Drivetrain Revolution Mini Works car breaks 251.72whp
For the record, which vendor would you buy from? One that's constantly bashing other vendors, a few would come to mind.... OR one that just tells it like it is, and stands firmly behind their own products?
The choice is yours when you hear the beep.
.::BEEP::.
The choice is yours when you hear the beep.
.::BEEP::.
Okay, I have no interest here other than seeing power made by the MINI, and as an engineering student I respect RMW for trying new things and big projects while others sit and watch. That said, if ice was used, thats life, are we really going to crucify a guy doing good work for inflating dyno numbers? I bet that the intake you bought is totally good for the fifteen horsepower they say on the box. Also if I understand this charlie foxtrot RMW did not know about the tune on the car in the first post. So, inflated hp numbers for RMW, most every vendor does it. Slap on the wrist go back to making new stuff.
As to the other two guys, Danny, secrets secrets are no fun. If you had a tune in secret, whatever, just make sure for god sakes your tuner(s) know about it so they dont blow up a sick MINI! And also make sure they don't post what you tell them about "not having a tune" on a website. If of course you didn't know it was on the car either than Emil should be in some deep !@#$. Once again poo poo for keeping secrets if you knew about them but another slap on the wrist. If you didn't know about the tune then your scott free except for "accessory to iceing".
Emil, you got some splainin' to do. If he didn't know about that tune well than holy !@#$ you could have made his car puke a rod out the side of the block and he would have been out about 10 grand for a new engine! If I were that car's owner I would be livid. If he knew about the tune well than it looks like you are just guilty for not coming forward that the car had a tune on it for the dyno run that started this thread.
If I am wrong in the above assesment of the situation please point out any innacuracies as I would like to know the truth. I'm not an idiot but this is my understanding as far as my reading comprehension skills carry me. The real problem with this whole thing is that as adults and vendors I feel like all of this could be fixed with a few phone calls out of the public eye. I rarely voice my opinion on here about things I don't know about first hand but I don't want this to explode into something bad for the future of making power out of this car.
As to the other two guys, Danny, secrets secrets are no fun. If you had a tune in secret, whatever, just make sure for god sakes your tuner(s) know about it so they dont blow up a sick MINI! And also make sure they don't post what you tell them about "not having a tune" on a website. If of course you didn't know it was on the car either than Emil should be in some deep !@#$. Once again poo poo for keeping secrets if you knew about them but another slap on the wrist. If you didn't know about the tune then your scott free except for "accessory to iceing".
Emil, you got some splainin' to do. If he didn't know about that tune well than holy !@#$ you could have made his car puke a rod out the side of the block and he would have been out about 10 grand for a new engine! If I were that car's owner I would be livid. If he knew about the tune well than it looks like you are just guilty for not coming forward that the car had a tune on it for the dyno run that started this thread.
If I am wrong in the above assesment of the situation please point out any innacuracies as I would like to know the truth. I'm not an idiot but this is my understanding as far as my reading comprehension skills carry me. The real problem with this whole thing is that as adults and vendors I feel like all of this could be fixed with a few phone calls out of the public eye. I rarely voice my opinion on here about things I don't know about first hand but I don't want this to explode into something bad for the future of making power out of this car.
Dyno was a Dynapac at RPM in Lewisville TX. THye do mostly GM stuff like Vettes, Firebirds etc for the straight line set. The shop went quiet and everyone came over to check out the Mini that pulled 230, they were all pretty shocked.
For yucks only******
Since RPM sells crack, aka 104 octane unleaded, I filled a near empty tank with 104, drove about 150 miles, refilled with 104 and then dynoed again. The results were quite impressive. I don't want to muddy the waters so I'm not going to publish those juiced numbers as they have no bearing on this conversation.
Last edited by gnatster; Jul 18, 2007 at 09:01 PM.
Peace Keeper
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,747
Likes: 1
From: Defiance, Ohio
Well I am glad to see a few of us are back to discussing cars and power instead of bashing each other.
I just cannot wait for RMW to keep up their insane break through with the mini engine
, I mean who else can produce this much horsepower without a turbo in the works somewhere.
I just cannot wait for RMW to keep up their insane break through with the mini engine, I mean who else can produce this much horsepower without a turbo in the works somewhere.
Last edited by ChrisMCS04; Jul 18, 2007 at 10:15 PM. Reason: spelling
Banned
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,381
Likes: 0
Boy do have an Axe to grind or what. Do have any integrity?? Why would you slander Jan based on hear say?? Man you are a tool. It isn't hard to figure out were your information comes from. I'm glad you were able to form your opinion of Jan based on one side of a story. Well done hot shot.
I have dealt with allot of vendors over the years and working with Jan has been refreshing. I get strait answers and he always does what he says.
Longboard
I have dealt with allot of vendors over the years and working with Jan has been refreshing. I get strait answers and he always does what he says.
Longboard
Most the most part this has been free of name calling but some of your posts ..........
Banned
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,381
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Let me put some facts on the table:
1. Danny's car was tuned by me for with his previous setup, which had the stage 2 fireball head with 1mm oversize valves. See his e-mail below…
From: danny@minicorsa.com [mailto:danny@minicorsa.com]
Sent: Tuesday, April 10, 2007 11:29 AM
To: Emil
Subject: Re: Hey Danny
HELLO I FINALLY HAVE YOUR EMAIL HAPPY EASTER TO YOU TOO. I HAVEN'T WRITEN ONE OF THESE BEFORE BUT HERE GOES. LET ME KNOW IF YOU WANT THINGS CHANGED.
My car was unable to be worked on. I went to other tuners and they couldn't get into my ECU. Another tuner was soldering and desoldering my chips and the whole chip thing wa dsa mess and then Emil came ot the rescue he not only properly tuned my car but tuned it to my desired outcome as far as egt boost delivery responce time, overall performance and smoothness. now i can drive my MINI everyday with no issues of not starting or flat spots and consistant reliable performance. he made an unfortunate desighn flaw pistons work with no pinging. Great job and thanks a bunch Emil.
you can change emil with vitesse or whatever let me know.
----- Original Message -----
From: Emil
To: danny@minicorsa.com
Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2007 5:09 PM
Subject: Hey Danny
Happy Easter Buddy!
When you have time could you please write a short recommendation letter for me (one paragraph will be enough) so I can put it on my web site when it’s made or post it in a few forums.
Thanks,
Emil
2. jan hires Danny (new business - Minicorsa) to do his installs for him because no other reputable shop would touch him around here because of all the bridges he’s burned with everyone.
3. Danny tells me he’s going to install jan’s head and other parts on his car while he had my tune for his previous setup in his car. I told Danny the tune in his car is optimized for his previous setup and that he will run lean, so the fueling needs to be adjusted. I told him to keep an eye on the air to fuel ratio until we got together to adjust the fuel. Danny has a pre-cat wide band o2 system installed on his car so he sees the air to fuel ratio coming out of the engine before the excess fuel gets burned by the cat. I ask Danny a number of times what the air to fuel ratio was and he replied it seems to be fine and it wasn’t lean based on his in car meter. Post cat air to fuel ratio is what a dyno measures. The pre-cat values are around .4 to .5 points richer in general and are what actually comes out of the engine before the catalyst burns the excess fuel, showing a leaner value.
4. Danny comes about a few days later asking me to put MarioKart’s tune in his car (I had forgotten that he asked me that). I told him I can’t do that but his program is similar to Mario’s. I richened his fuel a bit. He said he was going to get his car dynoed the next day or two to see what it does.
5. Danny posts 235 with a 19% pulley and then slightly lower with a 15% pulley. We talk after he posts his results and I told him I am going to announce that it was my tune in the car. Danny said ok but he is going deny any knowledge of it because he didn’t want to get in the middle of me and jan … and that jan is his meal ticket for now and he doesn’t want to **** him off. But he said he would still like to sell my flash on the side. I told him fine, deny it so you don’t get hurt in between us. ---- I was not able to post that my tune was on Danny’s car before the moderator deleted the post (even though Ii tried and wrote to the moderator… I have e-mail records of this), so I regretfully let it go.
6. My tune WAS on Danny’s car when he pulled his “stunt” with icing his car, no doubt under Jan’s suggestion, to get to 250 HP. Both Danny and jan are at fault for not coming clean with this and leading people on.
7. jan keeps harping about the mixture being lean… let me tell you something mr so called tuner. First of all when you super cool the intake air the charge density goes up and you automatically run lean because the fueling maps are not optimized for that setup. Second the post catalyst air to fuel ratios are leaner than pre-catalyst and this is what dyno measures. The true air to fuel ratio measurement needs to be made before the catalytic converter. The lean mixture was of your own doing by supercooling the gintany cooler with bags of ice. Only if you had a clue jan! So with this “stunt” you were hoping to chalk up the Hp gains to your hardware. Sorry to disappoint. But you managed to drag an innocent’s person’s reputation, Danny, thru the mud, just like your reputation.
8. Danny calls me the next day after the 251 hp announcement and says he’d like to return the car to stock to do an apple to apple comparison. I told him go to the dealer and get it flashed. But beware that this won’t be an apple to apple comparison because the code the factory puts in there is different in many aspects, including much more aggressive timing.
9. Bottom line is: I had my tune on Danny’s car on all the past dyno runs since we started working together with the exception of the last one. His post catalytic lean measurements was due to his own ignorance and hands, although his pre cat values should have been in the 12.8 a/f range (theory says 12.8 is where max power occurs on IC engines). His apple to apple comparison isn’t worth a crap. Both you and Danny have been trying to cover this up and blaming other people for your own ignorance.
1. Danny's car was tuned by me for with his previous setup, which had the stage 2 fireball head with 1mm oversize valves. See his e-mail below…
From: danny@minicorsa.com [mailto:danny@minicorsa.com]
Sent: Tuesday, April 10, 2007 11:29 AM
To: Emil
Subject: Re: Hey Danny
HELLO I FINALLY HAVE YOUR EMAIL HAPPY EASTER TO YOU TOO. I HAVEN'T WRITEN ONE OF THESE BEFORE BUT HERE GOES. LET ME KNOW IF YOU WANT THINGS CHANGED.
My car was unable to be worked on. I went to other tuners and they couldn't get into my ECU. Another tuner was soldering and desoldering my chips and the whole chip thing wa dsa mess and then Emil came ot the rescue he not only properly tuned my car but tuned it to my desired outcome as far as egt boost delivery responce time, overall performance and smoothness. now i can drive my MINI everyday with no issues of not starting or flat spots and consistant reliable performance. he made an unfortunate desighn flaw pistons work with no pinging. Great job and thanks a bunch Emil.
you can change emil with vitesse or whatever let me know.
----- Original Message -----
From: Emil
To: danny@minicorsa.com
Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2007 5:09 PM
Subject: Hey Danny
Happy Easter Buddy!
When you have time could you please write a short recommendation letter for me (one paragraph will be enough) so I can put it on my web site when it’s made or post it in a few forums.
Thanks,
Emil
2. jan hires Danny (new business - Minicorsa) to do his installs for him because no other reputable shop would touch him around here because of all the bridges he’s burned with everyone.
3. Danny tells me he’s going to install jan’s head and other parts on his car while he had my tune for his previous setup in his car. I told Danny the tune in his car is optimized for his previous setup and that he will run lean, so the fueling needs to be adjusted. I told him to keep an eye on the air to fuel ratio until we got together to adjust the fuel. Danny has a pre-cat wide band o2 system installed on his car so he sees the air to fuel ratio coming out of the engine before the excess fuel gets burned by the cat. I ask Danny a number of times what the air to fuel ratio was and he replied it seems to be fine and it wasn’t lean based on his in car meter. Post cat air to fuel ratio is what a dyno measures. The pre-cat values are around .4 to .5 points richer in general and are what actually comes out of the engine before the catalyst burns the excess fuel, showing a leaner value.
4. Danny comes about a few days later asking me to put MarioKart’s tune in his car (I had forgotten that he asked me that). I told him I can’t do that but his program is similar to Mario’s. I richened his fuel a bit. He said he was going to get his car dynoed the next day or two to see what it does.
5. Danny posts 235 with a 19% pulley and then slightly lower with a 15% pulley. We talk after he posts his results and I told him I am going to announce that it was my tune in the car. Danny said ok but he is going deny any knowledge of it because he didn’t want to get in the middle of me and jan … and that jan is his meal ticket for now and he doesn’t want to **** him off. But he said he would still like to sell my flash on the side. I told him fine, deny it so you don’t get hurt in between us. ---- I was not able to post that my tune was on Danny’s car before the moderator deleted the post (even though Ii tried and wrote to the moderator… I have e-mail records of this), so I regretfully let it go.
6. My tune WAS on Danny’s car when he pulled his “stunt” with icing his car, no doubt under Jan’s suggestion, to get to 250 HP. Both Danny and jan are at fault for not coming clean with this and leading people on.
7. jan keeps harping about the mixture being lean… let me tell you something mr so called tuner. First of all when you super cool the intake air the charge density goes up and you automatically run lean because the fueling maps are not optimized for that setup. Second the post catalyst air to fuel ratios are leaner than pre-catalyst and this is what dyno measures. The true air to fuel ratio measurement needs to be made before the catalytic converter. The lean mixture was of your own doing by supercooling the gintany cooler with bags of ice. Only if you had a clue jan! So with this “stunt” you were hoping to chalk up the Hp gains to your hardware. Sorry to disappoint. But you managed to drag an innocent’s person’s reputation, Danny, thru the mud, just like your reputation.
8. Danny calls me the next day after the 251 hp announcement and says he’d like to return the car to stock to do an apple to apple comparison. I told him go to the dealer and get it flashed. But beware that this won’t be an apple to apple comparison because the code the factory puts in there is different in many aspects, including much more aggressive timing.
9. Bottom line is: I had my tune on Danny’s car on all the past dyno runs since we started working together with the exception of the last one. His post catalytic lean measurements was due to his own ignorance and hands, although his pre cat values should have been in the 12.8 a/f range (theory says 12.8 is where max power occurs on IC engines). His apple to apple comparison isn’t worth a crap. Both you and Danny have been trying to cover this up and blaming other people for your own ignorance.
OVERDRIVE
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 7,926
Likes: 41
From: Greensboro, NC
Hi Joaquin...In defense of Jan, I will vouche for his credibility...I've known Jan long before he was banned from NAM for his unabashed servings of candor to the Mini comunity...this continuity of friendship continues today is primarily due to his commitment to stay true to what he claims...He joined the manufacturer community to provide products that produces real performance gains...
As I reminded him recently, all this bantering about his product is good news on his behalf...when the competition have all grouped to place a target on your back (real or perceived), it means that you are out front and leading...
As I reminded him recently, all this bantering about his product is good news on his behalf...when the competition have all grouped to place a target on your back (real or perceived), it means that you are out front and leading...
Last edited by MSFITOY; Jul 19, 2007 at 05:53 AM.
Turbius Maximus
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 4,416
Likes: 0
From: Infinity and beyond
carful with that word...
good stuff Sid....
Originally Posted by misfitoy
Hi Joaquin...In defense of Jan, I will vouche for his credibility...I've known Jan long before he was banned from NAM for his unabashed servings of candor to the Mini comunity...this continuity of friendship continues today is primarily due to his commitment to stay true to what he claims...He joined the manufacturer community to provide products that produces real performance gains...
As I reminded him recently, all this bantering about his product is good news on his behalf...when the competition have all grouped to place a target on your back (real or perceived), it means that you are out front and leading...
As I reminded him recently, all this bantering about his product is good news on his behalf...when the competition have all grouped to place a target on your back (real or perceived), it means that you are out front and leading...
Banned
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,381
Likes: 0
.when the competition have all grouped to place a target on your back (real or perceived), it means that you are out front and leading...
Don't see any of the competition posting about this. He might have a target on his back for other reason other than being out front you think?
Don't see any of the competition posting about this. He might have a target on his back for other reason other than being out front you think?
OVERDRIVE
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 7,926
Likes: 41
From: Greensboro, NC
.when the competition have all grouped to place a target on your back (real or perceived), it means that you are out front and leading...
Don't see any of the competition posting about this. He might have a target on his back for other reason other than being out front you think?
Don't see any of the competition posting about this. He might have a target on his back for other reason other than being out front you think?
Bottom line for me is that I have not and will not put any parts on my Mini if it doesn't fit my need...in the end, this is what it is all about...if the customer doesn't want it, they won't buy it...the last time I checked, the RMW head/header has a long waiting list and has practically wiped out the competition's head sales...that speaks volumes to me...
.
Banned
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,381
Likes: 0
Think back to Longboard's orginal thread and the "participation" of DMH and those who followed? There was a time when M7 was relentlessly beaten down for not posting dyno numbers...I recall just about every one of Jan's RMW head customers have posted numbers but that is still not enough for this tough crowd...
Bottom line for me is that I have not and will not put any parts on my Mini if it doesn't fit my need...in the end, this is what it is all about...if the customer doesn't want it, they won't buy it...the last time I checked, the RMW head/header has a long waiting list and has practically wiped out the competition's head sales...that speaks volumes to me...
Bottom line for me is that I have not and will not put any parts on my Mini if it doesn't fit my need...in the end, this is what it is all about...if the customer doesn't want it, they won't buy it...the last time I checked, the RMW head/header has a long waiting list and has practically wiped out the competition's head sales...that speaks volumes to me...
I for one could care less what you put on your car, that's up to you. When the product, the few and the loud are praising to the skies, preformance is based on info that appears to be of questionable ethical testing method, that is plain wrong.
Why is John posting in this thread?
Banned
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 4,862
Likes: 3
From: Fresno Ca.
Don't you wonder that it would appear that the hype you all bought this head from is untrue?
I for one could care less what you put on your car, that's up to you. When the product, the few and the loud are praising to the skies, preformance is based on info that appears to be of questionable ethical testing method, that is plain wrong.
I for one could care less what you put on your car, that's up to you. When the product, the few and the loud are praising to the skies, preformance is based on info that appears to be of questionable ethical testing method, that is plain wrong.
you crack me up .
Hi Joaquin...In defense of Jan, I will vouche for his credibility...I've known Jan long before he was banned from NAM for his unabashed servings of candor to the Mini comunity...this continuity of friendship continues today is primarily due to his commitment to stay true to what he claims...He joined the manufacturer community to provide products that produces real performance gains...
As I reminded him recently, all this bantering about his product is good news on his behalf...when the competition have all grouped to place a target on your back (real or perceived), it means that you are out front and leading...
As I reminded him recently, all this bantering about his product is good news on his behalf...when the competition have all grouped to place a target on your back (real or perceived), it means that you are out front and leading...
Thanks for posting. Please don't get me wrong, i'm not trying to bash Jan or his products.
Until gnatster just posted his dyno for me to see, I haven't heard about anyone else putting down that power from the RMW head.
I know you, but I don't know Jan. If you're vouching, then it's all good.