I was not suggesting that GBMINI was bashing anyone. I was quoting a post to make a point that bashing the 56 was pointless. Sorry if it came across the wrong way

Mark

 

Ah, ok.

 

Some of us have many years invested in both our MINIs and how we feel about them. Sometimes we tend to blurt things out that don't sound right on-line when the brand is attacked. Which is what I see a lot of in this thread, attacking the brand.

Mark

 

Yes. It seems that eventually some balance emerges on the whole thing and I've seen that expressed in this thread, too.

Folks used to get into very spirited Cooper vs MCS discussions and it took some time before folks finally figured out that the two cars were both very good, very different, and very suited to certain drivers and their expectations. In that case, a lot of information was exchanged before folks either 1) figured it out or 2) got tired of debating it endlessly.

I suggest the same thing is happening here. I mean, this was the year R56 arrived!! We probably should expect opinions to fly 'til the dust settles, especially if some have good reasons to opt for the previous gen car. In the end, though, I think all this information will ultimately lead to that same equilibrium...if someone has a personal preference on they type of MINI motoring they prefer/want/need and there's a MINI to suit...go for it!!!

 

Disagree again, Mark. I do not see any attacks levied against the brand in this discussion so far.

 

Mark

 

Matt

 

The point I was trying to make in my prior post on this topic is why do some Mini owners - classic, R50/53, R56, etc feel the need to argue that some years, model or versions is not a "real" mini?

It usually seems the one they prefer is the one they own is "in their humble opinion" is the only true mini and the rest are not! Oh yeah they are also experts about this subject.

I have said it before in prior posts, are there still R50/53 and R56 owners that are not aware that there are still some Classic Owners Clubs that do not coinsider any of their Mini's "real" minis? Ever seen a "100% BMW Free" decal on a classic?

I currently own a '66, I have have owned a JCW R53, and I also currently own a R56 and they are all great cars and have their stong points and weak points, but they all share the fact that they are a blast to drive and guess what - they are all Minis!

In the words of Rodney King - "Can't we all just get along".

 

I am still rather new to the MINI scene (check my number of posts) but I faithfully follow NAM everyday. This discussion/argument fascinates me in the lack of perspective some posters seem to have regarding FUN. I now drive a 07 MCS after owning not one, but two Neons. It is unfathomable to me that negative comments can be found in context with MINIs. You want bad? Drive a low end Chrysler!!!! You'll never speak/post a bad word about ANY version of MINI again.

poyzin

 

I think BMW should think about resurrecting the R53, maybe as a "classic" specialty model (I'm sure the marketing guys at MINIUSA can come up with the appropriate song and dance). Otherwise, they're just leaving money on the table from people like me who were looking forward to buying the next iteration but decided to skip it. I bet they could even charge a premium...

 

Your logic is infallible. *sighs*

 

______________________________

...don't get your shorts twisted clubby.....by "unqualified" i mean that 99% of this entire thread is subjective....it is hard to argue subjectivity, as has been alluded to in a number of posts herein......the "BS" I referred to is related to "my opinion counts more than yours" ........deciding on which car to buy is arguably the most subjective decision anyone ever makes, continued refinement of the 1st gen Mini is not in the business plan for a lot of reasons , mainly because it would lead to ever decreasing car sales....car sales and subjectivity are related..... like i said , it's an interesting discussion for the entertainment value

 

I originally wrote:
Note the first two words ... For me

My personal opinion, subjective of course!

 

Never happen, one design changes for some of the new regulations that are now in the new R56. Two, engine, China now owns the tritec factory in brazil and are pumping out cars for their masses, and also emissions, the tritec is horrible and I don't think current or future emissions regulations will allow it in the future. Third, they'd have to totally retool part of their line to build it, an enormous cost for a very small market, given the increase in sales for the 07 model year.

 

I doubt we will see this happen... but we can hope that BMW can return the next generation MINI back closer to its roots. Removing the 4wd stance, fake hood scoop, pie sized speedo, and awkwardly angled head lights would be a good design start. Combine this with return of handling characteristics and mannerisms of the R53, engineering uniqueness such as super charging, and proportions that perfectly blend and match, would go a long ways to returning R53 owners to the fold.

Problem is, design parameters such as these cost $$... and BMW elected to take the R56 in a different direction. With the R56, they moved towards the broader "camry" market segment and away from the narrower enthusiast segment. Perhaps in time, the MINI brand will diversify enough that BMW will once again make an offering targeted directly at the enthusiast... time will tell.

 

or some of the hopped up SRT ones. And guess what? The Neon, while a rather pedestrian car, actually did a lot to save Chrysler, and pretty much every car company took it or several apart to see all the new manufacturing techniques that went into it.

But yeah, the base neon was pretty bland to drive....

Matt

 

Chrysler has done this before, there was the K cars, then the Mini vans, a K car frame, bigger box. I had a K car wagon in the 80s, bland, yes, but cheap and I could haul kids and dogs in it. Built for the masses.

I don't think the 2nd gen MINI is headed in this direction, except that a Clubman will haul more stuff

Just my take on the subject, which is not worth arguing about, as it means nothing in the grand scheme of things.
Mark

 

I could see the GP being highly sought after at some point, but R53 in general? No. I think the qualities that might make it unique, while not lost on enthusiasts of the model, are being over-stated a bit.

 

Could you imagine if they resurrected the e30 M3! People all want the 1-series to be a 2002 resurrection, when in reality, it's the size of an E46 coupe.

It'll never happen, but I'm with ya 911fan.

mb

 

It seems to me that the R53's are holding their value quite nicely, considering it is a now obsolete design. I drove an R56 for 2 weeks, decided it just wasn't for me. I liked the seats, but the rest, not so much. Rode too much like a Camry. Nice and smooth, but just was not as "connected". Felt way too German, not enough Brit! I am now actively looking for another R53 for the family

 

The entire first series MINI is on the path to becoming a classic... the R56 release with its new direction geared towards "camry" type masses, has both assured and accelerated this movement.

 

Have anyone of you actually driven a Camry? I currently have one sitting in my garage. It's my dads & I'm selling it for him. I've gotta tell you, to compare an R56 to a Camry is one heck of an large insult. The only similarity is the number of wheels each has. The R56 is a fine car. The Camry is an appliance. They shoulda called it the Maytag. Some feel the R56 love others don't. Me, well I drive an R53 & love it. But I can see me in an R56 in the future.

Now you folks who think your R53 is going to be a classic?? I just don't think so, but the GP may be. Though it will be a very long time from now. I'm not going to worry about it.

 

my R53 IS classic! because it is mine, modded the way i want, and is unique.. because it is mine!

 

Yes I understand. All our MINI's are classics, as are their owners.

And I'm sure you understand what I meant.

 

The design parameters are shared between the R56 and the camry... they are automobiles designed with the masses in mind. Behaviors and characteristics are broadened to appeal to a wider audience, vs. targeted at a narrower enthusiast segment. With the R56, costs and production viability drove design... bean counters had a large voice, resulting in design by committee compromise. One only needs to casually examine the R56 to see the results of the bean counters input.

The R53 was destined to become a classic in the design studio... just as the R56 was destined to be just another car for the masses... due to its design parameters.