Hey guys and gals,

Big problem...need help.

Summary:
2012 Mini Countryman S
Wont start, engine only turns.
No codes.
Has spark (checked)
Has fuel coming out of high pressure fuel pump. (checked)
If I let it sit long enough the engine will kick using starting fluid but only once then nothing.

Details
First the vacuum pump went out. I made the mistake of replacing the impeller in the pump instead of just replacing the whole thing and it has gone out a second time. I took the car on a 9hr drive with no vacuum pump with out issue so I dont believe it is related, i just mention it for full disclosure.

Before the new (2nd) pump came in I was driving the car and it died when I stopped at a stoplight (no bumps, hicups, or stuttering just died) and wouldn't restart. Towed it home and I have been trying to figure this out for three days and I cant figure out what is wrong.


I cleared the codes to see what ones would come back up help to verify the problem, but no codes are coming up after clearing. I assume this is because the engine wont run.
here are the codes that came up before clearing some could be very old:
P054B (misfire?)
P050B (misfire?)
P0306c (fuel pressure briefly too high?)
P0366 (camshaft position sensor "B")
B2aaa (body code? assuming unrelated)

Checked cam positioning sensors, both have a 0-5V ouput when the engine turns over. If they are bad they are both bad in the same way.

Checked all relays and all fuses under the hood.

I am sure I am forgetting something, I have tested a lot of stuff.

Please help if you can think of something, I am out of things to test without codes.

 

Ok in an attempt of a shameless bump.

I have been talking to a coworker and we are wondering if it could still be the high pressure fuel pump.

I checked it the only way I could. I disconnected the line going into the hp pump and made sure fuel came out when engine turned over. (it did)
Then I disconnected the line coming out of the hp pump and repeated. I got roughly the same amount of fuel each time.

Cursory glance tells me this is good. However upon consideration we are wondering if the HP pump is not working and the fuel pressure we see is just from the tank pump pressure and that is the real issue.

When I get home I am going to try and hook a pressure gauge to the output of the pump and see what it tells me.

Does anyone know what fuel pressure I should see?

Or am I crazy and need to stop and pay the dealer to tell me it's really that the blinker fluid needs to have 2.03ppm of unobtainium mixed in?

 

 

Great thanks for the video DneprDave.

This video states symptoms that my vehicle does not have. My mini doesn't start for 2 seconds and die, it just turns over.
Do you think that means i am chasing my tail with the fuel pump or does my logic make sense?

Also, this video is for up to a 2011 Cooper S. Do you think a 2012 Countryman will have the same pump/rail pressure?

I am open to any other ideas/comments.
Thanks

 

OK now I am confused.
MiniMania says the fuel pressure should be 50 bar (725psi) at idle!!!

http://new.minimania.com/Mini_Cooper_High_Pressure_Fuel_Pump__HPFP__Applica tion_Guide

That is a pretty big descrepency, between 5 and 50 bar. Did I miss something?

Either way my car has around 100psi when trying to start and then holds 80psi for over 20 minutes. Does this make sense to anyone.

If this question would be more appropriate or more likely for feedback some place else please let me know.

 

There are TWO fuel pumps...the one in the tank......call it a lift pump I guess...gets fuel and provides "head pressure" to the HPFP...
Remember with a DI motor, fuel is getting injected into a pressureized cylinder...NOT at the valves or I take Port...

 

I know there are two pumps but the video above says the rail pressure should be 5 bar. I guess they could be misspeaking.

However you have a damn good point about when the fuel is being injected and the pressure the fuel would have to be overcoming to be injected. I hadn't thought about that.

That makes me think my fuel pressure IS to low.

 

Well $1300 later and it's not the gd high pressure fuel pump.

I'm thinking a road flare in the fuel tank will fix it.

 

These are tough cars to fix without proper testing tools and software. A quality Euro shop would have been the wiser choice and might still be. I was lucky that my 11 HPFP was covered with the extended warranty, did you check for coverage?


Anyway I feel your pain as I've done similar with other repairs.

 

n an effort to keep this epic tale of misery and woe moving along....

I pulled the 1300 dollar fuel pump out and promptly returned it. And after words with the parts dept. they took it back.

I talked to one of the mechanics and he was very nice about it but told me pretty much what I expected...."I can't really tell you without the car here".
But he did tell me he was leaning toward a timing problem. Which I didn't immediately accept because if it were timing the car would at least try and start. Meaning eventually, air, fuel, and heat would all be in the cylinder at the same time. And the mechanic seemed to concede that point but said he couldn't think of anything else.

But again upon further consideration, since the vehicle has two cam sensors and if the injectors run off both cam sensors then it is conceivable that if one cam is off then the injectors never get the signal to open. Thus acting like a no fuel problem.

So during the hour drive back from the dealer I determined this was worth investigation. I researched how you check the timing on one of these engines and I fabra-cobbled together a flywheel locking pin. And promptly crawled UNDER my car to check the cam shaft timing.

After setting the crank in the correct position I pulled the valve cover off and discovered I have no markings telling me the position of the camshafts. (I read that the UID datamatrix was supposed to be facing up) looking at the tooling that is used to set the timing on minis told me there are two flats on each cam that should be parallel at all times. The flats on the back cam were straight up and down while the front cam flats were at a little less than 45 degrees.

So since I don't have the proper tools and no intention of buying them for this one job and there is a less than acceptable risk of damaging something expensive.....the car has been towed to the dealer.

And the millisecond it is running it will be traded in for something NOT EUROPEAN!

 

Brits don't consider themselves European.

 

Do a compression check?
No code often means it is a mechanical issue...
And the gen2 S cars his those in spades.....
If you crank and have very low/zero compression....at least you know to look at either carbon on the I take valves (common) or a valve issue from a timing chain problem.....
Know you are frustrated, but trying to fix these cars without proper testing is gonna get $$$$....heck on any modern motor it will...

 

Hey I am a Brit and we make great cars

I worked for Ford for three decades and owned several . They had their wrinkles too

The mini is a sophisticated beast, I love em and you will overcome your problem.

I have driven many different brands of cars and none match the mini , lots of fun and look great, some grunt too . What more do you want?
Sounds like a timing issue to me too. Hope you solve it soon

We have a referendum tomorrow, on in or out of the european union, lots of us do not want to be in the union EU
We dont like our democratic rights being eaten by an unelected body of foreigners