Ok, I am completely ignorant on the subject and am in need of your great wisdom.

I have the JCW 18" Double Spoke rims and JCW Aero kit. As several other Mini owners have commented, and I agree, my Mini probably needs to come down a bit. How low should I go? What is normal? I really don't want to panic every time I go over a speed bump so what is safe? What is involved and needed to do it?

 

You basically have two choices:

- Coilovers. These are a complete spring/shock combo. They usually cost $1000 and up (as much as $3000 or more) for a set. They almost always give you some kind of height adjustment, and often adjustable dampening, too. They usually require a bit more care and feeding than simple springs and shocks. They sometimes need rebuilding.

- Springs. There are no replacement shocks for you car yet, so simple lowering springs are the cheapest and easiest way to lower the car. Stock shocks are pretty stiff, and they seem to work pretty well with aftermarket springs, but it depends on your tastes, which suspension you have, and the spring. Just swapping springs is going to give you a fixed ride height, no adjustability. And the dampening will be fixed as it was when you got the car. But springs are pretty cheap -- our Mach V Technic springs are around $200 for the set. Others are in that neighborhood.

Install of either springs or coilovers takes around four hours. The car needs to be aligned afterwards. Coilvers may require additional time to fine-tune the ride height.

The JCW front is fairly low -- it can scrape some bumps even at stock ride height. Lowering it will make it more likely you'll be scraping it up, no way around it.

--Dan
Mach V
FastMINI.net

 

The MINIs in our Club which are lowered:tip-toe over speed bumps(this can scare you when watching your rear view mirror and some SUV is on your tail! ) ,SOME ride harsher ,ALL look COOL! Oh,and most of them are for weekend/freeway cruises...

 

how low you should go is entirely up to you. remember though, going too low causes a lot of stress on your suspension components. if you are more performance minded, a mild drop will probably be the best, as it lets your suspension actually do what its supposed to do. slamming your car all the way down, while it looks great, does not let control arms, shocks and springs do what theyre supposed to do

 

I am pretty sure this is not true considering people purchace springs / coilovers, control arms specifically to lower their cars...

 

so im getting HR's and im not worried about speed bumps, but im worried about pulling into my driveway.....does anyone scrape now? in or out?

 

It is true. Too low and you are asking for several types of problems to appear.

edit:

Here is a recent post talking about going too low on an '07:
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...06&postcount=7

 

#1 Take a look at the TSW's....

 

I'm thinking seriously about getting these for my 07 MCSa (when it gets here). I've never modified a car in any way - what sort of shop should I get to install these for me? I'm in Orange County, CA, if anyone knows a particular place.

 

I don't have a mini yet, but I would have to say lowering a car can ruin the ride. I hate my springs on my car and cannot wait to go to stock springs again. If you are going to do it, shell out the money for a good set of coil-overs. Especially, if you live in an area with crappy roads like I do. Of course, I have a very aggressive 2" drop with Eibach springs and 18" wheels! Needless to say, my tires are getting ate by my fender!

 

Well, I am concerned about disturbing the ride. I really just want to lower it a bit, just to acheive a more balanced wheel gap. Everything I've read here made me think these springs would be a conservative solution. I should mention I'm getting the basic stock suspension.

 

The goal here is to 'functionally' lower the car. The h&R springs allow you to do that without sacrificing the ride. Look at the photos in my gallery or e-mail me for more and I am happy to send them. They ride great, and put the car where it should have been from the factory. they also provide BETTER than stock ride quality on the freeway etc. due to the superior progressive rate to the springs. Also, don't forget the limited LIFETIME warranty with H&R vs. an unknown private label of 'x' brand spring.
Sept 13th will be back in stock and shipping! You will love the car lowered!

 

Well it's always personal opinion on the ride. I think as long as you don't go with any springs that give you a huge drop (maybe .5 or so) your ride won't be significantly worse and won't scrape in so many places. But in my opinion, I am just shelling out money for some adjustable coilovers next time!

 

It really shouldn't take more than an hour-maybe hour and a half- worth of labor to install springs. I'm not sure for the going rate in CA, but on the east coast it varies from 50-80 bucks an hour!

 

and I can pretty much guarantee a degradation in performance. In all the shops I've talked to and the like, I"m only aware of one that modeled the suspension geometry to see what's what.

Also, suspension is by its very design a combination of compramises. A good suspension tuner know what they're trading for what they're getting.

If you lower more than about 3/4", you start to pay for your decreased height with unfavorable front control arm geometry. I've been reading about modding the stock ball joint contact points to improve the effect of lowering on arm geometry. John Petrich did it, and Ryphile has something up his sleve to get 2" down with the geometry on 1" lowering. I'm guessing the ball joint mod, but he hasn't confirmed that.

Just because parts are sold to the masses doesn't mean that they are the best to add to the car. There are tons and tons and tons of examples of this all over the automotive aftermarket (anyone really gotten 35% better gas mileage from the turbulator or whatever that peice of crap is your supposed to put in your intake path?).

If you're interested in more details, I wrote an article in MC2 that explains the basic trade offs your making as you go lower. What's best for you? Don't know. Depends on how you drive, where you drive, and what you want out of the car.

If you're going for looks over all else, then as you slam, you will run into other issues you'll have to live with (like almost stopping before speed bumps, like mentioned before).

Matt

 

I suppose I should just forget lowering my 07 Mini. There seems to be quite a sharp division on this issue - difficult for the nephyte to decipher.

 

I'm sure someone will buy some springs for the R56 and write a review in the near future. They've been out a year or so now. (the car) Maybe someone has... I'll search!

 

https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...ht=R56+springs

This seems to have some decent information.

 

About the front control arm geometry, I have H&Rs on my 07, the control arms are still below parallel and just fine. 1.4" or however much its lowered seems about perfect.

Have fun,
Josh

 

When you lower a car you effect it's static roll center and the roll inertia. This is critical point of the system that is made up by all the angles from all the suspension components.

Lowering the ride hight and performance are in no way directly related.

But like womens high heels,what people do for looks is very far from what is needed for performance.

 

just make sure that you work with a good suspension/allignement shop. If you get the info from the vendor web sites and go from there, it's easy to get into trouble fast. If you do want to do something to your car, for whatever reason, it's always just a good idea to learn from people with more experience. You have to start somewhere. All the car "experts" weren't born that way.... They learned by screwing up, trying, and most importantly, learning from all those crabby old guys who've seen it all before!

Matt

ps, you can also start with self eduction. Some I found helpfull are:

Fundimentals of Vehicle Dynamics by Gillespi
How to make your car handle by Puhn (pretty much the bible for starting out)
and anything by Carroll Smith "Drive to Win" is one of his more known books, but there are others. He also has a good track-side quick reference on what to do to get what effects....

 

Okay, I just have to say something here. There's a lot of scary-sounding posting in this thread. Bhatch, you seem to be saying that the car will not perform better with the suspension lowered. Having driven plenty of examples of older and new Minis with and without lowering, I'd have to disagree. Although the RIDE may be a bit worse (especially over very bumpy pavement), the handling will improve with lowering. Sure, if you dump the thing on the ground with 3" of lowering, the car will have no suspension at all, but I don't think anyone here is considering that.

If you're considering lowering your Mini, my advice would be to find someone who has done it, and get a ride and/or drive in that person's car. See how you like it. Perhaps the day-to-day sacrifices (lack of ground clearance, risk of scraping on parking lot wheel stoppers, lack of compliance on very bumpy roads) will outweigh the reduced roll, increased grip, and crisper handling. That's something each person has to figure out for themselves. But the car's not going to explode if you lower it.

--Dan
Mach V
FastMINI.net

 

Anyone who has an automatic needs to remember your car is heavier and will sit lower than a six speed with aftermarket springs.

Cars that are six speeds and without a sunroof will sit the highest with aftermarket springs.

 

Although you can get performace from lowering a car, there are alwasy negatives to any change, far beyond ride quality.

It is very possible on many cars to lower it even slightly, with inadiquate spring stiffness for the new working range, and have negative effect. THere are plenty of examples of this, the Miata and DC2 integra are very commone examples.

Unfortunetly i have not investigated my R56 yet, but i am sure Vendors have looked at any issues.

 

I've met a few Ladies who's performance is severly degraded when they are without thier high heels!

And I agree with Mach V Dan, talk to those that have done it. Ride in cars that are modded. Since it's a compramise to start with, there's nothing wrong with changing the mix to suit your needs. All I try to do is to get people to learn about the system before messing with it, or work with someone who does understand what's going on so that you can benefit from others mistakes.

On another pointless side note. I started with some lowering springs (H-Sport, I think, it was a while ago), and for the street it was better, a bit lower, a bit softer, and the progressive nature menth they didn't bottem any more. It was the transition between soft and hard when I was on the track that got me to change and go farther with my suspension tuning.

All us self-appointed gurus do tend to oversell the potential downsides. I don't know if that just reinforces our own image (ego? Nah, not here) or it's just because if you keep an eye out, you see so many examples of it being done wrong that we overcompensate by screaming "NO!" I guess that we hope by putting a little fear of screwing up in the newbies head, that they will proceed a bit more cautiously.....

The worst case is you put something on and you hate it. So you take it off, sell it in the marketplace to someone who is looking for that effect, and go get another part. A little time and money down the tubes. There are far worse things in life to contemplate. Also, while the bank acount will be a bit lighter, you can think of it as the price paid to learn what you really want from you car!

Matt

ps, if you mod for a while, you'll do some changes with the best of intentions that you find just don't work out the way you planned. This happens to everyone, even the gurus!