I believe that with a proper tune my car will do 220whp at Edge; there is a lot of fuel being wasted. I'm sure if I went looking, I could find a dyno that would give my 250whp. We dyno'ed a stock JCW and got 178whp. The installed cost is about the same as the Cosworth and they claim the engine does 210hp. Maybe I should use MINI's dyno.

Steve

 

I am old school still do hand porting

These are all DYNO sheets... You have to show flow rates and the specifications on the finished head. Some people in this industry has everyone believing that the dyno is the new bible ?

What was physically wrong with the head?

 

Not sure what you are seeing? I think I see a 40 hp increase with essentially a head and pulley and most likley software that hurts more than it helps, not too bad.

 

There was obviously something wrong with his system or car. You can get his numbers without going to an aftermarket head.

Steve

 

Hey I don't get around or read as much as some of you. It is my new thing learned today.

 

Wasn't this sold as a 250HP kit?

Of course M7 has no figures on their site now so is in effect making no claims what spending 6K will bring.

Lets be generous and call it 250BHP or at the crank. Then lets be generous again and figure a 15% driveline loss. So we get a total of 212, rounding down. Then we have Steve's figures and we'll go with the best one and round up, again being generous, to 198. A difference of 14HP. Being Steve says the dyno he used is low we'll again be generous and figure the M7 one as high. Given all that generosity I think we can see the M7 is close to making the 250. Guess all it really needs is the correct tune thats been coming for how many years now?

 

I know of a RMW car that dyno'd at this same dyno. It had head/header and 380cc injectors without a RMW tune and still pulled 227whp. The most they had ever seen on a Mini..... but this thread is entertainining none the less

did I mention it was a stock cam?

 

Those two sentences pretty much explain how M7 works, and what the parts do. Thank You.

-Arthur

 

The only other data that I can find on my former car is the following timing maps for the "prototype" M7 software. See if you can spot what's wrong:

The primary timing table:


The secondary timing table:


Yes...your eyes are not deceiving you... some M7 ROCKET SCIENTIST vendor thought that 70 degree spark advance at throttle positions <8% at >7k rpm was safe. The crank bearings wore out on my car from the bad software and then..."bam!" "can you feel that??" (name that M7 reference).

 

I like the vendors that actually guarantee the results and not just give claims. If vendors believes in their performance products then place a guarantee on the hp gained by having them. The biggest reason why they will not do a guarantee is because they all know that there are to many uncontrollable variables that could change the results in their products.

 

our kits make between 230whp and 250whp depending upon the leak downs and compressions of the cars.... there is no one else that can touch these numbers. Dyno days all over the country have bore this out

times at the track also bear this out.....

why don't you come out an play?

 

I see that does suck. But what does this have to do with the head? And the Key word "prototype" which means you must have been a willing Guinea pig for the software?

 

So you offer a guarantee hp with your kit then? I know when I had my shop the engines I built I ran them up on the engine dyno prior to delivery. My customers knew from day one what they were getting.

As for playing we have WELL established on many threads that I am not the driver you are. No argument there. But the next time you are in town I will show at the shop you are giving tunes for. That is if you let me know next time. And who knows perhaps do a run with my car for you to see?

 

Every engine we have built has laid down at least 250whp

there is a major difference between engines we have built vs what came out of the factory. Too much variations for the builds.

all I ever hear from you is talk... when you going to put up?

 

Glad you pointed this out.
It is because of those variations that there are so many different results with the parts that are out there. So based on just that it is unfair for some to disclaim other vendors and there parts. And for the record I do not recall you doing this but some members have been known to flame a bit.
"all I ever hear from you is talk... when you going to put up?"
But Jan I do not think that I have EVER made any claims as to what my hp is on my MINI anywhere

 

I've said it a few times now but apparently it hasn't been put simply enough. The head didn't put out (sorry, I have to!). It never made power.

When I bought the kit, I was promised software (I paid for it!) and it was not delivered; I was left hanging. Then, when software to complete the kit was offered, it blew up my engine. Again, this kit is horrible...and not worth its price.

Then, when my car was ruined by the software, I was left hanging. M7 did the same thing to a few people who got M62 blowers: blew up the cars and then left them hanging. It's a pattern. Caveat emptor.

 

Ingsoc the reason I posted was your pictures of the head and the comments about the workmanship. I wanted to know from you what was wrong with the head itself. I see with you it is a bigger issue between you and M7. But my question never got answered. So reading the rest of your responses I concluded not the head that is at fault but the combination which made up the kit and possibly other factors that failed you engine.

 

obviously you haven't seen the flow numbers of the head... but lets not confuse facts with fiction

 

No I have not. FACT none were posted FICTION none were posted. A Flow chart on a head does not make a head bad . Flow #s has to do with volumetric efficiency of the head at a given rpm. So whats your point BIGGER is better. LOL (sarcastic joke)

 

What are you trying to say, the head is great, the head works, it's just the stuff around it that caused the issue?

At the time the head may have been the cats meow, that cat has died. New cats have been been born and can meow better for not much more money.

It all goes back to the hype machine that M7 is. The head has a respected name, yet there are no flow charts, heck there is not even a description of whats done to the head just a blurb about Cosworth. For all we know they take an OEM head, do a little grinding here and there and button it all back up using the same parts they took off. Does it have new springs, valves etc etc.

The main point of my post here is to inform the OP that he/she/it needs to do more research before dropping that kind of cash. There may be better alternatives than the 2 he/she/it is looking at.

 

I think Jan ran over those cats with his car on the way to the dyno.

 

Whoa step back their MR MOD. I was asking information on the head. Go and re read my questions and comments pertaining to the head. All I wanted to know was what was thought to be wrong with the head. You are very clear about your position with some vendors. And you expert comment on the head?
And you are close to opening that Pandora’s box about people that sell stuff without description and specifications. How about practicing what you preach Mr. MOD?
May I suggest to you that you spend some time learning how a head is developed before making weird cat statements? LOL
I thought the main point to question on NAM was to find answers here. I believe that’s what you MODs keep telling me when I give sources outside NAM for people to expand their knowledge?

 

drugs are NEVER in short supply on NAM

proceed at your own risk

 

That explains some here now doesn't it?

 

why?

you feeling loopy?