R52 :: Cabrio Talk (2005-2008) Cooper and Cooper S convertible (R52) discussion.

2007 R52 S Top Won't go Down

  #1  
Old 07-09-2019, 01:58 PM
duckranger
duckranger is offline
1st Gear
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
2007 R52 S Top Won't go Down

Before yelling at me, please know I've searched the forums and exhausted what I've been able to find.

I just bought a 2007 R52, and the top won't go down. If I push the "down" button, the sunroof slides back, but the top doesn't go down, nor do any of the windows. There is no blinking red light on the near the button while doing this.

I checked the micro switches for the parcel shelf and the left side locking lever. They are both engaging, but I didn't tap them with a multi-meter to confirm electric contact since the light isn't blinking red anyway.

I checked the two fuses under hood and the fuse in the driver kick panel. All are good.

Finally, I pulled the battery for 20 minutes, and tried the "window reset". Still nothing.

Are there any troubleshooting guides to go from here? Thanks for your help!
 
  #2  
Old 07-09-2019, 02:08 PM
Fly'n Brick
Fly'n Brick is offline
6th Gear
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: In the here and now, for now.
Posts: 4,298
Likes: 0
Received 143 Likes on 129 Posts
The left hand boot door switch may be the culprit. It is a short throw switch. Mine did the same thing many years ago as did those for other R52 pilots. The solution is a spot of felt chair leg type pad stuck to the spot along the inside edge of the boot door. Give it a try. If it would help, I could include a picture...as an old NAM wag used to chime in: "without pictures, it didn't happen".
 
The following users liked this post:
Andy_S (07-09-2019)
  #3  
Old 07-10-2019, 06:22 AM
duckranger
duckranger is offline
1st Gear
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
if you have a picture, that would be great. I'm confused by the terminology and not sure where the felt pad should be place. Thanks for your help!
 
  #4  
Old 07-10-2019, 07:32 AM
Fly'n Brick
Fly'n Brick is offline
6th Gear
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: In the here and now, for now.
Posts: 4,298
Likes: 0
Received 143 Likes on 129 Posts
I don't remember where we got these little pads, try a hardware type place maybe. It's been a number of years since I stuck that on and the top hasn't missed a lick since. Good luck!




 
  #5  
Old 07-10-2019, 07:34 AM
duckranger
duckranger is offline
1st Gear
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Thank you very much! That's the top driver side of the rear hatch?
 
  #6  
Old 07-10-2019, 07:47 AM
Fly'n Brick
Fly'n Brick is offline
6th Gear
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: In the here and now, for now.
Posts: 4,298
Likes: 0
Received 143 Likes on 129 Posts
Right, that's the one. Just thought of something to do 1st to save yourself running around looking for those pads only to find out that's not the solution. Open the boot with the top up and then hit the lock button on your key. Hold the theoretically offending switch pushed all the way in then with your free hand, unlock the doors with the key, two pushes on the unlock button then hold it down as to run back the sun shade part and lower the windows then release the button and hold it down again as to lower the top. If all that works then sticking a pad on the boot door is the solution.
 
  #7  
Old 07-10-2019, 08:02 AM
duckranger
duckranger is offline
1st Gear
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
that's a good idea, but my keyless remote doesn't work and I already have some of those felt pads at my house for chair legs on my wood floors
 
  #8  
Old 07-10-2019, 08:09 AM
Fly'n Brick
Fly'n Brick is offline
6th Gear
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: In the here and now, for now.
Posts: 4,298
Likes: 0
Received 143 Likes on 129 Posts
We await the results with bated breath. Hope that solves the problem. There is nothing WORSE than driving around on a sunny day and not having the head run down. After all, topless motoring IS motoring at it's best.
 
The following users liked this post:
Andy_S (07-10-2019)
  #9  
Old 07-10-2019, 01:38 PM
miniCPA
miniCPA is offline
4th Gear
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: York PA
Posts: 544
Received 81 Likes on 71 Posts
If that suggestion does not work, I am sure additional suggestions will follow. Please don't be afraid to post questions on the forum. There are almost always people ready and willing to help. The easier the question, the more likely a novice, such as myself, can provide the solution. I have never heard anyone complain that a question was already answered.

I had an issue with that switch. I believe there was a service bulletin and a recommended longer replacement switch. If this was the culprit, I would think the Trunk/Hood open warning light and the interior lights would go on thinking the trunk was open. I don't recall it interfering with the top mechanism, however, for me it was intermittent until I did a similar repair.
 
  #10  
Old 07-10-2019, 05:58 PM
duckranger
duckranger is offline
1st Gear
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Well, the felt pad trick didn't work. Any thoughts on what I should try next?
 
  #11  
Old 07-10-2019, 06:49 PM
Fly'n Brick
Fly'n Brick is offline
6th Gear
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: In the here and now, for now.
Posts: 4,298
Likes: 0
Received 143 Likes on 129 Posts
It was worth a try, sure wish it had worked for you. CPA's suggestion is the next step, further input from the forum.
 
  #12  
Old 07-10-2019, 10:57 PM
08ragtop6s
08ragtop6s is offline
1st Gear
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 18
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes on 4 Posts
Originally Posted by duckranger View Post
Well, the felt pad trick didn't work. Any thoughts on what I should try next?
Good day!

I just got mine working again... I had the bus wire bundle under the pad seat carpet fail... the connector harness corroded... one of the wires that broke free was to the top module.... Not your issue, but in my research to figure mine out, I've learned a lot!

The sunroof means the mod is working. Bus communication is good. Hall sensors are good.. so, some new safety things added for our years (07-08) are top secure pins that hold the top in place when folded... Some rear deck micro switches.... So, all these work to tell the mod is good to lower the roof...

Access the mod behind the driver side rear side cover (plastic with speaker cover). Pull mod by loosening plastic 10mm nut... slide the mod and pull free... Pull big connector..... verify you have good path to ground on pins 8, 9, and 10.... if one it's "open", there is your issue...

Let us know what you find!

Good luck!
 
The following 2 users liked this post by 08ragtop6s:
Andy_S (07-11-2019), Mineeee (07-11-2019)
  #13  
Old 07-11-2019, 06:16 AM
Fly'n Brick
Fly'n Brick is offline
6th Gear
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: In the here and now, for now.
Posts: 4,298
Likes: 0
Received 143 Likes on 129 Posts
Originally Posted by 08ragtop6s View Post
Access the mod behind the driver side rear side cover (plastic with speaker cover). Pull mod by loosening plastic 10mm nut... slide the mod and pull free... Pull big connector..... verify you have good path to ground on pins 8, 9, and 10.... if one it's "open", there is your issue...
Let us know what you find! Good luck!
Here's the link to 08ragtop's thread with a picture of that connector. Hope it helps.
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...s-restore.html

PS: He's got some serious grease under his nails on this project!
 
  #14  
Old 07-11-2019, 11:10 AM
duckranger
duckranger is offline
1st Gear
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by 08ragtop6s View Post
Good day!

I just got mine working again... I had the bus wire bundle under the pad seat carpet fail... the connector harness corroded... one of the wires that broke free was to the top module.... Not your issue, but in my research to figure mine out, I've learned a lot!

The sunroof means the mod is working. Bus communication is good. Hall sensors are good.. so, some new safety things added for our years (07-08) are top secure pins that hold the top in place when folded... Some rear deck micro switches.... So, all these work to tell the mod is good to lower the roof...

Access the mod behind the driver side rear side cover (plastic with speaker cover). Pull mod by loosening plastic 10mm nut... slide the mod and pull free... Pull big connector..... verify you have good path to ground on pins 8, 9, and 10.... if one it's "open", there is your issue...

Let us know what you find!

Good luck!
Thanks for the information. I will give this a shot tonight. Are the pins labeled on the connector? If not, is there a diagram or picture you could share?

Thank you!
 
  #15  
Old 07-11-2019, 06:55 PM
duckranger
duckranger is offline
1st Gear
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Ok. I just got done probing the pins on the mod box connector. Pins 8&10 showed a clear connection to ground. Pin 9, on the other hand, showed an open with multiple pierce locations. What does this mean? Does it mean one of the safety switches isn't working?
 
  #16  
Old 07-11-2019, 07:07 PM
duckranger
duckranger is offline
1st Gear
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
It looks like this indicates a fault in the lever lock micro switch?

 
  #17  
Old 07-11-2019, 07:53 PM
duckranger
duckranger is offline
1st Gear
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I probed the micro switch for the lever lock, and it is good. The circuit is open when the switch is not pressed, and it's closed when the switch is pressed.

I also tried adding a jumper to ground on pin 9. I confirmed that 9 was electrically connected to ground, but the top still didn't work.

Same symptoms as before:
Press too down switch and the sunroof opens. Press again, and nothing. No blinking red light, no window movement, etc.

I did confirm that all four windows roll down when I hold the window down switch. Rear windows first, front windows next.

Any other thoughts or ideas?
 
  #18  
Old 07-12-2019, 12:51 AM
08ragtop6s
08ragtop6s is offline
1st Gear
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 18
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes on 4 Posts
Originally Posted by duckranger View Post
I probed the micro switch for the lever lock, and it is good. The circuit is open when the switch is not pressed, and it's closed when the switch is pressed.

I also tried adding a jumper to ground on pin 9. I confirmed that 9 was electrically connected to ground, but the top still didn't work.

Same symptoms as before:
Press too down switch and the sunroof opens. Press again, and nothing. No blinking red light, no window movement, etc.

I did confirm that all four windows roll down when I hold the window down switch. Rear windows first, front windows next.

Any other thoughts or ideas?
Good day! Apologies for not getting back sooner!

So, I'm thinking there is a break in the wire? The micro switch is working, when triggered manually... but no good ground at the pin? Hmm! *thinking*

The lack of a blinking red light has me stumped! It blinks to indicate there is a reason the top isn't going down, thus the top doesn't move....... Hmmmmmmmm!

Let's cycle the actuators for the locks first... the one that is giving you issues (pin 9) is right by the module... that black box on an angle with the cable coming from it... you can jumper 12v to pin 13(THIRTEEN) to operate both sides, OR just pull on the connector down to move just that side cable which will cycle the switch... Recheck pin 9 ground.... Ohhhhhh, I probably shouldn't say this, but in my attempts to fix mine, I actually forgot to plug in the module when I pushed the button to test it once..... So, yea.... Ummm!

Let's try to reset the windows when 9 is jumpered to ground.... Keep in mind, I do not recommend going full open on the top unless you confirm all other items are in place! Rear shelf is secured perfectly on all four points... both locking arms are secured closed in the trunk along the sides of the trunk... and the trunk is closed, just for GP... You may need to look up window reset cause I can't remember it perfectly... nevermind, I found it.... post#17... full battery reset and windows...

https://www.northamericanmotoring.com/forums/r52-cabrio-talk-2005-2008/171334-convt-top-not-workg-after-battery-change.html

IF the window reset doesn't work, we might have a pump power issue or maybe a bad relay for pump opening...

After the window rest, try to work the top... I didn't need to do this, but mine may have been at the perfect spot (down and locked) when I plugged in the mod after my wire repair...

The following is just to test the top function! Again, make sure all points indicated above are correct... with OR without the sunroof open, jumper 12v to pin 1(ONE) until the locks open... then, when you can verify both arms are free from the windshield frame, jumper 12v to pin 11(ELEVEN) until the top moves... then jumper 11 again and watch it is opening smoothly! If anything looks out of place, pull the 12v! You are not doing high current stuff! You are operating the relays that are operating the top... I did everything I just said on an almost daily basis to keep using my top with the issue I had....

I have a spare mod if you want to try that as well....

Good luck! Fingers crossed the window reset works!
 

Last edited by 08ragtop6s; 07-12-2019 at 01:24 AM.
The following 2 users liked this post by 08ragtop6s:
Andy_S (07-12-2019), Mineeee (07-12-2019)
  #19  
Old 07-12-2019, 07:27 AM
Fly'n Brick
Fly'n Brick is offline
6th Gear
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: In the here and now, for now.
Posts: 4,298
Likes: 0
Received 143 Likes on 129 Posts


Ya never know, it could happen here.
 
  #20  
Old 07-12-2019, 01:27 PM
Mineeee's Avatar
Mineeee
Mineeee is offline
2nd Gear
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Upstate SC
Posts: 95
Received 11 Likes on 8 Posts
The very first step of part 2 of the roof opening process is for the windows to drop before the latches undo.

If the sunroof opens, and the windows can be opened using their own switch, but "stage 2" of the roof opening process does nothing, then logically either the control module is broken, or the module must be waiting for an input from a sensor that the window switch does not require, before it can start to lower the windows.

My money is on a poor sensor feed or connector here somewhere.
 
  #21  
Old 07-12-2019, 03:22 PM
A383Wing's Avatar
A383Wing
A383Wing is offline
5th Gear
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 842
Received 54 Likes on 52 Posts
My 2 cents worth here.....I had many electrical issues with my '06 R52 a while back.....this K-Bus connection under the front seat was corroded.....I stripped the wires down to where there was good copper wire,and soldered all of them together. Everything started to work again, even my convertible top.

Now with that said, here's what I have found out on my car......the rear boot hatch does not have to be closed in order for the top to go down. I never had to "cycle" my windows to get the top to work, or the door locks. The rear package shelf tray has to either be in place or the switch depressed with tape or the two wires bypassed & connected together. The convertible top latches must be fully closed and latched and the drivers switch must be activated by the latch.

Can you lower all the windows with the switches in the car and still have the top up? If the rear windows will go down with the switches, then I suspect a Convertible Top Module, or a limit switch issue......

I suggest a Bentley Service manual to aid in diagnosing this issue

Bryan


K-Bus wire connection corrosion issue

K-bus wires all soldered together
 
  #22  
Old 07-12-2019, 07:15 PM
08ragtop6s
08ragtop6s is offline
1st Gear
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 18
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes on 4 Posts
Originally Posted by A383Wing View Post
My 2 cents worth here.....I had many electrical issues with my '06 R52 a while back.....this K-Bus connection under the front seat was corroded.....I stripped the wires down to where there was good copper wire,and soldered all of them together. Everything started to work again, even my convertible top.

Now with that said, here's what I have found out on my car......the rear boot hatch does not have to be closed in order for the top to go down. I never had to "cycle" my windows to get the top to work, or the door locks. The rear package shelf tray has to either be in place or the switch depressed with tape or the two wires bypassed & connected together. The convertible top latches must be fully closed and latched and the drivers switch must be activated by the latch.

Can you lower all the windows with the switches in the car and still have the top up? If the rear windows will go down with the switches, then I suspect a Convertible Top Module, or a limit switch issue......

I suggest a Bentley Service manual to aid in diagnosing this issue

Bryan


K-Bus wire connection corrosion issue

K-bus wires all soldered together

That is the exact same issue I had with my top! I wonder what is the cause of this? I soldered mine too, then covered in dielectric grease...
 
  #23  
Old 07-13-2019, 02:37 AM
A383Wing's Avatar
A383Wing
A383Wing is offline
5th Gear
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 842
Received 54 Likes on 52 Posts
[QUOTE=08ragtop6s;4482196]That is the exact same issue I had with my top! I wonder what is the cause of this? I soldered mine too, then covered in dielectric grease...
/QUOTE]

Cause was damp soggy wet carpet and floor boards, one more thing, don't let those soldered connections touch ground, they need to be isolated from the car's body. After I soldered mine, I put a piece of rubber fuel hose over the end and wrapped it up with electrical tape

Bryan
 
  #24  
Old 07-13-2019, 08:04 AM
Fly'n Brick
Fly'n Brick is offline
6th Gear
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: In the here and now, for now.
Posts: 4,298
Likes: 0
Received 143 Likes on 129 Posts
[QUOTE=A383Wing;4482228]
Originally Posted by 08ragtop6s View Post
Cause was damp soggy wet carpet and floor boards
Forgive a short hijack, please. I was posted to the Fleet ASW school, Key West back in '68. My car, my 1st car, was a '62 TR Spitfire roadster. Quite often of an afternoon there would be a short rain shower and I hated putting up the canvas and was almost always in classes anyway so I just drilled some holes in the floorboard. Amazingly, Lucas the prince of darkness, survived. The only thing that ever crapped out was the fuel pump so I had to keep the tank over half full. Drove it cross country with gravity feed twice like that.
 
  #25  
Old Yesterday, 07:06 PM
duckranger
duckranger is offline
1st Gear
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Sorry for the hiatus. I finally had time tonight to mess with this some more.

I checked the ground bus under the driver seat. Perfect shape. Clean as a whistle with no corrosion.

Next I reset the cable actuators, and as predicted my connection to ground on pin 9 was good now.

Finally, I performed the window reset:
Pulled battery for 30 minutes
Reconnected battery
Started car
Cycled windows twice

No luck when I tried the convertible top. Same issue as before. Sunroof opened fine, but no window drop, no latch opening, and no convertible movement.

Tomorrow I will jump 12V to the indicated pins to force unlock and top motion. I will report back with my findings.
 

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Quick Reply: 2007 R52 S Top Won't go Down


Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

© 2019 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands

We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.