Originally Posted by slag1911

Sorry, I can't take credit for "French Fryer"... that was skiploder..

I also can't claim credit for "piston slap"... that was Peugeot..

As for "ugly"... just use your own eyes...

Originally Posted by Dr Obnxs

how little content can turn into so many pages of endless debate. What we all know to be subjective value judgements keep going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going with about as much productivity as this last sentence.

Matt

Originally Posted by Dr Obnxs

and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going, and going.....

Matt

Originally Posted by ClubmanS

Censor, censor, censor after all who wants to hear they have an ugly girlfriend?

Originally Posted by BSUCardinalfan

Which observations? The length of service time of each engine? Already shown that they will have the same service time. You chose not to respond once that was pointed out.

Design compromises in the sake of cost/appeal to wider audience/profit? I think WAY back in this thread it was made pretty clear why some of the design changes were made, and also that it is pretty important for the company to make money so that they can continue to build cars. And the fact that they'd be stupid to design a car that was difficult to manufacture.

Magazine reviews/comparos? Already shown that both cars have finished 3rd in comparos (actually, the 2006 R53 was 3rd of 3, while the 07 was 3rd of 4. At least it beat somthing!) Again, you chose not to respond once it was pointed out.

R56 engine source? Already shown that the Prince is at least built by MINI, not in south america. You've chosen not to respond.

Actual comparison of the engines in a relative sense? The Prince wins on emmissions, efficiency, power, torque, and weight. The tritec wins on sound. The jury is still out on longevity and mod-ability. You've chosen not to respond to the question of why wouldn't a 'driver's car' have the more powerful engine.

Engine collaboration? As I've explained, this is normal business practice. You've chosen not to respond.

So what do you have left? A few people that rate steering feel and engine note over actual performance (which I don't have a problem with, that is their preference) so they go back to the R53. A few early engine troubles with the R56. Interestingly there were a few early engine troubles with the Tritec as well. Seems about a wash.

All you've done is move from one false or (at the best) misleading statement to another to try make a point. Each time, it has been pointed out that you are incorrect/twisting reality to match your argument. This started out talking about which car was a 'driver's car'. Now the "The R56 isn't a real MINI" crowd has had to move on to "the engine is no good".

Your contribution thus far has been 'French Fryer', "piston slap", and 'it's ugly'.

And you still haven't answered the questions people have asked about whether or not you have a MINI at all.

Based on all of this, yes, I can only conclude that you are a troll.

Originally Posted by BSUCardinalfan

Great, so you've made NO contributions to the thread.

Well, except for trolling.

Originally Posted by HiCLiketheDrink

I bet that would be an interesting thread...

"How would you respond if someone called your Significant Other 'ugly'?"

Originally Posted by HiCLiketheDrink

I bet that would be an interesting thread...

"How would you respond if someone called your Significant Other 'ugly'?"

Originally Posted by Skiploder

Apparently, judging by the way some people around here fall to pieces when someone criticizes their car, this thread should give you a pretty good idea.

Originally Posted by SuperModsquad

Is it just me that finds it a bit odd to complain that the R56S hoodscoop is for aesthetic purposes only? Seriously, do these enthusiasts wring their hands with malaise as they walk past their R53's newly applied racing stripes to offer a mental reprimand to MINI for such abomination?

Very odd...like 7

Originally Posted by SuperModsquad

Is it just me that finds it a bit odd to complain that the R56S hoodscoop is for aesthetic purposes only? Seriously, do these enthusiasts wring their hands with malaise as they walk past their R53's newly applied racing stripes to offer a mental reprimand to MINI for such abomination?

Very odd...like 7

Originally Posted by HiCLiketheDrink

Although I don't share that view as far as caring about scoops on the R53 vs R56, I think the general consensus among those who feel strongly about it is because of the difference between what a scoop and something like racing stripes are for.

The primary purpose of racing stripes would be to modify the appearance of the car, while the primary purpose of the scoop is to allow outside air a way into the engine bay and to whatever engine internals and etc.

I think the gripe is using the scoop for its aesthetic value, rather than for its intended function.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it's just what I've seen and heard at least.

Originally Posted by lotsie

This would likely be viewed as a personal attack, which could lead to an infraction.

Mark

Originally Posted by LynnEl

Even if you are correct, what about the spoiler. At best, the stock spoiler serves no meaningful purpose on the street Mini. At worse, it actually increases drag. And don't say it's there to keep the rear clean. We all know that's bull and even if it were ture, it does a lousy job of it.

Originally Posted by LynnEl

Even if you are correct, what about the spoiler. At best, the stock spoiler serves no meaningful purpose on the street Mini. At worse, it actually increases drag. And don't say it's there to keep the rear clean. We all know that's bull and even if it were ture, it does a lousy job of it.

Originally Posted by Skiploder

If Slag has pushed you to the point where you need to respond to his criticism of an inanimate object by calling him a name - maybe you need to ignore the thread.

I took plenty of crap over the years I owned my R53 about it being a clown car, a chick's car, etc and it never caused me to question my purchase or throw an e-fit and respond by calling names. Grow up.

The power and torque produce by the PSA engine is impressive - it's relatively lightweight and packs a bevy of technological features.

Unfortunately, under the bonnet heat management issues and early bugaboos such as the "piston slap" have arisen. Additionally, BMW severed their relationship with Peugeot before the new model was even a year old.

Considering the amount of time and effort spend on designing and testing this engine, that move is a wee bit suspicious. Maybe it's something innocent and simple - maybe it's not. Either way it will be interested to see what the driving factors for the breakup in the PSA relationship were.

All of you who somehow take offense that Slag and others are pointing out that the R56 was designed for a broader mass-market appeal need to do a reality check - that was BMW's stated goal with the R56. Throwing a fit and calling someone a troll for pointing this out is, well, trollish.

FWIW, neither car was loved by the press. Both iterations have been called out for having cartoon styling and for lagging behind the competitors. With the first gen being slightly more tightly focused and more of a niche car, the criticism was understandable. However, when a manufacturer redesigns the car to compete more directly with the likes of an older GTI design and it still gets it's lunch handed to it - obviously the goal wasn't reached.

Originally Posted by trackster

Slagg I will have to assume you didn't read my previous post as you have ignored it completely . Here it is again for you to ponder.

First off I have a R-53 and have no thought of going to a R-56 but not for any of the reasons you are harping on . You keep talking about the Prince engine being dumped in 5 years . There wasn't that much whining when the R-53 power plant was scrapped after almost the same time period why is it such a big deal now . As for the Tritec having the ability to be heavily modded it needs to be to keep up with that damn Prince. You will need a good head, exhaust , CAI and tuning to be even with a stock one .If they add a $600 unichip you won't have a shot at all. You are on such a mission to put the R-56 down one would think you may have tried to keep up with one and didn't make out that well. That is if you actually do have a Mini , Do you ? You keep mentioning that a few have gone from a R-56 to a R - 53. Have you compared that number to those that have gone from a R-53 to R -56 ?

Additionally I really have to laugh when I hear the " ugly " comments. I would think that 75% of Mini owners or former ones such as yourself would have a hard time picking out a R-56 verses a R-53 . For non owners, such as yourself , the percentage is most likely above 90%. If the R-56 is such a ugly duckling can then what does it make the R-53 ? Seriously the average " man on the street ' can't tell them apart so if one is as ugly as you say then to most people they all are.

Originally Posted by BSUCardinalfan

He's not interested in discussion, he knows he has no points, and is 'facts' as he puts them are easily shown to be false.

So as to not call him a name, and get skiploader angry, I'll just say this:

slags post are only for the purpose of trolling for responses, so in that way I guess he feels happy about himself. since he isn't a MINI owner (and doesn't want to acknowledge it in this thread) he is apparently only here to feed his own ego.

at this point, I feel sorry for him, to be so worked up about a marque that he isn't even interested in enough to own.

Originally Posted by Skiploder

Trolls are both ugly and stupid so maybe the Crack Moderation Team should give BSUCardinalFan TWO infractions for continually calling Slag a troll.

Toodles,

Skip

Originally Posted by trackster

Slagg I will have to assume you didn't read my previous post as you have ignored it completely . Here it is again for you to ponder.

First off I have a R-53 and have no thought of going to a R-56 but not for any of the reasons you are harping on . You keep talking about the Prince engine being dumped in 5 years . There wasn't that much whining when the R-53 power plant was scrapped after almost the same time period why is it such a big deal now . As for the Tritec having the ability to be heavily modded it needs to be to keep up with that damn Prince. You will need a good head, exhaust , CAI and tuning to be even with a stock one .If they add a $600 unichip you won't have a shot at all. You are on such a mission to put the R-56 down one would think you may have tried to keep up with one and didn't make out that well. That is if you actually do have a Mini , Do you ? You keep mentioning that a few have gone from a R-56 to a R - 53. Have you compared that number to those that have gone from a R-53 to R -56 ?

Additionally I really have to laugh when I hear the " ugly " comments. I would think that 75% of Mini owners or former ones such as yourself would have a hard time picking out a R-56 verses a R-53 . For non owners, such as yourself , the percentage is most likely above 90%. If the R-56 is such a ugly duckling can then what does it make the R-53 ? Seriously the average " man on the street ' can't tell them apart so if one is as ugly as you say then to most people they all are.