I'm going thru the owners manual and I am a bit confused on the paragraphs regarding DTC and DSC. Before responding, rcmd you take a look at those paragraphs as well. Okay...DSC comes standard with all. If you have DTC, then believe you also have DSC. When you activate DTC, they are both on and when you deactivate DTC, then they are both off. Besides, there is only one button for DTC, so that is how you activate or deactivate in tandem. Starting with that, here's my questions:

1) Do you agree with the above basic way they work ?
2) Reading the paragraphs in the manual...it seems there is a conflict in the write-up. It says one thing then the other. When the lamp is on, DTC/DSC is activated or deactivated ? One paragraph says lamp "on", it's activated but then another paragraph says it's deactivated. What gives ?
3) During normal driving, which may be 90% or more of the time....keep it deactivated ? I would think so - You use it when in the snow but...believe you also use it for sports driving ?
4) If you leave it on all the time, what is the negative effect...less gas mileage or leaving too much control to the computer chip ?

 

Page 58 makes the distinction.

-DSC is on by default.
-If you have DTC, when you push the DTC button once, DSC is turned OFF and DTC is ON. However keep in mind that DTC is basically a less-zealous version of DSC, which allows for some spirited wheelspin and some loss of stability before kicking with the DSC-like control of retarding throttle and/or braking. MINI makes a distinction that DTC is not DSC, but their action is similar and what differs is mostly the threshold for application. (as stated in the left column of page 58) To return to the default operating mode (DSC ON) just press the button once again.
-Because having DSC ON is the default, there are no lights on in the instrument cluster by default. A warning light indicator only appears if you turn DSC off and have either DTC ON or both systems deactivated. In both situations the car is warning you that it is going to attempt to control instability less or not prevent instability at all and to drive cautiously.
-If you hold the button for three seconds, both DTC and DSC are off and you're on your own to control the car should you wish to spin the tires or lose stability. (as stated in the right column of page 58)
-During "normal" driving and keep in mind-everybody's idea of normal is different, "most" people will leave DSC ON and thus not push any buttons. For snow or sporty driving, yes you would probably turn it off as it will retard your ability to get going or your ability to have fun respectively.
-Gas mileage is not affected at all. Some people don't like to feel that the car is controlled by the computer, although keep in mind the car also has the ability to brake an individual wheel at a time, unlike your left foot.

To recap, DSC is a very intrusive computer watching every move making sure you don't spin the tires (lose traction) or understeer or oversteer (lose stability). DTC is also the computer watching you, but the threshold for computer intervention is higher. With both off you're in control.

As quoted from the MINI website specifically about the JCW (as this has DTC standard):

"the new MINI John Cooper Works has three different modes that let the driver decide exactly how much assistance he wants controlling his MINI. With the default Dynamic Stability Control (DSC) 'on' mode, your MINI will automatically intervene at the slightest hint of instability and help the vehicle stay on a straight path by adjusting the engine power management system and apply brake force where needed.

With one push of the button DSC is turned off and the Dynamic Traction Control (DTC) takes over. Not only does this feature front axle traction when accelerating on slick or sandy surfaces, but it also helps deliver a more spirited ride with a higher threshold for wheel slip before the stability control system kicks in. It also reinstates power to the engine sooner than DSC making your backroad sorties all the more engaging.

And lastly for the highly skilled sport Moterer, both DSC and DTC can be switched off completely, putting the driver in almost complete control."

 

I'm responding to item 3 which says, "During normal driving, which may be 90% or more of the time....keep it deactivated ? I would think so - You use it when in the snow but...believe you also use it for sports driving ?"

DSC is off 99.9% of the time in my MINI. Ordered the auto with it because I thought it would help with re-sale. Tried it twice. Saw it interfered with operation and switched it off for good.

 

lovethecorners,

Thanks so much for the detailed explanation(s). I understand it better now. I also made a copy of your posting so I can review it again.

billie_morini,

Like you, I also ordered the optional DTC since I believe DSC comes standard. I recall checking if I got all my options that I had ordered and I believe the DTC was bundled with the Sort pkg or one of the other pkgs. Anyway, I was expecting to see a DSC button and a DTC button. Then realizing there was only a DTC button, I started checking out the owner's manual...also took a look at how it is described on the new car sticker you get with the MINI. It indicates DSC as standard and DTC as the option. When you get DTC it takes the place of the DSC button....or another way to look at it is the DSC button is now labeled the DTC button.

 

I realize I'm resurrecting a still-warm thread, but this got me to thinking. Could DTC be added after purchase by reprogramming or adjusting the parameters for DSC application? Or would that pesky DTC button pose a problem (difficult to change back and forth between DSC/DTC)?

 

My dealer said "no." Or at least my MA did.

Something that comes with DTC is EDLC which can not be turned off.

 

How did you turn it off for good mine comes back on as soon as I turn car off and on.

 

I have to believe it has to be deactivated post start up everytime...

 

FWIW- One thing I do know about the DSC... I drove my stock CMS4 on the Dragon last October and had it on all weekend. Not once did the car feel like the throttle was being retarded at all due to understeer. I was impressed by how well the car held the turn, minimal wheel squeal, able to punch it at the apex of the turn. That being said, I have a corner near my house which I like to rail. The other day I decided to turn off the DSC and see if the DTC would pull the car through the turn by the front end. Nope, understeered right into the other lane even when staying on the gas.

I'm sure if I was auto-crossing an F56 it would be a whole other ball of wax though.