Drivetrain RMW Street Header Dyno
2nd Gear
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 148
Likes: 0
From: Maple Shade, NJ
My little dose of LITHIUM
iTrader: (1)
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,435
Likes: 2
From: Albuquerque New Mexico
Hey, let's remember this is one observation. Recall all the claims about ICs--all based on single observations, or multiple observations on single units with no controls.
There isn't a scientist in the world who would base any conclusions on the data presented here on NAM (and as a Dean of Research at UNM, I stand by that claim).
Until we have multiple observations made in controlled environments, this is simply one single observation, one data point.
Interesting?-- yes.
Conclusive?-- no.
Indicative?-- now that's the grey area into which only fools would tread...
Back to normal transmission
There isn't a scientist in the world who would base any conclusions on the data presented here on NAM (and as a Dean of Research at UNM, I stand by that claim).
Until we have multiple observations made in controlled environments, this is simply one single observation, one data point.
Interesting?-- yes.
Conclusive?-- no.
Indicative?-- now that's the grey area into which only fools would tread...
Back to normal transmission
6th Gear
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,097
Likes: 8
From: Knoxville, TN
.
I'm not questioning anyone's integrity...i'm just saying that this "professional" race team obviously has to have some kind of agreement/sponsorship with RMW to be running his header, and they are not going to bad mouth it publicly regardless if it makes more power or not.
Why would a professional race team accept sponsorship and parts from a company that makes a useless and inferior product? Isn't a professional race team's goal to win races and not recieve free products?
I can't see how the RMW header would lose power with such a fantastic design merge collector and reverse cone. It uses a proper merge spike for a minimum of merge turbulence, something no other header maker for the MINI offers. The RMW header is straight out of an exhaust how-to-do-it-right book. I can't explain the basically same dyno curve as stock, but my hunch says something else was amiss. Does the OP have any additional datalogging for those dyno pulls? The stock header is hardly a triumph of design, though it's not as garbage as some OEM "manifolds".
Also - I don't think RSR is using the street header (please correct me if I am wrong)
Please compare apples to apple.. Street header is not the race header which - while similar - are very different.
Please compare apples to apple.. Street header is not the race header which - while similar - are very different.
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...ts-gp0734.html
I spent some time this morning looking through forum posts about the RMW headers. Damn there's a crap load of them... Funny thing is, out of all of them this one is the only one that actually shows or talks about loss that I could find
I spent some time this morning looking through forum posts about the RMW headers. Damn there's a crap load of them... Funny thing is, out of all of them this one is the only one that actually shows or talks about loss that I could find
I can't see how the RMW header would lose power with such a fantastic design merge collector and reverse cone. It uses a proper merge spike for a minimum of merge turbulence, something no other header maker for the MINI offers. The RMW header is straight out of an exhaust how-to-do-it-right book. I can't explain the basically same dyno curve as stock, but my hunch says something else was amiss. Does the OP have any additional datalogging for those dyno pulls? The stock header is hardly a triumph of design, though it's not as garbage as some OEM "manifolds".
I think I am one of the only people that has done a before and after dyno run on the same exact day with no modification changes with a car that is already tuned.
I was already tuned for the optimal flowing intake and exhaust system, somehow that tune carried over with the stock manifold and worked just as well. Quite confusing, but the numbers don't lie.
This is one of those "YMMV" type things honestly
I was already tuned for the optimal flowing intake and exhaust system, somehow that tune carried over with the stock manifold and worked just as well. Quite confusing, but the numbers don't lie.
This is one of those "YMMV" type things honestly
One other conversation item is the 1.625" primaries possibly being too large for a stock/non big valve head?
The dip in the top-end suggests that possibly the head can not flow enough for the header?
The dip in the top-end suggests that possibly the head can not flow enough for the header?
Hey, let's remember this is one observation. Recall all the claims about ICs--all based on single observations, or multiple observations on single units with no controls.
There isn't a scientist in the world who would base any conclusions on the data presented here on NAM (and as a Dean of Research at UNM, I stand by that claim).
Until we have multiple observations made in controlled environments, this is simply one single observation, one data point.
Interesting?-- yes.
Conclusive?-- no.
Indicative?-- now that's the grey area into which only fools would tread...
Back to normal transmission
There isn't a scientist in the world who would base any conclusions on the data presented here on NAM (and as a Dean of Research at UNM, I stand by that claim).
Until we have multiple observations made in controlled environments, this is simply one single observation, one data point.
Interesting?-- yes.
Conclusive?-- no.
Indicative?-- now that's the grey area into which only fools would tread...
Back to normal transmission
RMW vs stock is virtually flat?
RMW vs OBX thread showed a 20hp gain?
OBX vs stock (old) thread showed a 2 hp /8TQ gain?
I'm afraid we will all go to our graves never knowing.
I'm not questioning anyone's integrity...i'm just saying that this "professional" race team obviously has to have some kind of agreement/sponsorship with RMW to be running his header, and they are not going to bad mouth it publicly regardless if it makes more power or not.
There are no impartial participants in this thread; it pretty much has to be taken with a grain of salt.
Only way to definitively tell would be for someone completely independent from RMW or Mynes to run and tune the car with both sets of headers on the same car, same day/conditions and dyno.
Ain't going to happen.
My little dose of LITHIUM
iTrader: (1)
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,435
Likes: 2
From: Albuquerque New Mexico
We can speculate about this all day long (and please do, if you feel so inclined...) but this data point is in, sealed and delivered. ...and there's no doubt the RMW header is very well designed and built.
Let me offer another observation, based on 3 cars, (03,04,05) same dyno, same day. Each with stock head, essentially same CAI, one with a DFIC, others with stock IC. Two with RMW/Newman cams, one with Nitrostick. One with ceramic coated inside and out CMC header, race cat and straight 2.5" exhaust (clearly the least restrictive), one with RMW shorty and Miltek catback (I think wrt catback), and the other with $2 Chinese AMK header and Miltek catback.
All 3 cars running 550cc injectors, tuned by Mynes. All got within 3 HP of each other, and very close in torque. On that dyno on that day, 3 ostensibly different cars produced almost identical numbers. What contributed to what?? I have no friggin clue...
Let me offer another observation, based on 3 cars, (03,04,05) same dyno, same day. Each with stock head, essentially same CAI, one with a DFIC, others with stock IC. Two with RMW/Newman cams, one with Nitrostick. One with ceramic coated inside and out CMC header, race cat and straight 2.5" exhaust (clearly the least restrictive), one with RMW shorty and Miltek catback (I think wrt catback), and the other with $2 Chinese AMK header and Miltek catback.
All 3 cars running 550cc injectors, tuned by Mynes. All got within 3 HP of each other, and very close in torque. On that dyno on that day, 3 ostensibly different cars produced almost identical numbers. What contributed to what?? I have no friggin clue...
We can speculate about this all day long (and please do, if you feel so inclined...) but this data point is in, sealed and delivered. ...and there's no doubt the RMW header is very well designed and built.
Let me offer another observation, based on 3 cars, (03,04,05) same dyno, same day. Each with stock head, essentially same CAI, one with a DFIC, others with stock IC. Two with RMW/Newman cams, one with Nitrostick. One with ceramic coated inside and out CMC header, race cat and straight 2.5" exhaust (clearly the least restrictive), one with RMW shorty and Miltek catback (I think wrt catback), and the other with $2 Chinese AMK header and Miltek catback.
All 3 cars running 550cc injectors, tuned by Mynes. All got within 3 HP of each other, and very close in torque. On that dyno on that day, 3 ostensibly different cars produced almost identical numbers. What contributed to what?? I have no friggin clue...
Let me offer another observation, based on 3 cars, (03,04,05) same dyno, same day. Each with stock head, essentially same CAI, one with a DFIC, others with stock IC. Two with RMW/Newman cams, one with Nitrostick. One with ceramic coated inside and out CMC header, race cat and straight 2.5" exhaust (clearly the least restrictive), one with RMW shorty and Miltek catback (I think wrt catback), and the other with $2 Chinese AMK header and Miltek catback.
All 3 cars running 550cc injectors, tuned by Mynes. All got within 3 HP of each other, and very close in torque. On that dyno on that day, 3 ostensibly different cars produced almost identical numbers. What contributed to what?? I have no friggin clue...
The flip side of the coin is does Mynes have anything to gain or lose if the stock header does better than the RMW header? I think anyone looking at Myne's tuning a car with an RMW header, or RMW tuning a car with a Mynes header would have SOME degree of skepticism...
There are no impartial participants in this thread; it pretty much has to be taken with a grain of salt.
Only way to definitively tell would be for someone completely independent from RMW or Mynes to run and tune the car with both sets of headers on the same car, same day/conditions and dyno.
Ain't going to happen.
There are no impartial participants in this thread; it pretty much has to be taken with a grain of salt.
Only way to definitively tell would be for someone completely independent from RMW or Mynes to run and tune the car with both sets of headers on the same car, same day/conditions and dyno.
Ain't going to happen.
I will state it again, I am a completely un-biased customer. I have no reason to purchase an almost 900 dollar header (with shipping etc.) just to make my own car look bad?
Secondly - I use Mynes because they are local to me. I would have went with Jan if I were in California.
Lastly, my car made made good numbers with the header - you cannot discredit the tune. You would think the tune means more than the header honestly.
How many cars do you know making 220/183 with stock head and header?
Today I had an opportunity to do a back to back dyno of only one single component; that component being the RMW street header.
My local speed shop was willing to let me do a dyno run with the RMW Street header before I installed my stock exhaust manifold back in the car.
The current modifications on the car are as follow.
2005 JCW MCS
Alta JCW Air Filter
Alta Silicone Intake Tube
Newman Camshaft
Mynes Dyno Tune for RMW Header/Newman Cam
RMW Header / Stock Manifold
The only variance between this Dyno chart is just the exhaust manifold.
The final numbers are not really that important, but the "delta" between the two is what is important.
As you can see in the graph, the solid red line is the stock exhaust manifold while the dotted red line is the RMW Street Header.
Same goes with the torque - solid blue line is stock and dotted is RMW Street Header.
I have made the graph as large as the server allows, but if you can not read it - it basically shows that the stock exhaust manifold has both higher HP/TQ peak numbers, but also a smoother top and bottom end with the midrange being similar.
Prost
-M3NTAL-
My local speed shop was willing to let me do a dyno run with the RMW Street header before I installed my stock exhaust manifold back in the car.
The current modifications on the car are as follow.
2005 JCW MCS
Alta JCW Air Filter
Alta Silicone Intake Tube
Newman Camshaft
Mynes Dyno Tune for RMW Header/Newman Cam
RMW Header / Stock Manifold
The only variance between this Dyno chart is just the exhaust manifold.
The final numbers are not really that important, but the "delta" between the two is what is important.
As you can see in the graph, the solid red line is the stock exhaust manifold while the dotted red line is the RMW Street Header.
Same goes with the torque - solid blue line is stock and dotted is RMW Street Header.
I have made the graph as large as the server allows, but if you can not read it - it basically shows that the stock exhaust manifold has both higher HP/TQ peak numbers, but also a smoother top and bottom end with the midrange being similar.
Prost
-M3NTAL-
Your local speed shop is Mynes. You told me you hang out at the Mynes shop all the time. The last we talked you told me the AZ boys and the Mynes boys were giving you crap for having an RMW header. You said they were pressuring you to take the header off and put theirs on. Your words.
Now this
.Longboard
Wait. I re-read that and think the point you are trying to make is that - when over a few months ago - Mynes tuned my car to make my car have less power in 3 months when I decide to sell it I could go dyno the stock header and make more power? There was a secret code they put in the tune to make the car actually produce more power with a stock manifold?
Massive props to Mynes then for not only predicting the future, but also making it so customers don't even need to purchase headers?!
Alright - sarcasm over
I have given the best data I have seen on here and it still gets people in a hussy.
I will continue to respond as best as I can if there are any more legitimate questions.
Massive props to Mynes then for not only predicting the future, but also making it so customers don't even need to purchase headers?!
Alright - sarcasm over
I have given the best data I have seen on here and it still gets people in a hussy.
I will continue to respond as best as I can if there are any more legitimate questions.
Your local speed shop is Mynes. You told me you hang out at the Mynes shop all the time. The last we talked you told me the AZ boys and the Mynes boys were giving you crap for having an RMW header. You said they were pressuring you to take the header off and put theirs on. Your words.
Now this .
Longboard
Now this
.Longboard
Like I said, I have two friends that I've known longer than anyone at Mynes that I have used for my M3. They normally don't deal with MINIs, usually BMW/Porsche/Ferrari etc.
Sometimes you have to go to your friends shops who can let you use their equipment and time when they are slow.
As you can note - I do not have their header on my car and I have not had them re-tune my car for the stock manifold.
Any other questions about how friendly the people at Mynes are or how they stand behind their tunes?
Also, yes I did get some flak from some Arizona people about my bright yellow-ish Service Engine Soon light being on all the time.
Take a girl on a date with that and she thinks you can't afford to have your car fixed HA HA!
Take a girl on a date with that and she thinks you can't afford to have your car fixed HA HA!
Your local speed shop is Mynes. You told me you hang out at the Mynes shop all the time. The last we talked you told me the AZ boys and the Mynes boys were giving you crap for having an RMW header. You said they were pressuring you to take the header off and put theirs on. Your words.
Now this .
Longboard
Now this
.Longboard
And for the record I like the sound and performance of my RMW header, I don't like having to have a yellow SES light in my car which has been there since the time I put the header on but I am told that it will be replaced.
While I am not taking girls on dates anymore because my GF frowns on it she is curious as to why my SES is always on. I told her it means my car is awesome.