I've had my 2009 Midnight Black Clubman S for 1.5 years. In that time tiny swirl marks formed, which I tried to ignore and not become OCD about. However, I failed at the OCD when I accidentally let some water spots form and couldn't easily remove with just clay. So after buying some supplies and a PC, I spent this past weekend doing the following steps.

1. Wash.
2. Clay the entire car.
3. Polish with Swirl and a white pad.
4. Polish with Amigo and a white pad.
5. Apply Epic using a black pad.
6. Finally Banana Gloss by hand.

There were a couple of small scratches I could still see but, the swirl and water marks were gone. However, after driving the car for the past 2 days, I've noticed the water marks are showing up again. It hasn't rained nor have I parked near any sprinklers - so I'm at a loss on why they reappeared. Does anyone have any ideas of what I might have done wrong that would have allowed them to stay or how to get rid of them? It's really driving me nuts and making me ponder trading cars.

Thanks, Anthony

 

After you were done did you check it in direct sunlight to make sure the swirls and water marks were actually gone? I've had that happen before. I did some work in the evening, thought every thing was good but the next day it was far from it.

You may also try going to a more aggressive pad. I have a yellow, orange, black, and white. Yellow being the most aggressive and the white being the least. Anytime I remove swirls that are pretty bad I start with the orange. I rarely have to use the yellow.

 

I didn't check it in direct sunlight, before applying the Epic. However, I did use a flashlight & a Halogen lamp to check and didn't see them.

Actually, I didn't even see the issues in direct sunlight on the first day ( And I was looking pretty closely ). It took until the evening of the second day for me to notice them being there - which thought was a little odd.

So would trying again with an Orange pad be a good idea?

 

I would. I never had good results looking for swirls with anything but dorect sunlight. Just curious but does the wax or you poilsh use any fillers?

One thing I do after i wash the car, and it's really sunny, is use some of my detail spray and hose the car down right after I rinse it. The Adam's detail spray is made to nuetralize the ph of the water. That way if the water and the detail spray sit on there no big deal.

 

Not sure about fillers, I'm using the Prima product line. I think I read somewhere that Amigo has some filling properties.

I normally try to wash in the shade and dry with microfiber afterwards. I think the water spots formed after being caught in a rainstorm. Unfortunately, I was traveling at the time and didn't have time to wash it. :(

 

I think you may have to use a more aggressive pad with swirl.

Did you check for swirls while polishing with Prima Swirl?

Amigo may have masked some of it as it is essentially a glaze and a very fine polish.

 

I did check for the swirls and water spots during each step and didn't see any. Though, I can't seem to recall if I used the flashlight for every step. I guess it's possible that I missed them - though it still perplexes me as to how I managed that for two days and can see them clearly now.

As soon as I get some more free time, I'll try a more aggressive pad with the Prima Swirl. Hopefully that will solve my issues and I can be rid of the pesky water spots.

 

You can get a spot light and see if the spots of truly removed. Some swirls and water spots only show up at the right angle, at the right height and at the right brightness.

 

WASH? With Dawn or an agressive soap to help remove wax before claying .... or wash and then wipe entire vehicle with de-waxer http://autobodystore.com/ms8.shtml

then CLAY - AWAY! I prefer Zaino Clay.

http://www.dodojuiceusa.com/juicebar.php

Purple Haze soft or Blue Velvet hard wax. The dark pigment in these will help fill in any swirls.

I love Prima products .... but consider Dodo juice way better than Banana gloss.

Just my opinion!!! Good luck.

 

I also use isopropyl alcohol to wipe the car down and remove any left over wax residue.

I'm personally not a fan of products that hide swirls, but then it's not unusual for me to spend 4+ hours on my black miata so I don't have to hide them.

 

To remove water spots, there are a few very important things to understand.

First, what are water spots?
Water spots are a combination of mineral (calcium) deposits in the water and or etchings left behind which can happen if the spots occur on a very hot day on hot paint, literally boiling itself into the paint. The first step to removing water spots, is to SEE them.

Position the car in the shade and use a light to identify where the spots are. Mark them with a towel or tape so you can locate them later.

Next use Distilled Vinegar to remove the calcium deposits. This is as simple as soaking a rag in vinegar and wiping the spots off. You might have to repeat this several times. Re-examine the areas and see if the spots are still there. Even if the deposits are gone, a ghost "etching" may still exist.

The solution to waterspot etchings are as follows in increasing aggressiveness:
1.) Buffing with a polish
2.) Compounding with wool pad
3.) Wetsanding

I don't know what your experience level is with the PC, but if this is your first time, then you need to make sure your techniques are sound first. Do a test spot about 24"x24". Polish that out to perfection using your chosen pad and chemical..i.e. Prima Swirl with an Orange pad. Once you've done that, then you can feel more confident polishing the rest of the car.

However, you MUST remember. If you can't see the defects you are trying to remove, then don't bother polishing. It's imperative you set up lighting so you can see what you are trying to fix otherwise you are just wasting your time.

So before you make yourself go crazy about trading in the car....read my post carefully. Try some vinegar. Try focusing on an area. The orange pad and Swirl with the PC SHOULD be all you need.

Where did you purchase this combo from? Was it me? If so, I would have expected a phone call, email, PM or something for some advice on the matter.

Actually products with fillers are an important maintenance step, especially for those without buffers or on swirl prone cars. While buffing paint and keeping it looking flawless is great, in an ideal world, it takes a combination of buffing a few times a year, and maintaining with good products that utilize fillers to keep the swirls and scratches at bay.

 

I definitely read the post - it's very thorough. So trying Distilled Vinegar - after the other work I've done - will still potentially make a difference? I would have thought the claying/polishing would have removed the deposits.

I got the PC/pads as a birthday gift - so no idea where they were bought. And the Swirl/Epic I bought from Detailer's Domain during their Prima intro - I'm frugal and the 20% swayed me. Please take no offense by that.

However, even if I ordered from you - it's probable that I wouldn't have asked for help/advice. Doing so is a last resort with me - I tend to research until I come up with a solution that I'm satisfied with. It typically works, but there's the few times it doesn't - like now.

I will be needing an orange pad and a few other things ( And I'm liking the idea of the PreWow - as I accidentally got some wax/polish on the wheel arches ). So, it's likely that you will hear from me then.

 

Clay isn't very effective at removing water spots. It CAN help, but it's not my first tool of choice. Using vinegar is just under the assumption that the spots you are seeing are remnants that didn't get removed. It's possible it won't do a thing either, and that what we are seeing are actually etchings. However, I'm still uncertain as to whether your technique is a variable or not, so I would try focuing on an area to polish and see if you get better results. Polish the area for 3 to 4 minutes moving slowly and letting the pad spin freely against the paint, fully breaking down the polish.

It's cool wherever you bought the products from. Phil is a good guy, so all the better. We both support Prima, I just am more actively involved in answering peoples questions here on the forum, so no worries.

I just mentioned that because a lot of times my customers will post on here asking for help, and I don't see it...and it's often one of those things that could be answered very quickly. I spend a great deal of time providing support to my customers and I love doing it.

Richard