With warm weather just about here (hey, I'm in Canada!), I've decided it's time to learn the limits of the Mini. So the question is: how fast do you enter right/left turns without losing control?

I have a Mini (non-S) with the sport suspension and 22mm rear sway bar (just installed ). The car is fairly new for me to me and without knowing its true limits, I can enter turns with confidence at around 30-35mph. No squealing and limited body roll. I think the weak link is the stock run-flat tires, which seem to me like they could lose grip at any time.

Curious to hear everyone else's thoughts!

 

How fast you can take a corner depends on the radius of the corner.

A more useful measure may be cornering gs. You can quit easily get over 0.9g without drama with decent tires. I've got upto 1.2g with drama and really good tires. You can see this in action on a movie from the track: http://homepage.mac.com/barryt/.Movi...AprilBesti.mov , I'm taking corners at 35, 50, 60 or 70 depending on the corner. The gs are +/-1 or so. On the street I don't go quite that fast.

The relationship between cornering speed is r * g = v^2. If you take the corner at 0.9g, you could do it at:

30ft - 20mph
66ft - 30mph
120ft - 40mph
185ft - 50mph
266ft - 60mph
360ft - 70mph

 

Hi btwyx,
Great Movie,
I havn't had my JCW on the track yet but I already know it corners a lot better then my 98 Corvette did on tight corners.
Ronnie948

 

nice movie, i saw the first corner and new it was laguna seca...
boy does playing gran turismo help. haha
i would actually love to take a lap around any famous course.
how much is it? and when can you drive inside the race track?

 

If you're not going to a track I'd recommend slowly learning the limits of your Mini, it's a lot of fun but even Minis can't defy physics. Sadly most of the fun turns on my commute have high curbs and guardrails leaving little room for error. It's a truck route.

 

That's an awesome movie - love the stats on the screen! Yes, definitely the speed of turns depends on the radius, etc. My question was more geared for road driving. So how fast can you take a 90 degree right turn? Probably the simplest comparison.

 

You might need to install QuickTime to see it. That one's in "iPhone" format (h.264 MPEG-4 at 480x272).

 

I found out the hard way, the enthusiasm you try a corner should depend on the room for error.

 

It still depends on the radius of the corner, which you're not specifying.

 

If you're talking about on the road, I've actually attempted different speeds with different coilover settings. Alta 19mm stiffest setting, M7 coilovers set at stiffest and summer treads have taken me through a right turn around low 40's mph with minimal squealing(this is a one lane turn in, turn out, no overlapping lanes). At the softest coilover setting however, I can only do about high 30's. I'm sure a 22mm RSB would help but never tried. Left hand turns however are another story. I've done low 50's with some squealing(and this is across a 2 lane perpendicular left turn-in other words, I'm exiting/entering 3 lanes from the left(2 lanes on opposite side of traffic)). At no point was this "above speed limits" so technically not illegal.

 

Fastest turn I took was 70 which is about a 280ft radius. Depends on the turn radius, entry, uphill, downhill, and road conditions. The video BTWYX put up as one good thing that will help you get the most out of your MINI and that is the tire squeal. There is an analogy called the Dollar theory. If you break up braking, steering, and throttle by using it as change you will see that there is a limit at what your car is capable. When entering a turn you have to balance out all 3 of those inputs. They can only equal a dollar and no more if you go over you go into the wall. When making a turn if you hear the tires squealing you are at 100% capacity and can not go any furthur.

 

I try not to squeal the tires on the street, it only draws attention to yourself and probably means you're over doing it for the street. Any cops hearing it may very well take a dim view of it, because you're over doing it.

PS: The MINI in the video is an MCS with stock sport suspension, it works just fine for me. Our MC also has stock sport suspension and corners just about as fast.

 

Btwyx that vid is sick!!

 

I don't want to hijack this thread (more than I already have), there's discussion about this sort of thing in the Driver School forum. Track days run about $200-$400, the video is actually from Siddhartha's clinic, it was $365.

I've never played Gran Turismo, I've only ever done Laguna for real.

 

As for how fast, I have a couple of test corners I measure cornering gs with, both freeway on ramps, I take these at about 50.

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sour...,0.001907&z=19

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sour...00954&t=h&z=20

The radii are about 120-150ft so 50 makes a reasonable number of gs.

 

I would HIGHLY recommend that you learn this by going to an autocross school and not try to find the limits on the street. Both SCCA and BMW CCA offer excellent schools at very low costs. You will learn how to control your car in a safe environment as well as learn your limites as well as the car's limits. And most of all you will have a LOT of fun (and may even get hooked on autocross)

 

AMEN AMEN AMEN...

Find an AutoX and have a ton of fun!

You can plough and you can spin - nothing to hit but a cone...

And if you get hooked you can practice, and you can even win (once in a while)...

There is NO place for 1g + on the street. No place at all.

With respect,

Charlie