Does anyone know whether or not BMW recommends that dealers overfill our engines with oil? It seems to happen a lot.

 

Why would it be the strategy to tell the user overfilling the oil may damage your engine, then have the dealer network overfill the oil? It happened to me yesterday during my first service. I was not impressed. I think it is just sloppiness, lack of training, and just trying to churn thru as many customers as possible.

 

I appreciate your thought, but ( via e-mail ), my "SA" said that they intentionally overfill the R56S because they use oil. Believe me, I will not lose that e-mail.

 

On my next dealer service, I'm definitely going to tell them what I found and not to overfill the oil. My CMS does not use oil and I check it every few weeks. It does seem like this is fairly widespread behavior by the dealers. It might be time to ask MINI USA what the heck the deal is.

 

No, they overfill straight Coopers too. I've learned to look my SA straight in the eye and say "no overfill, and don't wash her please!" Because they don't do the wash as well or as carefully as I do.

MINI OCD-- yes, I haz it.

 

JoanieB thanks for the posts recommending the CravenSpeed dipstick. I'm glad I had it in this case! Maybe the dealers need to get these so they can actually see the oil level!

 

You're welcome!!

Yes, the dealerships have just as much trouble with reading them, and that nonsense about overfilling because S models burn the oil is sort of lame. Wouldn't it be better to teach the owner how to properly read the dipstick, and give them a better one so that they can?

Pffft, MINI. All those high priced engineers, surely they can redesign the dipstick? At least take off the bottom bulb and give us some notches for the oil to puddle in. How hard is that?

 

Very interesting, checked all fluid levels Friday after I took it in for an oil change at dealer and the oil level is above maximum. My dipstick shows that the oil level is almost a full quart to much if the oil levels are consistent with the one quart amount between min/max fill line. Does anyone know exactly how much is needed to bring the oil level right at the maximum level?

 

I just brought in my 2011 R56S to dealer addressing engine oil, coolant are both above max level since the recent oil change.

They stated the oil level is at the max and there is no problem (hard-to-read dipstick shows it's above max tho), coolant level is sitting clearly above max line, but again, the note said no problem, mixture was perfectly 50/50 and cooling well.

Well, at least I have this whole conversation on record if any problem rises... (hope not)

And I've ordered cravenspeed dipstick to keep better eye on it.

For the next oil change (1/2 point of maintenance plan interval that I'll be paying myself), I'll try to tell them not to over fill. Cravenspeed dipstick will be there by then so I hope that helps (them).

I often tell them not to wash my car as well. There was this one service rep who ignored my request not to wash two occasions in a row. Sigh. This time when I visited the dealer, I learned she doesn't work there anymore... (I didn't submit the survey)

 

If you are good with tools, BlackIces modified dipstick is also very easy to read. The difference in the holes filled with oil and the holes not filled with oil is very easy to see. The following link shows this modification.

https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...119-post1.html

Morris, 2011 MC, PW/B

 

From what I've read (it's not in the manual) it's 4.4 quarts for the N18 engine on Cooper S models.

 

The last time I took the Mini in for the maintenance oil change I put an "oil 4.4" badge on the grill and they did not over fill the oil.

When we took the car in we asked that they don't put the plastic cone with a number on the roof and please do not wash the car. The dealer replace the temp sensor under recall (second time it was replaced), However they did wash the car and put tire slime on the tires. When we picked up the car the SA came out and helped wipe off the tire slime. He said he put DON'T WASH on the work sheet but the car wash guys don't look at the sheet. The good news is our tires were near used up so we are replacing them but the slime transferred to the side of car so I had to clean, wash the car and then wax it (clean the black trim too). I noticed the finish on the wheels looks different. I hope they did not use strong wheel cleaner on the wheels that I wax with special wax to keep the finish nice.

The printout from the dealer stated they checked and adjusted the tire pressures to a lower setting than I was running. I checked the tire pressure when I picked up the car and noted that they did not adjust the pressures. I was happy that they did not adjust the pressures but what about the integrity of the printout?

The dealer did not look at all the codes (not sure how that is possible) and as I picked up the car the next service showed 1000 miles (tac display on start up). The brake maintenance was due according to the car's tac computer.

We changed the wheels before taking the car back (installed the OEM run flats that we don't drive on normally) knowing they were going to remove the wheels this time. Should I be bothered that I took the car in a second time within 200 miles of the first visit and I told them they could keep the car as long as they needed to take care of all the items on the first visit? The dealer (second visit) reset the computer and did not change the pads saying they have 2 mm before they were at minimum spec. Again they washed the car and put tire slime on the tires. When we picked up the car the SA came out and helped wipe off the tire slime again. He said he put DON'T WASH on the work sheet but the wash guys don't look at the sheet. The good news is our tires were the OEM run flats that we don't drive on normally but the slime transferred to the car so I had to clean and wash the car again.

I took the OEM wheels off the car (at home) and the tires still have slime on them and they make a mess so I have them in trash bags. Tire slime is purely cosmetic and only makes tires look dark and new. Many tire slime product aid in acceleration of sidewall cracking and the slime reduces traction if finds its way to the contact surface. Some tire products clean the sidewalls but don't have slime. I don't know what the dealer uses but it makes a mess of my car and tires and I asked them not to use it. I also wash my cars as if I was doing a detail using good quality products, special water and methods to avoid scratches. I don't think a complimentary car wash at the dealer will be done with as much care but I did not see it. In addition I had to remove extra spilled oil (on the first visit) and water spots (from both visits) from the engine bay. I am still smiling and I am not sure why.

The next weekend we went for a drive and one of the guys on the dive was from Mini USA. He told me that Mini was trying to get more owners to take cars to the dealer after the maintenance period was over. I explained the latest interaction we had at the dealer and the $140.00 quote for the 5K interval oil changes. He smiled.

I understand that I am not a typical customer that is happy to have my car look like it had quick detail done when I pick it up. It is important to understand what is needed for customer satisfaction and when the customer makes it easier by asking for less (like less than 5 quarts of oil). It is difficult for an organization to "think" and change from the standard practices to accommodate the customer's request for accurate oil level or no quick car wash. This is why independent service is valued when the service is done by people that care about the car's long term needs and not just checking the boxes on a sheet that nobody looks at.

 

This post has nearly everything you may ever want to know about oil on a R56:
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...00-post13.html

 

The dealers use bottles of oil instead of out of a barrel, its probably just easier for them to dump it all in. The mechanic probably doesn't have a procedure for the remainder oil in the bottle since they would consider it "good". So its less of a foul to over fill your car and throw the bottle away empty on, than save or reuse the remainder of oil because there are major fines even a 1/2 bottle of oil in the trash.

 

My dealer pumps the oil from a barrel. When they overfilled my oil by over a quart, I had them remove the excess and asked how they add the oil. They said they pump from a barrel and keep a record of the amount added on each oil change. Their records showed that over 5 quarts of oil was added by mistake. Because their oil pump meters the oil very accurately, they assume the correct amount of oil is added and apparently don't verify the amount with the dipstick. Had they checked the record or read the dipstick they would have caught this mistake.

Morris, 2011 MC, PW/B

 

I found that I love my oil extractor tool. I used it to train myself on reading the oil level. I also added some little notches or holes to the dipstick to help read it.

 

Do you bring your oil extractor to the dealer? Do you use it when you pick up the car? You should not drive home with the crankcase overfilled.

 

I thought the dealer overfill issue was rare, but guess what? My first oil change came back what looks like about 1 quart more than is needed according to the dip stick (It's a Justa).

Is there really a policy at Mini to overfill on oil service? I'd perfer to have more oil in the engine "IF" it isn't an issue.

Years ago International put out a service update that said to use one additional quart of oil in their engines because it was determined that the oil reutrn gallies in the heads were too small and the oil didn't drain back into the oil pan fast enough under high RPM, thus starving the oil pump. Believe it or not, they actually said to fill your engine to the top full mark, then add another quart. After that you were to check the level with the dipstick, note how high the oil was on the dip stick and put a "new high mark" on it for future use.

Does anyone have a formal notice from Mini that says to over fill and that it is not an issue?

 

A little overfull has been proven to not be harmful in the short run. If these take 4.4 quarts and they are adding 5 whoopdee do. Dealers obviously have no problem with this practice. The best thing to do would be take it up with MINI every single time to get them to level off at full. And maybe the dealers will eventually have training to say "hey stop over filling" But apparently there aren't enough people complaining to make Mini even nudge, heck they have had plenty of time. They obviously have a bigger problem with people running low.
I have heard a few people who track their cars go a little over full anyway to make sure their oil pickup is always covered. And maybe they also estimate it will burn some in the process.

If the dealers are putting in over 5 quarts I would be a little more worried , but I haven't read any threads saying 5.5 quarts destroyed their R56 and the manufacture wouldn't cover it under warranty.


So if this is a serious detrimental issue to you just check your oil immediately after the oil change, let your service advisor know you are overfull. Insists he documents it in your records, or removes excess oil. If he removes excess oil your good if no. Then call MINI up and they should say it should be taken down to overfull and they can talk to the dealer explaining your problem.


Then problem solved.

When my car was covered by Maint Plan changes, I would let the dealer do their one a year and I would change at 6 months anyway myself.

 

I am confused. The owner's manual specifically states that overfilling your oil can be very harmful to your engine, but its OK for the dealer to overfill. Am I just stupid or is something wrong with this picture?
Bottom line: 1) R56s use oil, 2) the oil change intervals are long, 8-15,000 miles, 3) the dipstick reads falsely that the oil level is full when its low or really overfilled.
Please explain to me why someone should not be concerned considering the timing chain problems. After warranty the fixes for these problems are very expensive.

 

4.5 liters. I use synthetic liqui moly 5w-30 in my r53 its a better oil and exceeds bmw/mini long life standards and isn't a BP product. It is sold in liter / 5 liter jugs so I just buy I 5 liter jug measure out a half liter and put in a old 1 litter bottle that I keep in my car.

 

It is nearly impossible to get Mini to tell you how much oil to put in the car. I even called Mini USA and they could not/ would not tell me. After hunting all over the place I found MINI's internal technical service document that lists oil capacity by motor.

N12 (2007+ MINI Cooper) and N16 (latest motor as of 4-1-13) – 4.20 liters / 4.4381 quarts
N14 (2007+ MINI Cooper S) and N18 (latest motor as of 4-1-13) – 4.20 liters / 4.4381 quarts

Note that all Minis (R53 needs more than R56) do not hold the same amount of oil so be careful when asking or reading answers on message boards. The 2014 Mini gen 3 is due out and it may be completely different.

Take a look at the part that talks about overfilling:


What is wrong with overfilling?
Increased oil pressure (from over filling) can cause the PCV to release the extra oil into the intake or OCC. Oil in the intake can cause problems to the cat and alter the air fuel mixture and create increased carbon build up. When the crankcase is overfilled the oil gets wiped up into a foam from the crank and the pump is not able to pump foam. The result is your motor will not get oil and the pump could fail. Too much oil is just as bad as not enough and in some cases too much oil is worse. I interviewed three Mini dealers in my area and found that two did not know how much oil to put in the R56 v.s. the R53. Overfilling oil at the dealer has been reported by many Mini drivers. You, as the owner of a Mini, need to take responsibility for the work done on your car and the oil level.

If your motor is ever overfilled it is very difficult to check the level. It is a fine line between full and over full. What you are looking for ideally is a very small gap in the saturation (about 1 mm of some texture showing) between the upper ball and the recessed cylinder (if the tube still has some oil in it) or a clean upper ball (if the level is set perfect and the tube is clean). As soon as the upper ball is covered (due to the high level of oil in the motor) your only resort is to put the dipstick in a part way to a measured amount (use a socket or some kind of tool), then see if you can calibrate the difference in displacement. If that does not work for you, you can drain out all the oil and carefully measure the oil. This will force an oil change. If that is not desirable you can pump some oil out the dipstick tube or let some oil out of the pan. Most likely you don't have a topside oil pump to pump the oil out of the dipstick tube. If you remove the drain plug you should replace the crush washer. That can be a challenge if you are just letting out a small amount of oil.

 

A good way to check the amount of overfill with the stock dipstick or BlackIces modified dipstick is remove and clean the dipstick. Wait at least 20 minutes and then only insert it until the lowest part of the handle contacts the tube. Wait 10 seconds and pull it out and take a reading. The distance from the lowest part of the handle to the part of the handle that contacts the dipstick when fully inserted is almost exactly 1". The actual level will be 1" above the level shown. If the actual level is less than 1" overfilled it will be in the reading area. The reading area is approximately 1.4" (see link), so this method works for overfills of over a quart.

https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...02-post34.html

Morris, 2011 MC, PW/B

 

I used almost all 5 quarts of Royal Purple 5W-30 today during my oil change, I let it drain for (about 1 hour) a long time. Even now I'm not at maximum, I could pour the rest of the 5 quart bottle in and still not be over maximum. Jacking my cooper (R56) up on the drivers side helped get all the oil out, the oil is perfectly clear! I guess it matters how long you let the older oil drip for seems to determine how much you put in your engine.

 

I agree that you need to get all the oil out and check the level carefully as you add the oil back in.

Are you sure the car is 100% level when you are checking the oil level in the crankcase? The dipstick is not centered and if the side of the car with coolant bottle (transaxle side) is lower than the side with the dipstick the reading will be off. If you have an aftermarket oil cooler you will need more oil. If your dipstick is too short or not fully seated you will get a false reading. Did the oil make it to pan when you checked?