2078/...f43395d4_b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3157/...fe226d0a_b.jpg


And WTF is this little bump on the lip? How'd that get there?
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3089/...80280d90_b.jpg

 

I'd bet somebody dropped a tool there - it's just a nick in the paint...

 

Actually it looks like an impact from the bottom. There is a little nick in the metal missing and whatever the impact was bent the lip as well...

Check it out:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3266/...737d525b_b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3153/...29a359f1_b.jpg

 

OK. so they dropped a tool hard. Whack the other one with a screwdriver, so they match.

 

Not likely. I don't understand how you could think a dropped a tool could cause an impact from the bottom causing an upward bend in the metal...

 

that's what known as a "non-documented design and manufacturing feature" or an assembly ding. It's so small at to not be worth concern. If it really, really bothers you, hit it with some touch-up paint....

Matt

 

Mine looked the same as yours when I bought the car, I compared them with several others in the dealership and they were all the same, I thought I had no problem until I bought cravens, they sat on the top like a small hat on a fat guy, I jacked up the car and dropped the struts and did some bodywork with a 5lb sledge and a block of wood. not a scratch on the car and they now fit flush and happy.

Peter

 

OK; I got carried away with the fix. After deciding on the IE fixed camber plates, I also changed out my front bushings to urethane ones, replaced the springs with TSW Sport Springs, and replaced the rear sway with the IE 22mm sway bar that included adjustable links with rod ends. It feels like a different ride, no doubt.

To top it off, when I submitted a claim for 2 tires due to sidewall blisters, the insurance company sent out an adjuster to inspect them both. Not much of a surprise, as I already had 3 replaced before (2 for the same raeson and 1 from a puncture). So, these were to be replacement tires 4 & 5 not even halfway through my 5-year policy that covers the tires and the rims from road hazards and cost $600. The inspector came out, took his photos, made his notes, and they allowed the tires (don't see how they couldn't - they were blistered and had plenty of tread left), so that $600 policy (again, half-way through) has paid for $2,000 in tires now.

I keep thinking I'll get rid of the run-flats when they wear out and the insurance is over, but I keep getting new tires, so it is hard to justify doing it sooner. My lease is up a year before the tire/wheel coverage ends, but I knew from the start I'd buy the car at the conclusion, so I'll "suffer" with the 2 new tires.

For anyone who may need stock parts, I just listed the parts I removed. I had only 15,725 on the car and everything I removed looks almost new (other than for the inevitable grim, but even that mostly wiped off, easily). There is the stock 17mm sway with the stock end links, the stock springs, and the single remaining and undamaged stock strut mount all now listed in the marketplace, along with one or two other items I have had hanging around. Thanks to all who gave advice here; it was much appreciated.

PS:
All the work was done by Erving at Morristown (also now known as Open Road) Mini, who is just super. His praises have been sung by several NAM posters; I have yet to see an unkind word said about him here. I think if I had been charged full rate for this job (which include a wheel alignment, done at their BMW shop, which normally costs $250 alone), it would have been like a third more, so I can't speak more highly of these guys. It is nice to know of a quality shop that will work with you on cost when you have a big job.

 

wow - you did go for it

FYI I think you'd really appreciate non run-flats, I went with theses

205/45HR-17 Kumho ECSTA AST XL

which I'm finding a good deal. Not super expensive, but competent and with the camber I got, handles real nice. Just be sure to get some kind of kit for a flat or something, and maybe AAA

 

Thanks for the recommendation. I am not sure what I'll do about the back-up plan. I have a donut mounted already, just in case, but I am unsure about carrying it all the time in a cabrio - maybe I'll just use it for longer trips out of my area.. Certanly a flat-fix kit and AAA (which I already have anyway) are the alternative.

 

BTW, I got everything but the Powerflex front bushings through Dustin @ Auto X Cooper. He really worked with me on the price for a package deal. I gather everyone has different exeriences with different vendors, but he treated me great and was a good source of information, stuff I could independently check too, and was communicative on a timely basis, so I give him a

 

Okay: what the heck is mushrooming?

 

Summary:

It's a defective design, the A/C drain tube/pipe breaking on impact with the left front strut. When hitting a pothole, for example, the left strut juts inward and breaks the drain pipe. Water bypasses draining on to the ground [as it was designed to do] and instead collects under the left floorboard, carpet and mat.

Under certain conditions tiny mushrooms have grown on carpet mats and/or the floorboard carpet. MINI says it can happen in one of two ways. In the one situation repairs will be covered under warranty, and the other the MINI owner pays for it.

To fix the problem they have to replace the entire A/C unit [that includes the misaligned drain pipe], relocate the A/C tube, modify and repair the strut mount surface, and put in new carpets and mats. About a $1800 repair.

MINI sometimes says that the only way for it to happen is when someone drives barefoot. The floorboard gets "athlete's foot" and shrooms develop. Under these conditions, MINI will not cover the repair under warranty.

MINI owner experts say it can happen even if the driver has never driven barefoot.

Details:

Source of the water in the floorboard: MINI determined the cause of the A/C pipe failure was the left strut impacting the A/C drain pipe causing the pipe to crack or burst. The cracked or burst pipe then misdirects A/C condensation/water through the firewall and from there to the driver side floorboard. Water then seeps into the carpeted floorboard and mats, an ideal environment for fungus and mushrooms to grow.

On investigation MINI and the CDC [Center for Disease Control] determined mushrooming definitely occurs if the MINI operator has driven the vehicle barefoot. But they can't say for sure if this is the only time shrooming occurs.

The entire mess has come to be called strut mount mushrooming.

When Your Warranty Will NOT Cover The Repairs:

Last year MINI reluctantly published a service bulletin telling dealers it would cover the fix under warranty, unless the driver admits to driving barefoot or they find evidence of such.

If driving barefoot is suspected, there are two ways MINI North America will NOT cover the repairs under warranty.

1. If you admit driving barefoot, MINI will tell you that your foot fungus mixed with the dark, moist and warm environment around the floorboard carpet and mat, result: Little mushrooms grew.

MINI will tell you that damage from shrooms is not covered under the warranty. [That seems reasonable.]

2. Also, MINI will escape warranty coverage because there's a clause that says the warranty does not apply when you have operated the MINI illegally (e.g. taking the MINI to track days, driving barefoot).

a. MINI says that driving barefoot is illegal in all states, so that meets the warranty's exclusion language. Or,

b. For the strut to impact the A/C drain tube you must have operated the vehicle in an illegal/reckless manner. Since that is how the mushrooming eventually occurred, this also meets the warranty's illegal activity escape clause.

The Fix:

So what to do? The easiest thing is to not drive barefoot. And don't drive over potholes or road hazards.

If you have driven barefoot or in a reckless manner check your driver side carpet and floor mat for shrooms.

If you have shrooms, clean up the mats and floorboard. Use heavy amounts of bleach on your MINI carpet, especially if you have dark carpets (fungus loves dark areas).

When taking in the MINI for repairs STFU about driving barefoot because unless you admit to driving barefoot, MINI must cover repairs under warranty.

Bonus Tip:

Best way to look for the mushrooms is to use a blacklight. You can get those on eBay, search "counterfeit bill" detector. Those are simply blacklights and they are great for checking for shrooms in your MINI.

The best time to check for shrooms is in the early evening, in darkness, at the curb in front of your house. It's also good to have two people to act as witnesses to what you don't find, even if you find shrooms.

And have a camera handy to take pictures of the area AFTER you have cleaned up the shrooms, so you can say to the dealer "See, I did not have any shrooms."

Super Secret Bonus Tip:

Don't leave your blacklight inside the MINI after you are done looking for shrooms. There is a lawsuit in San Francisco where MINI would not cover the shroom damage.

The reason they denied the warranty repair was because they found a MINI owner's blacklight on the floorboard of his MINI when he brought it into the dealership for repair. I hear that MINI put that blacklight inside a plastic bag and marked it as evidence. A sad day indeed.

So make sure to clean up all evidence of your looking for shrooms.

 

I've never heard it described quite so eloquently.

 

Cracked passenger side strut mount.

2003 Cooper, 15 inch stock wheels and suspension, 17K miles.

Hopefully getting fixed next week.

 

Any details? Hit a big pothole?

 

Don't know, noticed it yesterday when topping up washer fluid.

That car is mostly for my wife and daughter to use (since I am not good at sharing mine )

 

Matt

 

My solution to damaged components is:

6 speed manual = Wife can't drive

Seriously though, I also had 'shrooming problems after hitting a "cut out", one of those large rectangles they cut out to fix a pothole, about 2 or 3 inches deep. There were no construction signs, no "bump" signs and the hole was in the shadows, BLAM ! I pulled over and checked the tower and sure enough it was distorted, solution - M7 plates.

 

Update:
'06 MCS with 16" non-runflats, Koni Sport Yellow shocks, 15" non-runflat winter tires, 42,000 smiles, no mushrooming.

 

I had M7 plates in July 2008. But then I read member Old Rick's posts and the enthused debate that followed his comments.

While I think the M7 or Craven plates are good (in concept only?), IMHO the $100 MINI-Madness steel plates are a better fix or shroom preventative.

Read Old Rick's posts for the full story. But the MINI-Madness steel plates make more sense; a thick, solid steel plate UNDER the strut mounting surface, "married" to the strut mount, offers more protection than simply bolting an aluminum plate on top of the strut mount surface.

As I understand Old Rick's explanation, a steel plate mated directly to the strut mounting plate (the strut piece with three mounting/fastening bolts attached to each mounting plate) is far more effective than an aluminum piece that sits atop the right and left "fender wells" (for lack of a better term, I'm not an engineer or mechanic).

I looked at the surfaces involved and referred/recalled my limited experience with physics (aka failures of this and that over time, typically something bending or warping).

What Old Rick says is accurate to me, the strut impacting against a solid tight fitting 1/4" steel plate is most likely going to limit or prevent shrooms far better than an impact against a "loose fitting" M7 or Craven plate. A jarring impact from a pothole, for example, is going to be absorbed, repelled, and widely dispersed or distributed by the "tight fitting" MM steel plate and that plate will prevent the impact from ever reaching the MINI's strut mount area (fender well, that is, the metal surface that constitutes the MINI's strut mount).

I refer to the M7 or Craven plates as "loose fitting" because with the M7 or Craven you have the following stock configuration, slightly modified with the M7 plate, a "sandwich," if you will: 1) the strut mount plate (with its three mounting bolts); 2) then above that the MINI's body or "fender well" material, that the strut mounts to (as it comes from the factory); and then 3) above that the Craven or M7 plate fastened with three nuts.

IMHO that style of "sandwich" is not mated tight enough to be as effective as the MINI-Madness plates, that in a sense run interference when there is a shock or jolt from a pothole, for example. The M7 or Craven plate is the top slice of bread in a "strut mount sandwich." To be most effective, seems to me the plate needs to be mated directly or closet to the strut, located where the meat is in my "sandwich" example.

Moreover, consider aluminum versus steel. The MINI-Madness plate being a solid, rigid piece of steel seems better than a piece of aluminum. But I don't know metals, so keep that in mind. Comparing the two side by side, the MINI-Madness plates sure appear more solid. (I have had both to compare.) Sidenote: to install the right MM plate I had to pound an edge with a hammer to slide it into place (don't ask, I was lazy and did not want to adjust the jack and jack stand to give me more clearance). Anyway, the MM plate edge did not dent despite my whacking it pretty hard. Those things are solid; no pot metal in those babies.

After installing my MINI-Madness plates I determined there appears enough strut mount bolt remaining so that I can install the Craven extender/reinforcer bolts/nuts that come with the Craven plates. I am considering installing the Craven plates so I will have a super strong "double burger sandwich" for even more protection against shrooms. I would still need to avoid road hazards, but having double protection would seem to be excellent shroom prevention. Maybe I am full of it and someone will tell me to not bother with this.

Sidenote: I did not have shrooms before the install, my strut mount surfaces are perfectly flat. My MINI has 29,000 miles. I mention this because MINI-Madness and Old Rick say that if you have shrooms that when bolting the steel plates in place this will straighten the deformed surfaces. How cool is that. Seems a good reason alone to get the MINI-madness plates, especially since pounding the metal mounting surfaces with a 2 x 4 sounds bogus.

Like I said, I don't know metals nor engineering, but whenever I have bent or pounded metals back into shape, the metal has become extremely weakened or even failed. So pounding a "load bearing" surface with a piece of wood, that makes no sense to me. While it make look OK from the surface, I imagine internally all that pounding weakened the metal's integrity, especially the thin metal of the MINI's strut mount surfaces.

Look elsewhere for my install tips. I will post them on another thread. It's not as easy as the MINI-Madness directions imply. I'm good mechanically, but not good at times. This install was one of my bad moments. It took me and a friend about three hours. I had some issues, but at the end I was pleased with myself at having got them installed. And now I feel protected against the "fungus."

IMHO this is a two person job. While someone who has done a few of these may think it's a simple install (e.g., MINI-Madness), there's a few stumbling blocks for us one-time installers. PM me if you want my install tips and tricks.

Here is a link for the MM steel plates.

http://www.mini-madness.com/index.as...ROD&ProdID=334

Sidenote: Although MINI-Madness says they are for the S model, they installed perfectly on my 2006 non-S. I did e-mail MINI-Madness beforehand and they said the plates should work on a non-S. I suspect MM says they work for the S because that is the MINI they used to install the plates. Not having access to a non-S they played the safe route and advertised them for the S. In any event, I notified MM that they install fine on a non-S.

 

What is this "easy installation" he speaks of? Whats the process?

 

Are you talking about the MINI-Madness plates? If so, the install concept is simple, but there are tips and tricks to use. For example, your floor jack has to be low enough to slip under the MINI. The el cheapo floor jacks barely slip in.

The jack stands need to be low enough to slip under the MINI. Again, the cheap ones I used barely made it.

A flashlight that you can hold with your teeth is handy. You need to be able to shine a light on the inside of the wheel well.

I used chocks on the rear tires to prevent slipping.

There's a way to use the MINI jack to raise the strut so that you can easily mate the mount bolts into the mount holes. And it helped to have a second person look down into the holes to say when things were lined up.

I used a Sharpie to write on the BOTTOM of the MM plates which way they go when slipping them into place. You need to mark the bottom so you can see what is what when looking up into the strut mount area. I also marked the top. If you don't do this easy to get disoriented. I marked the front of the plate with an arrow pointing to the front of the car, an arrow pointing toward the engine, and a circled R for right and circled L for left.

I had to turn on the ignition and rotate the steering wheel to give me more clearance on the side of the car, the wheel well, I was working on.

The list goes on.

 

I bought my car with 49K and did not know to look for the mushrooming til after I bought it. When I checked, I had slight mushrooming on the passenger side. I bought Craven Defenders and when I installed them I had some difficulty getting them over the bolt ends because of mushrooming did cause them to lean outward. I did not take a hammer to the mushrooming as some have suggested.

I drove the car about 2K and had the 17" runflats on the car replaced with non runflats (F1 all season). When I had them installed alignment was checked and it was perfect.

 

ok i'm confused
in all seriousness mushrooming is the top strut mounts pushing upwards? and in some cases they crack?

sorry i know nothing about minis