so a good read indeed thank you Charlie! So no DDC on your car.....interesting.

 

madmix - Have you determined whether your suspension is fully stock or not? In a earlier post you noted the mods on your car and said the car came with those. I don’t remember if you had a chance to check your suspension for mods, like a big RSB.

Not sure where Charlie got his wheels from. He has a post about it in the the thread I linked. I think he did something special to get those. The ones I found for the MINI JCW are 7-1/2 wide, which should still be a good size for a 225 wide tire.

My MINI is straight off the show room floor (literally), tires (RFTs), brakes, etc., and no issues

 

Yes fully stock. Not mods to suspension, just the performance.

Eddie you have DDC?

 

If DDC is the “active suspension” or whatever they call it, then no. Just plain shocks and springs.

 

Gents my brake system is 100% OEM.

Cheers,

Charlie

 

Charlie, you don't have DDC either correct? (active suspension)

anyone know how to temp disable DDC?

 

No I do not.

Cheers,

Charlie

 

So want to find a way to disable DDC and see if it is causing the issue. Might be why it comes and goes.

 

For the ABS system, there is a fuse you can pull to disable it. I wonder if it is the same for the DDC. But will it work at all if it is disabled? Does it revert back to a basic suspension? I know that the MINI info for the JCW Pro suspension parts says that they are not compatible with the DDC. I wonder why...

 

Maybe you can unplug each corners DDC wiring harness. The fronts are the wiring connector that plugs in at the top of the shock/strut assembly that you can see easily when you open the hood. Maybe you can find the backs. I don't have DDC so I don't know where the rear connections are. Just a thought.

 

Warren2185 - Post #2 of this thread...
And your most recent post you say that you don’t have DDC. So, maybe the DDC isn’t involved here? Probably still worth checking, though.

Also, do I assume correctly that that the issues you had with the handling you described in this post were before you added the 22mm RSB?

You also say that you have the Eibach front and rear sway bar kit but have not put it in yet. I am very curious about your thoughts and opinion of it once you do put it in. That was a great mod on my R56 MINI.

 

Please refer to my post #16 for my take on how mods affected these issues. Overall, very happy with how the car is handling now.

 

EDIT: I'm sorry the first paragraph is messed up. I don't know how to correct it.

Hi Eddie,

About those Eibach Bars:[size=3] [/size]
[size=3]My description of how the cars front and back responds under turning load is that I don't feel like it happens at the same time.. The oversteer was feeling like it progressively increases with one given steering input. I did notice I felt it happen right away when the car was brand new and before even the 22NM rear bar install (especially since I was upgrading from a Gen2 Cooper S that same day). Then I put the NM 22 solid rear bar and it felt flatter, and more fun, but the front versus rear load timing didn't really seem to change, it was still noticeable and a little spooky.[/size]
[size=3]Then with the Eibach front and rear together. It seems much more like the 2008 Gen 2 Cooper S overall. It's certainly stiffer feeling since the two shocks work together even more. I'd also say "slightly" bouncier (only slightly), but still firm, quiet, and solid. In my opinion, now, the cars front and back during cornering load much "quicker" than stock, and also quicker than the NM rear bar by itself (I still can't yet say they load at the same rate). The Eibach pair does feel even flatter than with just the rear NM bar which still was a fun upgrade.[/size]

Specifically about the high speed front and rear taking a set at the same time, I still am not sure if it changed. One thing is with the car feeling like it leans and takes a set "quicker", it feels like the "steering response" is just quicker over all. So it's not as noticeable that the rear washes around a few heartbeats after the front has already loaded. And the steering wheel "feels" like it can control the car better. I just haven't had a chance to try my favorite off-ramps (of course when no one else is around and not on the advice of a driving school). I'm thinking to really dial in a criticism, it would take me a decent amount of testing time on the roads to interpret the handling flaw now (if any), whereas, I felt like I noticed it right away before the Eibach Bars.

I was very weary of putting on the Eibach fronts because it felt like a lot of work "just to see if I liked it". If not, was I just gonna pull it back out? Ugh

I'm reluctant to frame any of this other than my opinion. Partly because it all gravitates towards stiffening up the car a little and some people may hate it. To me, in general stiffness (not handling) it feels comparably stiff to my 2008 Gen 2. But at the same time more sophisticated and better engineered to deal with bumps in the road. It never skitters sideways over bumps like the 2008.

I see you definitely had fun with the Mods on your 2012 Smokey. Awesome stuff.

I have the 2019 JCW Sport suspension and the only Suspension Mods at all are the Eibach Front and Rear bars. Still on Run-flats (just summarizing for anyone first reading this)

 

Nice post!
Good clarification.

I have found that the “anti-conventional” wisdom for making a MINI handle well works much better than any other (my opinion). The front/rear sway bar combination is a much maligned mod, but it works. You can get a similar result with stiffer front springs instead of the sway bar, but that has its own pros and cons. I do all of my 99% “testing” out on the track, but that is not to say I don’t enjoy a good twisty road to drive on. However, the tracks I run are very unforgiving. So, I take things in baby steps. I will get the JCW out, but it may be a while. I plan a stock run with it. Should be interesting.

If curious about how the car with big front and rear sway bars handles/look on the track... Here is a link to a link (don’t want to stray to much on this thread) of a view of my R56 from the rear going around Lime Rock Park.

https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...ml#post4470958

As for your first paragraph formatting, the only fix that I know of to fix this is painful, at least on an iPad. On a windows machine maybe (have not tried, though) go into edit mode for the post, cut/copy the post into the Text Editor, clean it up and then paste it back in... Sucks...

 

that is a pretty good description of what I am experiencing. The car feels like the front and back are going different directions.

 

It almost sounds like the rear suspension is going though a big camber change or toe-in change. A little change of either can “steer” the car a lot. Doesn’t make sense that a new car would have bad bushings and alignments have been checked, which are things that I would check. Then I would check tires, but those are new too. And it would seem we would all have the handling issue, if those were the culprits. I wonder if this handling change is occurring as a result of the inside rear wheel coming off the ground and changing the grip on the rear, and/or the tire bouncing on the ground? But, again, on a new car wouldn’t all of us have that issue? Just thinking out loud here....

 

When I drove home with my '19JCW Hardtop, I noticed that it had a tendency to head to the left. I let go of the wheel and it was definitely steering itself left. I took it back to the dealer and they realigned the suspension ( all four wheels). I watched them do it. They corrected the wandering. Just a thought.

 

Alignment was done two weeks ago.

 

Steering angle sensor calibration should be part of an alignment.
Most techs skip it.

 

Personally I think the 205 size Run Flat Tires are the main issue with handling when it comes to a new JCW....Period...That and check the alignment specs.

A good 225 size tire will make a big difference all the way around IMO.

The one HUGE MISTAKE BMW/Mini made was to sell the JCW's without a REAL LSD!!! … that and not having a way to adjust a bit more camber in the front.

Check Sig for the upgrades … these statements are from experience.

 

While the RFTs are not the greatest, and I believe no all season tires is, I have the RFTs and have not been feeling these issues. The OP has Conti DWS and has these issues. Not saying a change in tires wouldn’t help; a lot of my posts here suggest that, along tire pressure, would likely help. I’m just not sure it is the cause.

 

Past: 56S, 54S
Current: '19 Knight/JCW (waiting on a name approval change)

My first foray into trail braking on the JCW was similar to madmix. Good line, brakes, weight transfers, then it was like someone else was steering the back wheels. I had ample room for correction but without it, I would have been curb hopping. My 56S would not have treated me this way. My next thought was I had a better car so I needed a better instructor. Got one lined up next month. I would like to go to my first MOTD next year without making a mess out of my new car.
Now after reading this thread, my question is what else should I do?

 

A little more detail, please. This is just so we can compare exactly what is the same between the cars and what is different. Car options? DDC or no? Sounds like you were on a track day? Yes? Where? What level run group? Have you done anything with/to the car? Tires? Wheels? Brake pads? Etc? Anything else you can think of?

 

2500 happy miles
DDC-yes
Car is stock
Tires-205 Hancock RF F-42#, R-40#
Not on a track just uninhabited asphalt
Skill level - just enough to get into trouble (years past a little autox, racing class in a Panoz GT)

 

With mine, I feel like the back wheels come around belatedly, and progressively-more severely, a few heartbeats after the car gets the initial steering input and settles into its lean. Is this anything you'd describe or is what you feel different?

Have you had the ABS kick in under the trail braking you do? That unsettles the car a bit. Was this not it? Just asking for your analysis.