Well I drove to Philly Monday morning. The day was beautiful and I just motored along (But my mini was hungry and ate a tissue along the way). I got down to Helix around 1:00pm. We chatted for a bit and then while Eric took care of some Mail order stuff, Chris and I went to Lunch (Thanks for the Tour of the North side and the good diner food..MMM Cheese Steak and Fries). After Lunch we went back to the shop and the work began on my car.

Here are the before photos:




Just look at Chris and Eric Go at it:



They installed some H&R springs




And some RDR Adjustable Rear Control Arms . (Very race inspired)

Take note of the bracket to keep the DSC and headlight adjustment


While we were there I had some new Brake pads installed to. EBC green stuff (front) Mintex (rear).



Here it is all completed.
mmmmmmmmmm nice ride height






After it was all done Eric took it for a RIDE. We had one issue with noise but that was from a loose Front sway bar Mount on the drivers side strut tower. It seems that some suspension work was done before on my car (I bought it used) and during the work the Sway bar mount lossened up some more (Spending some cash at HELIX Minisport is a good thing).

I was an enjoyable ride home and broke in my New brake Pads with gentle breaking from 55 to 20 numerous times and no hard stops. Wow the car actually stops now. I can't wait to Upgrade to the Stainless Lines and do some more work to my MINI. Hmm Strut Brace.... Camber Plates? Exhuast?

I would Personally like to thanks Chris and Eric for taking there time to work on my car and do an Excellent Job and letting me do some work in there office. And for Eric and Chris for making sure all was ok before I headed home (3 hour Drive).

If you are ever in Philly. Give them a call and stop by.
www.helix13.com

_________________
Doug


When in doubt, Choose the burrit

 

Great pictures, doug!!! Seeing those shots of the Helix building and of Chris whirring under your car make me want to get back there soon to do some more mods.

I was wondering how you liked the springs. With all of Randy's recommendations for the H-sport, I've been tempted to buy them from him and have him ship them to Helix so they can do the installation. Is this crazy or should I just get the H+R Springs that Helix already has?

 

Well the spring choice is up to you. I was in the same position also and I have heard good things about both.

I choose H&R cause of there reputation (in the industry) and have heard many good things from friends who have them on there cars (VW's). Plus I wanted to assurance if there was a problem thatHelix Minisport would be able to take care of it ASAP.

 

After a few days i'd love to hear your impressions of the EBC pads. Thats one of the bazillion things that I'd love to do.

 

well i will have to go for another drive tomorrow. So far I like them. The Brakes definately have more BITE.

 

Doug,
Great report & pics. Very inspiring. I'll be interested to hear how the EBC/Mintex combination works, particularly if you do any track days at the Glen, Summit Point or Pocono. Most importantly, inquiring minds want to know if Helix recommend PAT's for cheesesteaks, the place across from PAT's or another place?

 

The place accross the street from Pat's is Gino's. They are both very good but a bit of a hike from Helix (practically on the other side of the city) However Yards brewery is right next door.

I recommend Pat's AND Gino's.... ahhh the wonders of going to college in Philly. Though if I had to go to one I would probably go to Pat's but that's just a personal opinion and can spark bigger flame wars than CVT vs. Manual transmissions.

Anyway, the guys at Helix are really great and I'm sad I will have to be moving out of the Philly area come June.

Also how do you like the EBC Green stuff pads? I've seen them advertised a lot but mostly for low brake dust. However, I'm more concerned with performance. Any reason you didn't go with them for the Rear and went with the Mintex instead? I know Randy recommends the Fedora but I'm still not sure what I want to do with the brakes. Let us know how they work out for you.
-Chris

 

>>Great pictures, doug!!! Seeing those shots of the Helix building and of Chris whirring under your car make me want to get back there soon to do some more mods.
>>
>>I was wondering how you liked the springs. With all of Randy's recommendations for the H-sport, I've been tempted to buy them from him and have him ship them to Helix so they can do the installation. Is this crazy or should I just get the H+R Springs that Helix already has?


Hi Kim,

Did we mention that the H&R springs are green?

 

I would like to hear your about any change in brake dust with the EBC/Mintex combination of brakes. Please give us an update. Thanks. Jon

 

>>>>Great pictures, doug!!! Seeing those shots of the Helix building and of Chris whirring under your car make me want to get back there soon to do some more mods.
>>>>
>>>>I was wondering how you liked the springs. With all of Randy's recommendations for the H-sport, I've been tempted to buy them from him and have him ship them to Helix so they can do the installation. Is this crazy or should I just get the H+R Springs that Helix already has?
>>
>>
>>Hi Kim,
>>
>>Did we mention that the H&R springs are green?

I DID notice that in Doug's pictures
What I'm interested in even more than matching undies is a little better handling, especially when I finally decide on which 17" wheels to put on. Would you put the H-sport springs on if I had Randy ship them to you??

 

Well "inquiring minds want to know if Helix recommend PAT's for cheesesteaks, the place across from PAT's or another place?" We only went to a diner since the good Cheese Steak place was on the South side of town. I think I recall Chris saying something about that is the Heart of Cheese Steak country, But then again I was eating so it went in one ear and out another.

I went with the EBC Green/mintex combo becuase they did not have EBC Green for the rear. I also fealt that the back brakes do not do as much of the breaking and the cost of the ebc's vs mintex was more so I went with the mintex.

Ferrado's are great pads (used them on my VW) but I did not want to spend that much on Pads just yet. The EBc's seam nice and I will keep everyone informed.

 

I've had the EBC Green pads on the front of my MCS for a couple of months now. Had them done @ Helix along with the slotted rotors, ss brake lines, and super blue brake fluid.
My impressions: Definite better bite and less brake dust. Best of both worlds.

PS. I cannot recommed Helix enough to anyone within a day's drive. Eric and Chris are great guys and they do fantastic work.

 

We have tested on track with the Ferodo pads and the EBC Greens and Reds. Here are my thoughts:

For those of you not worried about track days, the EBC is a cheaper pad that definitely reduces dust. Even with the Red compound though, it does not hold up on the track.

There are two different Ferodo compounds, the DS2500 and the DS3000. I have done extensive testing using both in endurance tests on the track. I have been more than happy with the performance of these pads. They do cost more - much more similar in price to a true track pad - so if you aren't planning on doing track work, the EBCs should be fine. The DS2500 is a perfect dual purpose pad wiht a low heat requirement to achive the highest mu value - which is impressive for a 150F starting temp at .52. The DS300 is more of a track dedicated pad, as it requires more heat to reach the optimum coeffeicient of friction - around 230F - but it is a higher mu of .62. The cost is higher for the DS3000 also.

To break it down:

EBC Green - good street only pad that reduces dust and improves bite slightly over the stock pads
EBC Red - not recommended
DS2500 - Good dual purpose or street only pad with less dust, better bite, high operating temp flexibility, and good coefficient of friction.
DS3000 - Track pad that works extremely well for that condition

Ferodo has a pad for the front and rear in the DS2500 and the front only in the DS30000 (the 3000 would be unnecessary in the rear becasue of the heat ranges).

EBC has front only pads.


I have had the H&Rs and H-Sports on for track testing, and I have to say that the H-Sports are a better set. I had the H&Rs on the car for 6 months, and have no complaints about them - in fact, because I can't keep the H-Sports in stock, I have them on my car right now (the LEDAs are in the UK getting revalved - still working on those!) and still I am happy with them. I just think the H-Sports are better - they have better spring rates, they have better ride height front to rear, and they include new bump stops to give more travel back. My $.02. I still carry the H&Rs and the H-Sports simply because of brand loyalty. There are plenty of folks out there familiar with H&R's name and will buy because of that. That is totally fine.

It is great having guys like Helix around to be MINI specific! I don't have to go to NY for a pulley install party!! I can't recommend them enough to folks in the tri-state area. They are the only other shop in the country doing as many mods to the cars and specializing only in the MINI - great work guys!

 

>>Great pictures, doug!!! Seeing those shots of the Helix building and of Chris whirring under your car make me want to get back there soon to do some more mods.
>>
>>I was wondering how you liked the springs. With all of Randy's recommendations for the H-sport, I've been tempted to buy them from him and have him ship them to Helix so they can do the installation. Is this crazy or should I just get the H+R Springs that Helix already has?

Hi Kim,

We can provide you with either the H &R or H-sports spring directly. We carry them both.

As Far as the burning chessesteak question, I am a fan of Geno's lately. We had some of the guys from LI down a few weeks ago and I think that they are in line with me on this. That said , Eric is a fan of Jim's and Tony Luke's can not be ruled out. Please feel free to come and find out for yourself. :smile:


Stock street pads have a typical friction level of .25-.35 friction factor.
The EBC Greenstuff has a level of .46 friction factor, this is a good bit more than a small improvment over the stock pad. Remember that friction level is only an "indicator" not a guaranty of brake torque. There are many factors that work into a maxium braking formula. We have had very good feedback on the EBC Redstuff pads as well. Unlike the past post I would recommend them for people using their street cars for a trackday. We do carry the Ferodo's for people who are looking for them.

 

Thanks Chris, I'll be calling you soon to schedule the H-sport job. With all the cheesesteak talk, I'll have to make a mid-day appointment and have lunch when I'm there.

 

>>Thanks Chris, I'll be calling you soon to schedule the H-sport job. With all the cheesesteak talk, I'll have to make a mid-day appointment and have lunch when I'm there.


Great! Eric and will more than likely join you on the chesesteak run into South Philly, it is a tough job but... well you know the rest.

 

You are absolutely right Chris. There are a ton of factors to making the pad a good one.

These are the reasons I like the Ferodos (and I'm happy to hear you carry them as well).

DS2500

mu value of .52 at 150F

Very constant coeffeicient (the mu value) over the entire heat range (an application range of over 900F).

35% less compressibility than comparable products

DS3000

mu value of .62 at 200F

Again, constant coefficient to a temp of over 1100F

Better compresibility

Predictability due to the flat friction curve

Less residual torque



These are the pads I recommend for the track, after testing the products on the track under several different condition - including endurance tests of over 1 hour on track periods.

The EBC is a great pad for the street. They are cheaper than the Ferodos, and if you aren't hitting the track, the Ferodos are wated money. If you want the best dual purpose pad though, the DS2500 is the way to go.

Here are the reasons I like the EBC pads

Lower cost
Greatly reduced dust
Better bite than the stock pad (which actually has a pretty high coefficient of friction for a stock pad)

I don't mean to step on toes, but I just disagree slightly with the EBCs being a good track pad based on the experience we have with them at the track.

Did I mention that I really like the guys at Helix for the great work they have been doing in the MINI community - and that I recommend all of my customers in the North East to them for any work :smile: ?

Randy

 

No toes stepped on here, just a difference of opinion. No worries, Randy. Thank you for the kind words about our shop. :smile:

 

Well Im all scheduled to have my H&R springs put on next Tuesday. Looking foward to the trip down to Philly and to see the Helix people again. Was great seeing their car at the Bear Mt meet.

 

Randy...at one point you said that you don't recommend the EBC Redstuff...any reasons? Is the red more track-oriented than the green, putting it in the DS2500 arena where it doesn't perform as well?

 

Will there be a cheesesteak challenge @ the May 24th gathering?

--
Cheese(Steak)

 

I don't recommend the Reds for track use because of some issues we've seen with them cracking (we have seen the same thing with the stock pads as well).

If you are going with just street pads, the DS2500 or the Greens are a decent choice. Because of the results we've seen from the track data, and the low operating temp for full mu value, I like the Ferodo 2500s the best for all applications - street and dual purpose street/track. The Greens are cheaper though, and I know that is a big consideration for a lot of people - so that's why I say that if you aren't doing any track work, and just want reduced dust, the EBCs are fine.

Hope that helps!

Randy

PS - If you have other quesitons on the pads, just start another thread - I think I have totally hijacked this one and didn't mean to. Thanks!

 

>>
>>
>>Will there be a cheesesteak challenge @ the May 24th gathering?
>>
>>--
>>Cheese(Steak)
>>
>>

Sounds like a Great Idea to me :smile: