2020 MINI GP Article

  #51  
Old 02-23-2019, 01:09 AM
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Originally Posted by FDR View Post
I love my ‘17 JCW with the JCW pro coilovers and exhaust, but man, this is tempting. I’m never to the world of Minis - Can anyone advise if this is something you can daily?
If you don't mind that everybody thinks you are cuckoo the car is a daily companion.

 
  #52  
Old 02-23-2019, 05:54 AM
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Originally Posted by FDR View Post
I love my ‘17 JCW with the JCW pro coilovers and exhaust, but man, this is tempting. I’m never to the world of Minis - Can anyone advise if this is something you can daily?
Originally Posted by KYDan View Post
You can if you want, but it is not the most comfortable car for a daily driver if remains true to the earlier versions. It is a more track oriented machine and the seats are made to hold you in place, there is less sound insulation, etc. Your JCW is sort of the best of both worlds, a good daily driver and a decent track car.
What KYDan said.

My 2012 S has become a track car that is streetable. I find I do grab the keys to our 2004 Base Cooper a lot more than when I hadn’t done as much to the suspension on my S (especially now that the ‘04 has new Koni FSDs in it). The S has also become a proper garage queen in the winter time because of the salt and pot holes, neither of which the S tolerates well. Being from Chicago, you might want to consider what the winter time aspects of owning a GP III might play into your considerations. In the summertime, my S becomes a very fun road car.

Then there will also be all of the kids in WRXs who find out what it means to be driving a GP III and want to street race...

Then there is will be the thrill of just owning a one of a kind GP III and all of the above will go out the window as a consideration every time you hit the start button, just like it does when you get into any other MINI, only more so.
 

Last edited by Eddie07S; 02-23-2019 at 05:56 AM. Reason: clarification
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  #53  
Old 02-23-2019, 11:34 AM
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Ok so I just got home after going for a ride with my Mini SA at my local dealership. He’s got a gen 2 f56, and just switched out his oem turbo to that 400 hp monster. So this guy has been a friend of mine for many years, even before I bought the first of my Mini’s (4 for my wife, all CS All4, and one for me, my ‘16 JCW). So I pulled up our forum, and he read all the articles. So my SA is STILL telling me that they are going to release only 500 in the US....regardless of what the articles are saying. So really...who really knows? It’s hard for me to NOT believe him, all I know for sure is that I’m number 1 only the build list.

So one last comment, probably should be on another thread, but if the GP does make a lot of changes from their concept, I am seriously considering jumping ship and getting the “first edition” of the new Supra. I don’t know if anyone else has checked it out....I’m sure many have, but holly freaking *****! That thing is incredible! And using the BMW Z4 engine platform....’it should be easy to tweak the conservative engine set at around 335 hp, up closer to the Z which runs I think about 365-370 hp.

Anyone else considering the Supra??
 

Last edited by normtrum; 02-23-2019 at 11:37 AM. Reason: Edit
  #54  
Old 02-23-2019, 12:53 PM
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Originally Posted by normtrum View Post
So one last comment, probably should be on another thread, but if the GP does make a lot of changes from their concept, I am seriously considering jumping ship and getting the “first edition” of the new Supra. I don’t know if anyone else has checked it out....I’m sure many have, but holly freaking *****! That thing is incredible! And using the BMW Z4 engine platform....’it should be easy to tweak the conservative engine set at around 335 hp, up closer to the Z which runs I think about 365-370 hp.

Anyone else considering the Supra??
The M2 Competition is only a few grand more than the launch edition Supra and can be had with a manual or DCT instead of the ZF 8HP.
 
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Old 02-23-2019, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by ND40oz View Post
The M2 Competition is only a few grand more than the launch edition Supra and can be had with a manual or DCT instead of the ZF 8HP.
i will check that out. Thank you! I like the M2. At least the body style. I have not driven one however.
 
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Old 02-23-2019, 01:37 PM
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Originally Posted by ND40oz View Post
The M2 Competition is only a few grand more than the launch edition Supra and can be had with a manual or DCT instead of the ZF 8HP.
Wow! 400hp. 0-60: 4.0. Minimal “packages” to worry about. Love the wheels (19” black spoke upgrade). My build before taxes was ~ $61,000. Definitely something to think about if they change too much on GP concept. Plus I’ve owned 5 previous Beemers in the past. I guess technically I still do.

Thanks again!

 
  #57  
Old 02-23-2019, 02:09 PM
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Originally Posted by normtrum View Post


i will check that out. Thank you! I like the M2. At least the body style. I have not driven one however.
I drove my cousins M2 just after he got it 2 years ago. Very nice! Handling is incredible! Tight suspension. Balanced. Its light weight and small-ish size is noticeable compared to the 3 series. Not 400 hp, though. He and I run track days together and he is (pure stock except brake pads) about 10 sec faster than me at WGI and we’re about the same time at LRP. A small down side is the staggered wheel size (he complains about not being able to rotate worn tires) and I didn’t like the center arm rest which was too high for comfortably shifting the car. Seats 4 comfortably and rides will on the road. What’s not to like...
 
  #58  
Old 02-23-2019, 06:08 PM
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Alright guys. Getting a little adrift here. Let's bring it back to the GP3.
 
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  #59  
Old 02-23-2019, 10:55 PM
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Originally Posted by normtrum View Post
Ok so I just got home after going for a ride with my Mini SA at my local dealership. He’s got a gen 2 f56, and just switched out his oem turbo to that 400 hp monster. So this guy has been a friend of mine for many years, even before I bought the first of my Mini’s (4 for my wife, all CS All4, and one for me, my ‘16 JCW). So I pulled up our forum, and he read all the articles. So my SA is STILL telling me that they are going to release only 500 in the US....regardless of what the articles are saying. So really...who really knows? It’s hard for me to NOT believe him, all I know for sure is that I’m number 1 only the build list.

So one last comment, probably should be on another thread, but if the GP does make a lot of changes from their concept, I am seriously considering jumping ship and getting the “first edition” of the new Supra. I don’t know if anyone else has checked it out....I’m sure many have, but holly freaking *****! That thing is incredible! And using the BMW Z4 engine platform....’it should be easy to tweak the conservative engine set at around 335 hp, up closer to the Z which runs I think about 365-370 hp.

Anyone else considering the Supra??
I recently wrote the best Z4 M Coupe ever, as you say complete M Technik, easy tweaks over 400hp. The GP3 might be worth to look after, the factory setup a good compromise between life expectation and fun. Unfortunately I have a M2 on order delivery May. The disappointing 7.52 at the Ring, compared to the 7.43 Civic R already pisses me off, and the contract on deal, the daily used JCW even with a hilarious top speed of 220 km/h, is a nice rolling chair and hipster swing I don't need to swap against another one .

I once wrote a sporty hatch should be that way , the the tuners change brand , the GP3 might fulfill this .
 
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Old 02-24-2019, 03:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Clutch Wotan View Post
I recently wrote the best Z4 M Coupe ever, as you say complete M Technik, easy tweaks over 400hp. The GP3 might be worth to look after, the factory setup a good compromise between life expectation and fun. Unfortunately I have a M2 on order delivery May. The disappointing 7.52 at the Ring, compared to the 7.43 Civic R already pisses me off, and the contract on deal, the daily used JCW even with a hilarious top speed of 220 km/h, is a nice rolling chair and hipster swing I don't need to swap against another one .

I once wrote a sporty hatch should be that way , the the tuners change brand , the GP3 might fulfill this .
The 7:52 time was Sport Auto's M2 Competition time, I haven't seen their time for the Civic Type R? The 7:43.8 time was Honda provided with a caged car and the rear seats and infotainment system removed. They also stated it had legal track focused tires, whatever that means. Until someone actually takes the stock car out with the stock tires for a time, who cares what time it actually ran?
 
  #61  
Old 02-24-2019, 07:25 AM
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Originally Posted by ND40oz View Post
The 7:52 time was Sport Auto's M2 Competition time, I haven't seen their time for the Civic Type R? The 7:43.8 time was Honda provided with a caged car and the rear seats and infotainment system removed. They also stated it had legal track focused tires, whatever that means. Until someone actually takes the stock car out with the stock tires for a time, who cares what time it actually ran?
the CTR lap was done on a floating cage. A floating cage does little to nothing for chassis rigidity. The defense for the stripped rear seats and audio display was to compensate for the cage weight. They did the lap on michelin sport cups which is about a 10 second improvement in lap time on the ring. Stock vs stock the m2 and ctr would be very close on the ring
 
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Old 02-24-2019, 09:21 AM
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Originally Posted by charrigan View Post
the CTR lap was done on a floating cage. A floating cage does little to nothing for chassis rigidity. The defense for the stripped rear seats and audio display was to compensate for the cage weight. They did the lap on michelin sport cups which is about a 10 second improvement in lap time on the ring. Stock vs stock the m2 and ctr would be very close on the ring
And it was a pre-prod development car. They've had plenty of time to go back out and set a time with an actual production version and they haven't, it's not like Offenbach isn't just a trip down the A3 from the Ring. It looks like Sport Auto ran a 8:01 with a production CTR last year, I wonder why Honda hasn't bothered taking one out for time themselves...

It'll be interesting to see what the X2 M35i does, that should start to give us an idea of what these new JCWs will do and of course the GP3 should be faster.
 
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Old 02-24-2019, 06:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Eddie07S View Post


I drove my cousins M2 just after he got it 2 years ago. Very nice! Handling is incredible! Tight suspension. Balanced. Its light weight and small-ish size is noticeable compared to the 3 series. Not 400 hp, though. He and I run track days together and he is (pure stock except brake pads) about 10 sec faster than me at WGI and we’re about the same time at LRP. A small down side is the staggered wheel size (he complains about not being able to rotate worn tires) and I didn’t like the center arm rest which was too high for comfortably shifting the car. Seats 4 comfortably and rides will on the road. What’s not to like...
Thank you for the feedback! This really wasn’t a consideration for me up until just a few days ago. Like I mentioned earlier I am a loyal Mini owner, my wife is on her 5th, I’m on my first JCW, and I love it! I’m only considering NOT getting the GP if there are too many changes from the concept. I think cost wise, the M2 will be a few $$$$$ more than the GP as well.
 
  #64  
Old 02-25-2019, 12:45 AM
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Originally Posted by normtrum View Post
Thank you for the feedback! This really wasn’t a consideration for me up until just a few days ago. Like I mentioned earlier I am a loyal Mini owner, my wife is on her 5th, I’m on my first JCW, and I love it! I’m only considering NOT getting the GP if there are too many changes from the concept. I think cost wise, the M2 will be a few $$$$$ more than the GP as well.
The M2 he's talking about was only produced up through the 2018 model year, you can easily get one for less than 50k now. The S55 M2 Competition has pushed prices down of the older N55 powered version. Here's a new loaded one for 52k: https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...ngId=497901552
 
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Old 02-25-2019, 09:54 AM
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All this discussion about the GP3 brings back memories of when the BMW E30 M3 came out. Of course, nobody had instant access to articles by cell phone and computers, so the "word" didn't circulate very fast. Heck, just about "the only people" who knew what they were belonged to BMW CCA and read articles in the Roundel. For the most part the M3 was an odd duck in the eyes of people who were uneducated at the time.....jeez it had a weird rear wing and boxey fenders!!!...who wanted that? I DID!!! If only I had the wherewithal I'd have bought a half dozen of the things in various colors and put em in a barn!...better than any 401k for an investment!

If I had the room, you can bet my name would be on the waiting list for a new MINI GP3! But, I at least have my 1990 M3 to drive so it's not all bad! Of course, My JCW makes me smile also! I say, if anyone is on the fence, GO FOR IT and sign up for the GP3...don't miss that boat!
 
  #66  
Old 02-25-2019, 11:15 AM
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Originally Posted by 02fanatic View Post
All this discussion about the GP3 brings back memories of when the BMW E30 M3 came out. Of course, nobody had instant access to articles by cell phone and computers, so the "word" didn't circulate very fast. Heck, just about "the only people" who knew what they were belonged to BMW CCA and read articles in the Roundel. For the most part the M3 was an odd duck in the eyes of people who were uneducated at the time.....jeez it had a weird rear wing and boxey fenders!!!...who wanted that? I DID!!! If only I had the wherewithal I'd have bought a half dozen of the things in various colors and put em in a barn!...better than any 401k for an investment!

If I had the room, you can bet my name would be on the waiting list for a new MINI GP3! But, I at least have my 1990 M3 to drive so it's not all bad! Of course, My JCW makes me smile also! I say, if anyone is on the fence, GO FOR IT and sign up for the GP3...don't miss that boat!
Alas, the waiting is excruciatingly painful, and extraordinarily too long! ARGH! But, I do have plenty of room, do you know of any unbelievably good deals on a cherry Lotus Elise?
 
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Old 02-25-2019, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by KYDan View Post
Alas, the waiting is excruciatingly painful, and extraordinarily too long! ARGH! But, I do have plenty of room, do you know of any unbelievably good deals on a cherry Lotus Elise?
Can't say as I do, but I've seen a few on BaT over the past several months. Very cool cars, but can you get into one?
 
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Old 02-25-2019, 01:41 PM
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Originally Posted by 02fanatic View Post
Can't say as I do, but I've seen a few on BaT over the past several months. Very cool cars, but can you get into one?

On a good day certainly, turn around duck, sit down and swing in. Same method I use in the vette. On a bad day I will drive my JCW or my always faithful truck with steps!
 
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Old 02-25-2019, 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by KYDan View Post
Alas, the waiting is excruciatingly painful, and extraordinarily too long! ARGH! But, I do have plenty of room, do you know of any unbelievably good deals on a cherry Lotus Elise?
And this is even longer than the normal build period for a “normal” MINI, which generally drives people nuts. I know it drove us nut when we ordered our ‘04 MINI. Those 6 - 8 weeks were painful!.... And here we have, what, months to go before the GP hits the showrooms?
 
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Old 02-25-2019, 04:00 PM
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Originally Posted by 02fanatic View Post
All this discussion about the GP3 brings back memories of when the BMW E30 M3 came out. Of course, nobody had instant access to articles by cell phone and computers, so the "word" didn't circulate very fast. Heck, just about "the only people" who knew what they were belonged to BMW CCA and read articles in the Roundel. For the most part the M3 was an odd duck in the eyes of people who were uneducated at the time.....jeez it had a weird rear wing and boxey fenders!!!...who wanted that? I DID!!! If only I had the wherewithal I'd have bought a half dozen of the things in various colors and put em in a barn!...better than any 401k for an investment!

If I had the room, you can bet my name would be on the waiting list for a new MINI GP3! But, I at least have my 1990 M3 to drive so it's not all bad! Of course, My JCW makes me smile also! I say, if anyone is on the fence, GO FOR IT and sign up for the GP3...don't miss that boat!
I absolutely LOVE the E30 M3!! I found one at a local Seattle dealership maybe 5 years ago, and based on their internet pics, I was absolutely expecting to buy it. However once I saw it in person, it turned out to be crap. I didn’t even drive it. The dealer was very “selective” on which specific photos he placed online. It was a big disappointment!! But that big *** wing......again I loved it! The one car I wish I would have bought about 50 of them....way back then, was the
1979 Toyota fj40.
 
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Old 02-25-2019, 10:47 PM
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Originally Posted by ND40oz View Post
And it was a pre-prod development car. They've had plenty of time to go back out and set a time with an actual production version and they haven't, it's not like Offenbach isn't just a trip down the A3 from the Ring. It looks like Sport Auto ran a 8:01 with a production CTR last year, I wonder why Honda hasn't bothered taking one out for time themselves...

It'll be interesting to see what the X2 M35i does, that should start to give us an idea of what these new JCWs will do and of course the GP3 should be faster.
The X2 is good for daily pose, one the track he faces common SUV problems, like Macan and Co....... obistilces , Idiots.

Mr Gebhards driving skills are not bad ! But the Japan hatch was pushed by hired track specialist.

In 2014 this was a record for FWD the MINI JCW Schirra 7.44 Gebhard, his first try at that day ended with tape

I also see the GP3 at record level around 7.30, but depends on driver and commitment, Level of commitment follows future weight of GP3
 
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Old 02-26-2019, 04:46 AM
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As advised earlier its worth to wait for the F60 4WD GP Sub-Zero, we all know a Subaru WRX did a sub 7:00.
correct. 6:57 so for the hallmark of MINI to come there is only one Vision to win the 24H.

Before the Schirra MINI participate, at rainy condition they where among the top fastest, with a easy class win and I think P20 overall. Today a 4WD Clubman special with 390hp hybrid might be a sensational gig. 3 of them Rebel Green red roof 8000 rpms at the front ;-)
 

Last edited by Clutch Wotan; 02-26-2019 at 04:56 AM.
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Old 02-26-2019, 09:03 AM
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Not sure what this all means for what will become a street legal, showroom available Gen III, GP3 MINI Cooper, that you may drive from the dealer to the track without stopping at the mod-shop. Is MINI even there yet with how the production version of fthe GP3 will be setup and optioned out?

(Discussion about the Corvette deleted - see next post)
 

Last edited by Eddie07S; 02-26-2019 at 11:57 AM. Reason: correct posting
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Old 02-26-2019, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Clutch Wotan View Post
As advised earlier its worth to wait for the F60 4WD GP Sub-Zero, we all know a Subaru WRX did a sub 7:00.
correct. 6:57 so for the hallmark of MINI to come there is only one Vision to win the 24H.

Before the Schirra MINI participate, at rainy condition they where among the top fastest, with a easy class win and I think P20 overall. Today a 4WD Clubman special with 390hp hybrid might be a sensational gig. 3 of them Rebel Green red roof 8000 rpms at the front ;-)
Tossing out hypothetical lap times for a vehicle that doesn't even have released specs yet is a bit crazy IMO. Mini never said they were aiming to be the fastest fwd car around the ring. They said they expected to shave seconds off the previous GP2. If you want the most capable FWD car around the ring I expect the clubsport and CTR will still be king. If you look at the big picture rationally do you honestly think BMW will allow any MINI to beat the almighty m2, m3, and m4 around the ring?

Originally Posted by Eddie07S View Post
The latest version of the Corvette was made to be one of the fastest cars on the Ring and yet it was crap for track days because they (Chevy) shorted it on cooling to save weight to make it quick on the ring for sub-8 minutes of running. But it would overheat when run 20 - 30 minutes on the tracks around here. Just one example of the real world not meeting up with the test world.
Really off subject again from this thread but I have two friends that were on the engineering team for the C7. The overheating issues on the 15-16 cars had nothing to do with saving weight to get a better lap time. They both were pretty up front about it and they said the benchmarking ambient temp was not high enough and they were short sighted about it. The 17+ C7Z is pretty much cured of all overheating issues with the exception of some 8AT cars running multiple laps in 100+ ambient temps. CTR and Focus RS are plagued with even worse overheating issues compared to the C7Z.
 
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Old 02-26-2019, 11:55 AM
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Originally Posted by charrigan View Post
Really off subject again from this thread but I have two friends that were on the engineering team for the C7. The overheating issues on the 15-16 cars had nothing to do with saving weight to get a better lap time. They both were pretty up front about it and they said the benchmarking ambient temp was not high enough and they were short sighted about it. The 17+ C7Z is pretty much cured of all overheating issues with the exception of some 8AT cars running multiple laps in 100+ ambient temps. CTR and Focus RS are plagued with even worse overheating issues compared to the C7Z.
My apologies.
Just goes to prove that not everything you read on the internet is true...

Now back to our regurally scheduled program...
 

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