I checked back until April & didn't see a discussion of this. So I'm wondering....

Will people with the regular R56S, CAI & exhaust (whether just cat-bak or also TBE mandatory I don't know) be able to 'push' the engine to higher output via an aggressive re-map or piggy-back, then making the same ECU change to a factory JCW car? (w/ECU re-map or piggy-back specific to the needs of the JCW car of course)

The Factory JCW runs boost @ 1.3bar. Stock, it flows a lot more air then the stock R56S's engine. But add the Stage 1 kit o the regular R5S and it's near the same. Now, whether what i'm about to say is true or not I'm not sure, but many are saying that 19'ish psi is pushing the limits of 'airflow efficiency' of the stock turbo And with the Works engine's different pistons (rods? crank?) making for a lower compression chamber and boost already @ 1.3bar, will it be harder to get more output from the JCW engine then a regular R56S starting w/a higher compression chamber?

I did buy the Factory JCW to have a car that's got "just a bit more", but still be covered under warranty. But over time, I'm sure I'll be doing a UniChip or other similar (once avail for that engine). So, Wondering if it will be 'harder' or even not possible to push that engine to output as much as the regular R56S that starts at a higher compression?

thanx for your thoughts,
-steve

 

Interesting post and I hope someone answers your question! I have limited knowledge related to cars, but I'm looking forward to learning everything I can about my JCW!

 

To quickly answer your question, yes it will be harder to get the same difference in power available to the R56S owner.

However, there still can be a change. It looks like we can get a good gain at both the lower RPM range and the upper RPM range, but peak power may be close to the same. All of this is from ECU only. That will still make for a significantly quicker car, and that didn't touch the intercooler yet, so there is still more room for improvement.

Hope that helps!
Randy

 

The turbo is bigger or has different internals as well (I think), so you might see it turning up on stock R56 Cooper S's for higher peak figures. But who knows!

 

Thanx Randy... sure, everything helps. Thanx!.

Ben, that's something I'm not sure of. I have heard that said. But, I have only read that the air-flow path thru-out is free'er flowing (vital to start with for a good F/I engine) and the turbo has been "adapted", but "how" I have not read; is it a higher volume unit or is it just a 'lighter'"rotational assembly? I sure hope/wish it is, but @ this point I'm leaning towards "it's not". From the press release This is in a few places I imagine, but the easiest to find was:
http://www.motoringfile.com/2008/02/...info-released/

 

I just got notice this thread was moved to this Forum.

I thought I'd use the reminder of its existence to add & correct, that the turbo used is larger ... not based on anything directly from MINI but based on the non-ambiguous statements to that regard in numerous "1st look" reviews on or just after launch date.

 

The turbo is internally larger but not externally.

 

why not pull the heat shield off and look to see exactly what turbo is present on the JCW. Then compare it to the turbo on the S. Then just find the flow rates online and compare the two.

BlitZ

 

In my opinion, I think the JCW is going to be much better to mod than the S.

Maybe you won't see as much gain from simple mods like intake or exhaust, or ecu, but with "big boy" mods, I think the JCW is going to be the car to get.

All the internals are changed and beefed up and the compression ratio has already been lowered. So, I would think doing something that will run high boost, such as a bigger turbo kit, will be much better on the JCW vs the S. The engine will be able to take higher boost levels more effectively.

This is not to say that the S can't with some changes, but the JCW just seems like a better starting place to me to get some possibly big numbers one day.

 

PSI alone is not a good indicator of performance increase. PSI (or Bar) in this case is really just a measure of restriction. It's the pressure level of air that is WAITING to get into the chambers. If the turbo has more capability of flowing more air over a regular S turbo and you are using the same manifold on both cars, then the PSI level will definitely be higher than the stock S. Does it effect modability? No. You will probably see higher gains from the car that has more restriction on it. (AKA the higher PSI car.)

The real number to watch for on a cars performance capabilities is the CFM. Or Cubic Feet per Minute of Air that can be put into the combustion chamber to mix with fuel and create the combustion that creates the power. More air=more fuel=more power. If the CFM rating of the JCW turbo is higher (and it could be deducted that it is given the higher pressure rating on a very similar intake manifold.), it will be capable of making more power than a stock Cooper S turbo.

 

As far as ECU only tuning options go, it might be harder to yield bigger gains because the tuning is already more performance oriented. However when you really start changing parts out and making bigger power, the more desirable turbo will be the JCW.

And just a Pet Peeve. The measurement of pressure is not a good indicator of power capabilities. It's a measurement of resistance if you think about it. It's the pressure exerted on the intake manifold by air waiting to get into the combustion chambers. As we add more and more PSI, yes you theoretically are doing so by increasing the volume of air in a confined space, but the better number to watch for is the CFM of Air available. A car is pretty much only as fast as its weakest link. If the air intake can only supply so much CFM, thats the most power you are going to make. If you rectify that problem it continues to go from there. The weakest link may become a restrictive manifold, or the turbo itself or the cylinder head's port designs.