I came across this today and my first thought after reading: Phooey! I've got a stick shift and am not afraid to use it! Anyone else out there with manuals? Check out the article:
http://editorial.autos.msn.com/article.aspx?cp-documentid=656470

 

Dang, slimjimtell beat me to it!

 

I have a JCW. It may well be the last manual I have.

I just got rid of a '05 M3 with the SMG II. The transmission was far superior to having a clutch pedal, which I consider archaic. Super quick upshifts, and downshifts with rev matching, no possibility of money shifts. It was awesome.

Double clutch gearboxes are the future. I can't wait to have one.

Consider this. Most of the top flight road racing series nowadays use sequential gearboxes.

 

It’s not about the quickness of shifts or race cars or 0-60 times. It about the fun of driving. Can you take off, run through the gears with out the passengers knowing it? Brake into a corner match revs and make a seamless down shift? The Auto takes that away. I am sure in the future you could get a car that will not only shift itself but drive for you. It would be easier, probably safer and faster, save gas but what fun is that? 3 pedals and a stick for me.

 

+1 Well said.

 

It's like the difference between a mechanical watch and a quartz watch. The quartz watch will be cheaper, more compact, more reliable, and more accurate. But mechanical watches still exist because there are enthusiasts out there who enjoy and appreciate the way the machinery all works together.

 

Paddling shifting IMHO, sucks for the most part on cars, the delay is annoying. On the higher end sports cars, and formula one it is much better. I love the real control of driving stick, it is the way sports cars are supposed to be. There is nothing like dropping the hammer and overtaking someone. I know most people are too d**m lazy to learn to drive stick anymore. But most people also love the vanilla Camrys also. There is a fun factor to stick, and it goes really well with the fun factor of the Mini Cooper.

When I get a Ferrari I will use the paddle shifters, real men and women use the clutch. Workout the left foot, it help to balance the the workout on the gas pedal with the right foot.

 

Have to agree with SaltNPepa and proximal, if all we cared about was speed we wouldn't be driving MINIs because there is a lot out there that can go faster and is far smoother for the same money. I purposely chose an 2006 R53 over a 2007 R56 for the visceral nature of the supercharger, the steering response and the far more positive clutch feel. If I cared about smoothness I'd have bought a 3-series auto but that's not much of a challenge, it doesn't give me the same satisfaction, nor is at as fun. The amazement of the computer blipping the throttle perfectly every time would loose its appeal; while perfectly heel-toeing on my R53 still sets my heart aflutter.

To proximal for the watch example. Spot on. In the technology age, enthusiasts are a dying breed. I work for Apple and love my technology and how it makes my life easier but it doesn't give me the same pleasure as rowing through the gears of my R53, changing the day on my watch each month or taking out my fountain pen to sign a paper. I can admit there may be "better" or "easier" ways to do the same thing however I relish attention to detail and connectedness that is unfortunately lost by many in this day and age.

 

That's just an old & tired load of total B.S. I drove an M3 SMG for years and that didn't make me less "real." And are race drivers not "real"? In fact, not having a clutch, allows one to to focus your attention on other, more important skills like braking, steering, car control, etc. It helps improve driving performance.

Don't compare sequential and double clutch gearboxes (like on the M3) to more traditional automatics with the steering wheel paddles (like on the MINI). They are not the same, and it isn't what the article is talking about. Nothing is faster than a SMG/DCT shift. There is no delay. A standard manual with a clutch pedal has more delay.

 

Now i have heard "Real B.S." Part of braking in a sports car is using the engine and transmission to do braking for you. Unless you are driving a formula one car there is no Non-Manual Transmission that can do what you can with Manual Transmission.

 

I would never give up manual shifting willingly... to much fun .

 

With all the fine arguements pro and con, just a plain manual sure does put a grin on my face. It'll be very interesting to see how these transmissions, develop in the future. As RaceTripper points out much of the cutting edge is in racing, but for my humble purposes our JCW will continue to be all I need. I know it may be slower, and old fashioned, but practicing sure is fun!!!!

 

You are very wrong about that. Sequential and double-clutch gearboxes are direct coupled just like the clutched manuals you are used to. You can use them to engine brake, and they work better at it than with a clutch-pedaled manual, because you aren't compromising a level of control due to heel-toe downshifting. I spent three years tracking my M3 with the sequential gearbox. I was faster and was able to brake better with the SMG than I ever could with a clutch pedal. I could also downshift in places where those with clutch pedals couldn't, because it could get it done and restore the car's balance so quickly

One other thing, you use your brakes to brake on a track, not the gearbox. Downshifting is for getting you into the right gear for the fastest apex speeds. It may provide some help for braking, but you really want the brakes to do the work. Why do you think BBKs are used? Engine braking does not help the car's balance, and when you are on the edge, that is very important to the handling dynamics. I don't engine brake on the street either. I rev-match the engine to get it in the right range for the completed downshift, using heel-toe braking if necessary. Try engine braking in the wet and see how jittery your car gets, compared to using the brakes.

A clutch-pedaled manual adds zero positive benefit to performance driving over a sequential or double clutch gearbox. It's fine if you prefer the clutch pedal for fun and driving engagement, but don't claim it is superior to new direct-coupled transmission technologies, because it isn't. Like it or not, it's an archaic technology whose days are numbered.

BTW: Porsche just introduced a double-clutch gearbox on the new 911, and they expect it to outsell the 6 speed manual. Europeans will buy it into the double-clutch gearbox. Americans are still having trouble "getting it."

 

Sooner or later manuals will be gone!!!! I'll enjoy it as long as I can, maybe there will be a classic category for racing with manual transmissions.
Can a car with a double-clutch transmission be push started?

 

I don't know, and don't even know the answer for the M3 I had with a sequential gearbox, although it was never an issue. However, usually you jump start a manual because the battery has died. On a MINI or BMW if the battery is dead, the electrical and fuel system necessary for starting don't engage, so it's a moot point. You can't jump start a MINI or BMW (or a lot of other cars) with a dead battery anymore.

 

I am glad to hear the auto is getting better, but the bottom line is when I test drove the auto, it just didn't feel the same to me. I felt more in control with the Manual. I have always had Manuals, my wife's car is an automatic,which I know how to drive as well. I think to each his own but for me, I like the manual transmission..

 

Sorry for going off topic, but I assume none of those bemoaning the end of manual shifting are interested in the MINI E?

Looking at the interior, the tachometer appears to be replaced by a charge indicator - http://jalopnik.com/photogallery/min...thumb1280x1280

I also prefer manual shifts for a gas-powered engine, but I have a feeling that electric motors (with no gears) will become the norm before only double-clutch gearboxes are available with internal combustion engines.

 

Gee, cost does seem to matter, doesn't it.
New technology ain't cheap.
Some of us have never owned an automatic.
I had one as a loaner this month(Club Door won't open...part is on backorder now) and the automatic feels, well, weird and wrong.

 

Actually, I wouldn't mind having a MINI E as a daily driver. But I am old fashioned and possessive and they won't sell it as far as I understand!

 

And you are in the wrong location. LA and NYC areas only, IIRC.

 

For those who love cars and driving them for what they are and not as means to get from point A to B, manual shifting will always be the preferred transmission. Especially for me, coming from Europe and having driven only manuals, it'll be a sad day when I can't find a manual.

In the sedan category not many offer much consolation (I think from the major car makers only Acura -- TSX and BMW might be offering a manual option, with some one or two other exceptions, I'm sure).

As for the braking part, anyone who's driven manual can tell how much better it feels to brake with manual downshift and how much more the driver is in control. It's saved me at least a couple of times that I can remember, when everyone in front of me were spiraling out of their lanes or whatever. Night and day for me. Unfortunately, like many other good things it seems manuals (at least here in the U.S.) are faced with extinction in the near future.

 

+1, but the real future is clutchless electric vehicles, 100% torque at 0 RPM!...and I still like my clutch, even though I'll never be able to match the speed or efficiency of a computer controlled version.

 

I know, how sad!!
For sure!

 

When the Body Control module went bad on my Cabrio, it took it's toll on the battery. We had to jump/push start it on several occasions. It worked like a charm We'd have been stuck in Hawn State Park if it had not worked. So am I not understanding something

Lois

 

Maybe it had enough charge to get the support systems going but not enough to turn the engine over? The MINI might be different, but if a battery is totally dead I don't think you can jump start a newer BMW.