Stock Problems/Issues Discussions related to warranty related issues and repairs, or other problems with the OEM parts and software for MINI Cooper (R50), Cabrio (R52), and Cooper S (R53) MINIs.

What happens when your oil cooler cracks? This...

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
  #1  
Old 12-20-2008, 02:15 PM
Mach V Dan's Avatar
Mach V Dan
Mach V Dan is offline
Former Vendor
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Sterling, VA
Posts: 1,472
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
What happens when your oil cooler cracks? This...

We had a customer come in with an R53 that had overheating problems. He was concerned that the head gasket was blown -- the coolant had engine oil in it. We did a compression test, and everything was fine -- the head gasket was sealed tight. We then pressurized the cooling system, and again found no leaks. But...the coolant was REALLY contaminated. We decided the only possible way this could happen was that the oil-to-coolant heat exchanger had cracked. I've seen this happen on other cars, but hadn't seen this before on a MINI.

If you're not familiar with this part, it's over on the passenger side of the engine block. It looks like this:

Name:  P1000221Large.jpg
Views: 13384
Size:  132.9 KB

It's like an intercooler, but coolant is flowing through one side, and engine oil is flowing through the other side. Only the supercharged cars have this, by the way. As far as I know, the justacoopers do without.

We pulled the part off the car and pressure tested it on the work bench. Sure enough, it was leaking.

So, why didn't pressurizing the cooling system show us this leak? Perhaps because our pressure couldn't make it through this:

Name:  P1000225Large.jpg
Views: 11370
Size:  49.5 KB

That's a picture of the radiator hose. The peanut-butter looking stuff is coolant, which has gelled from the oil contamination. The entire cooling system was full of it.

Some poured out on the belly pan when we opened up the radiator hoses and forced some pressure in...

Name:  P1000223Large.jpg
Views: 7450
Size:  79.8 KB

Clumps plopped out into our drain pan...

Name:  P1000227Large.jpg
Views: 7355
Size:  94.9 KB

Name:  P1000232Large.jpg
Views: 7672
Size:  85.2 KB

We declared the radiator a lost cause -- the stuff was packed tightly into the tubes. For the rest of the system, we built a little setup we dubbed the Dialysis Machine. It's a pump we rigged up with a bucket of detergent mixture to flush the system out. We ran through about six buckets of the stuff before it finally rinsed clear.

Name:  P1000237Large.jpg
Views: 7493
Size:  57.8 KB

Name:  P1000240Large.jpg
Views: 7232
Size:  44.4 KB

So, an interesting case. I'm not sure what to take away from it -- I've never heard of this part failing before, and I have never, ever seen the coolant get SO bad. It was incredible how solid it had become, and how extensive it was throughout the cooling system.

--Dan
Mach V
 
The following users liked this post:
greystone (03-16-2021)
  #2  
Old 12-20-2008, 02:26 PM
MINIdave's Avatar
MINIdave
MINIdave is offline
6th Gear
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 3,789
Likes: 0
Received 10 Likes on 9 Posts
What a mess!

So, the oil was in the water, but not the other way round? So you think the internally lubricated engine parts are still OK? Bearings and such?

I had a similar thing happen on an Audi, only it was the transmission cooler and the water went into the tranny fluid and ruined the transmission. I rebuilt it not understanding what had happened and a few thousand miles after I rebuilt it the tranny started slipping again. I finally found the trans cooler was the problem...........
 
  #3  
Old 12-20-2008, 07:04 PM
k-huevo's Avatar
k-huevo
k-huevo is offline
6th Gear
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Pipe Creek, Texas
Posts: 1,629
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes on 5 Posts
Forum member and MINI tech Chadtoolio has encountered this condition and has devised this testing block to check the oil cooler's integrity.
 
  #4  
Old 12-20-2008, 07:05 PM
BlimeyCabrio's Avatar
BlimeyCabrio
BlimeyCabrio is offline
6th Gear
iTrader: (5)
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Holly Springs, NC
Posts: 8,773
Likes: 0
Received 9 Likes on 7 Posts
This thread makes me want to puke.

Wow... that's pretty incredible, really...
 
  #5  
Old 12-20-2008, 07:40 PM
Mach V Dan's Avatar
Mach V Dan
Mach V Dan is offline
Former Vendor
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Sterling, VA
Posts: 1,472
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Originally Posted by MINIdave
What a mess!

So, the oil was in the water, but not the other way round? So you think the internally lubricated engine parts are still OK? Bearings and such?
The oil was clean. Oil runs as much as 100 psi at cold start, whereas coolant doesn't exceed 20 psi or so. So if the crack is small, the oil will exit more readily than coolant will enter.

--Dan
Mach V
 
  #6  
Old 12-20-2008, 07:55 PM
Partsman's Avatar
Partsman
Partsman is offline
Legion_of_Doom
iTrader: (8)
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Westerly, RI
Posts: 3,989
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Wow, that is just plain nasty.

You should maybe explain to your customer about checking the coolant once in a while...or at least bring it to you to check.
 
  #7  
Old 12-20-2008, 08:23 PM
BlimeyCabrio's Avatar
BlimeyCabrio
BlimeyCabrio is offline
6th Gear
iTrader: (5)
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Holly Springs, NC
Posts: 8,773
Likes: 0
Received 9 Likes on 7 Posts
Good point... how did the coolant look in the reservoir? Same nasty mess, or clean?
 
  #8  
Old 12-20-2008, 08:31 PM
PGT's Avatar
PGT
PGT is offline
Banned
iTrader: (11)
Join Date: May 2006
Location: DC Metro
Posts: 7,681
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
that peanut butter is a textbook case of an 'emulsion'

if all that was bad on the car was the hose and the cooler, that guy should count himself lucky. could have caused a head issue he feared at the start from excessive heat.
 
  #9  
Old 12-20-2008, 10:31 PM
Schmagagled's Avatar
Schmagagled
Schmagagled is offline
1st Gear
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 18
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I had an oil leak earlier this year (a small leak actually). Had the car flatbedded to Nashville and it turned out that it was this same oil cooler. At the same time I had been experiencing some tire vibration up front that may have contributed to the problem (my theory). Anyway I can tell you that looking for the source of the oil leak was a challenge. Very hard to pinpoint exactly where it was coming from.
 
  #10  
Old 12-20-2008, 10:37 PM
nabeshin's Avatar
nabeshin
nabeshin is offline
Functioning Lunatic
iTrader: (2)
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Lincoln, NE
Posts: 5,237
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes on 1 Post
That's a lot of gunk. >_<
 
  #11  
Old 12-20-2008, 11:13 PM
poskey's Avatar
poskey
poskey is offline
1st Gear
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 39
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Mach V Dan
The oil was clean. Oil runs as much as 100 psi at cold start, whereas coolant doesn't exceed 20 psi or so. So if the crack is small, the oil will exit more readily than coolant will enter.

--Dan
Mach V
Dan don't forget, once you shut the engine off , coolant pressure exceeds oil pressure then coolant can get into the oil. Just for peace of mind, I would change the oil and filter.
 
  #12  
Old 12-21-2008, 05:08 AM
Ant FR's Avatar
Ant FR
Ant FR is offline
Neutral
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Guys as you may have seen elsewhere, this was the sight that i was greeted by yesterday. Dave at Thinkmini already suggested the Oil cooler when i told him over the phone what had happened.

Heres a pic. Car is thoroughly worked over GTT 260 and the engine was replaced back in february this year after the oil pump gave up and seized the bottom end at that time

 
  #13  
Old 12-21-2008, 06:59 PM
PenelopeG3's Avatar
PenelopeG3
PenelopeG3 is offline
4th Gear
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Bay Area CA
Posts: 576
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Wow. That is freakin nasty.

How many miles on that car?
 
  #14  
Old 12-23-2008, 07:57 AM
Mach V Dan's Avatar
Mach V Dan
Mach V Dan is offline
Former Vendor
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Sterling, VA
Posts: 1,472
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Originally Posted by poskey
Dan don't forget, once you shut the engine off , coolant pressure exceeds oil pressure then coolant can get into the oil. Just for peace of mind, I would change the oil and filter.
We definitely changed the oil and filter -- we'd do that in any case, as you said, for peace of mind.

How many miles on that car?
Were you talking to me? Our customer's car has 63000 miles.

--Dan
Mach V
 
  #15  
Old 01-20-2009, 02:21 PM
apples.hateme's Avatar
apples.hateme
apples.hateme is offline
Neutral
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I need an warm fuzzy and I really don't want peanut butter oozing out of anything!
My 2004 S began leaking oil over the weekend. The oil light to blink first thing this morning. My mechanic tells me the oil cooler has 'blown' and it will be $600 to replace. Now, I'm a little flustered at this, but I can't tend to her needs myself. Being that I don't have the facilities or tools in my current location, is it worth the cost have the local wrencher fix it? Home is more than 1200 miles away right now and I would just like someone to tell me it's not a complete shafting. I'm sure this matters, she's a little over 157,000 miles now. "We drive the hell out of her" as my husband says.
 
  #16  
Old 01-20-2009, 02:33 PM
wandrur's Avatar
wandrur
wandrur is offline
Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Fredericksburg, VA
Posts: 11,899
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
That's pretty crazy stuff right there. Thanks for the pics and details, even if it was sorta disgusting!
 
  #17  
Old 01-20-2009, 06:39 PM
minimarks's Avatar
minimarks
minimarks is offline
6th Gear
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Winston-Salem, NC
Posts: 3,362
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Would a aftermarket oil cooler solve this problem?
 
  #18  
Old 01-20-2009, 09:14 PM
nabeshin's Avatar
nabeshin
nabeshin is offline
Functioning Lunatic
iTrader: (2)
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Lincoln, NE
Posts: 5,237
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes on 1 Post
Originally Posted by apples.hateme
I need an warm fuzzy and I really don't want peanut butter oozing out of anything!
My 2004 S began leaking oil over the weekend. The oil light to blink first thing this morning. My mechanic tells me the oil cooler has 'blown' and it will be $600 to replace. Now, I'm a little flustered at this, but I can't tend to her needs myself. Being that I don't have the facilities or tools in my current location, is it worth the cost have the local wrencher fix it? Home is more than 1200 miles away right now and I would just like someone to tell me it's not a complete shafting. I'm sure this matters, she's a little over 157,000 miles now. "We drive the hell out of her" as my husband says.
That seems a little steep to me. The part can be had for about $136 from pelican parts, and the install shouldn't take more than 30 minutes. So I'd say less than $300 parts and labor.

Originally Posted by minimarks
Would a aftermarket oil cooler solve this problem?
It would prevent mixing and the formation of the peanut butter gunk, since it would separate the oil system from the coolant system.
 
  #19  
Old 01-20-2009, 10:01 PM
MoxieMini's Avatar
MoxieMini
MoxieMini is offline
6th Gear
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,296
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Wow, that reminds me of chipotle sauce.
 
  #20  
Old 01-21-2009, 08:00 AM
Bigshot's Avatar
Bigshot
Bigshot is offline
6th Gear
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,513
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
I don't beleive you can bypass the stock cooler w/o some fab work.
 
  #21  
Old 01-21-2009, 11:19 AM
davavd's Avatar
davavd
davavd is offline
6th Gear
iTrader: (2)
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Covington, Louisiana
Posts: 1,506
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
You gotta love NAM. I had a small oil leak Tuesday morning and put the car in the nearest shop. When I went to pick it up, the mechanic said they couldn't stop the leak, and showed me where it was (in the above-pictured part - we didn't know what it was). As he was showing me, the leak turned from a trickle to a flood. I'm glad I wasn't on the road when this happened. I got the car towed to Munchen Motors, a shop that works on european cars only. They said that though it appeared to be from the oil cooler, it turned out to be a bad seal on the oil filter. Apparently, not everyone knows this seal needs to be replaced every time the filter is.
 

Last edited by davavd; 01-24-2009 at 05:09 AM.
  #22  
Old 01-22-2009, 07:16 AM
Bigshot's Avatar
Bigshot
Bigshot is offline
6th Gear
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,513
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Is this part of the oil filter housing?

Are there any aftermarket oil coolers that replace this part?
 
  #23  
Old 01-26-2009, 08:56 PM
Mach V Dan's Avatar
Mach V Dan
Mach V Dan is offline
Former Vendor
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Sterling, VA
Posts: 1,472
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Originally Posted by Bigshot
Is this part of the oil filter housing?
It's attached to it:

Name:  Heatexchanger.png
Views: 7263
Size:  13.0 KB

(The cooler is part 5 in the pic above. MINI calls it "heat exchanger.")

Are there any aftermarket oil coolers that replace this part?
Not that I'm aware of.

Edit: My mistake, there ARE aftermarket coolers that fit in place of that core. They're not cheap -- they come with a flat plate to go in place of the heat exchanger, and then lines that run to a remote-mounted air cooling core.

--Dan
Mach V
 

Last edited by Mach V Dan; 01-27-2009 at 11:34 AM.
  #24  
Old 01-27-2009, 07:23 AM
Bigshot's Avatar
Bigshot
Bigshot is offline
6th Gear
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,513
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Well after some more research I find out that just about all of the aftermarket oil coolers do replace this OEM part. But I couldn't find one with a thermostat.
 
  #25  
Old 01-27-2009, 08:52 AM
TonyB's Avatar
TonyB
TonyB is offline
6th Gear
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: a canyon, south Bay Area
Posts: 3,957
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
What's involved if one wanted to remove the oil filter housing? I'm guessing that the engine might need to be out...
 


Quick Reply: What happens when your oil cooler cracks? This...



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 01:14 AM.