As stated in the thread title, I have a problem,I need some help finding out what it is, fast.
Here's all the symptoms, and what I have already checked:

Its a loud metallic rattle from the front of the motor, with a slight vibration felt at the oil cooler lines.

Oil pressure is normal, 1st line on the chrono pack gauge at idle, and rises to about 60 psi when you rev the engine.

I pulled the belt off and all the pulleys feel solid and spin freely.

The S/C belt tensioner is new and holds plenty of tension.

I just replaced the timing chain tensioner, had the valve cover off, and everything looked great. All of the rocker arms felt solid, and the chain and guides are good.

Nothing shows up on the data logs to indicate a spun bearing, or anything wrong with the internals. KNOCK levels are lower than ever.

The only thing I can think of is the oil pump broke, but I have never seen a broken oil pump make normal pressure.
Is there anything else in the front of the engine that could be making suck a rackett?

 

You sure the chain guides are OK, also did you decock the tensioner? You can do it with the valve cover off. With something to use as a lever you feel right at the tensioner and try to gently click it towards the firewall. They come compressed, but if you push on them to squish it, they spring out (This was told to me by a mini tech) Without this the tensioner is still compressed and small. The oil pressure will make it spring out eventually and the tensioner with do its thing. Before it extends, the chain is sloppy and makes a racket.

If you didn't run it much, it may just need to build pressure to open up.

 

I let it idle and gave it some revs for about 10 minutes. When I installed the new tensioner I bumped the starter over a few times until the chain felt tight on the sprockets. I couldnt see where the tensioner comes into the engine though to confirm that it poped out.

 

I think 10 mins should have done it. It's just that if that tensioner isn't doing its job, you can get rattles just like that I think. When I did mine I gave it the little push like my buddy told me to and when I started the car it sounded just like when I shut it off, but I have read (IIRC) on the forums that it can make a racket.

 

Tomorrow morning I am going to take the tensioner back out and see if it poped loose. if it didnt I will pop it out and install the hard way.

I also have this question on my build thread, and it was brought up to start the car with the S/C belt off to see if it still has the clatter. I just went out and did this, and the rattle is still there, that counts out the S/C, alternator, The S/C tensioner, both idlers, and the A/C delete.
Its not rod KNOCK, so that really narrows down the list to the oil pump, the ATI crank pulley (which still feels solid) and the chain tensioner still not working.

I only have 10 days until MINIs In The Mountains, the car will make it even if it's on a tow truck.

 

With the tensioner being out, and since the noise is new, it sounds like you may be OK. I was just going to suggest looking at it to see. Not really major surgery and it tells you alot and fast.

 

The old one was most deffinately broke, thats what I thought started this clatter. It has about 6 different places in it's whole half inch of travel that it gets stuck, going in and coming back out. Thats why I took today replacing it.

 

You sure you put the new one in? Stranger things have happened...

 

Yep the old one was still in the ziplock that I took it to the dealer in. The new one came out of what was left of the box, and right into the hole.

 

Ok I pulled the tensioner back out, it was extended so it's good.
I am stumped.

In an attempt to use my GoPro as a diagnostic tool, I captured it on VIDEO, running without the S/C belt on. Here's the link.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GbI_j3GrGyQ

 

Maybe the chain guide got trashed when the other tensioner stopped working. There may a a piece off inside. It is an odd noise in that it really isn't in synch with RPMs. Higher rattles more, but I just think it is shaking something.

I can almost picture a wire wrapped around the crank pulley that flops around.

 

Looking down the hole, with the valve cover off everything looks fine. No broke off pices, no plastic shavings, nothing.

 

You can see the top of the guides, but they are long enough where they can't be seen entirely in the picture, the bottom tapers also. I can't hear it like you can, but even it still sounds like maybe the chain as it gets faster it shakes enough to rub something. I still wonder (and it is cheap so my mind might lean that way for a reason) if the guide isn't messed up at the end you can't see.
You need one of those rectal probe cameras to see the bottoms of the guides.

That's all I can think of. You said the belt wasn't turning so their isn't much that moves in a way that could make that sound I am hearing. Something sounds loose enough to hit a nearby object, but only at certain RPMs or harmonic frequencies of the vibrations. At the highest rpm one point it was quiet and then made noise as the engine slowed, or so I thought.

That's my guess FWIW.

 

I just took the ATI pulley off, its good, next I'm going to start on taking the front cover off, that will let me see everything.

 

Ok I got all the bolts out of the front cover, It wont pry off, does anybody know a trick?

 

I got the pump off. BAD NEWS, The car wont be making it to MITM.

Here's what I found:

The tensioner and both guide rails are good.


The oil pump is good.




There is evidance of the crank hitting the oil pump case around the front main.


And there's copper colored metal shavings in the oil pump veins.


That suggests that the rod/main bearings are toasted! Possibly a new crank, depending on if it was damaged or not.

The thing that makes NO sence, is that this log was taken with the engine rattle the night it started. Look at the purple line thats the KNOCK NOISE, it has one spike to 100 and the rest is 60-80 which is good. Normally if the crank is floping around the KNOCK levels would go through the roof.


I am going to yank the oil pan and assess the damage, if it's too bad, it looks like a motor build is in my future. But being currently out of work, and toataly broke, it might take all winter and part of next spring to get the money needed. Thats ok by me, the car wont leave the garage in the winter anyhow. The part that bug's me the most is that this had to happen 10 days before the MINI event that got me hooked into not just buying a Lotus! Either way, next Wendsday through Sunday I will be up in Winter park at MITM, However the car will be confined to where it sits now.

 

I figured that it was a deeper sound. If you load the engine at a constant load you can usually see if its in the rotating assembly.

I can tell deep inside your a little happy so you can do some more mods to it. I have been enjoying the progress.It will be better after this i am positive. Just some bad timing I see.Take care.. jim