Are ther more Coopers or "S" 's on the road? Also with the "S", do you think the engine is too stressed thus killing the long term life. Will it last 80k? Adding an exhaust and intake to a Cooper, do you really feel the difference? Has anyone tested a 0 - 60 time difference with the changes? Any dyno numbers?

 

When a Mini goes by you on the street, you can't tell if it's a Mini or an S. The only people that can answer this are the dealers. They can say if they're selling more Coopers or S's. And even then, it doesn't mean much because of demographics, the economy, etc.

 

I'm not sure which engine is more stressed.

In the Cooper, the compression ratio is 10.6:1.

In the S, the compression ratio is 8.3:1..... then the supercharger kicks in.

After driving both, I perfer the S of course... but who doesn't?

Take a look at the article I mentioned in another post at http://www.sae.org/congress/2001/showtue.pdf where, although the reference is to the joint venture between DaimlerChrysler and BMW, the engineering efforts are described in some limited detail.

In addition, the manufacturing plants in Brazil are as modern as anywhere in the world. I've been to the GE Aircraft plant in Petropolis and the lighting plant outside of Rio. Nice, clean, modern, dedicated workforce. You've probably flown in a Brazil commuter airplane and never knew it too.

I'm pretty damn confident the engine will be as long-lasting as anything else engineered by the autobuilders who mass-produce in such a fashion.

 

Sergio,

MINI is making and importing about 70% MC to 30% MCS. The MC was also available 3-6 months before the S hit the market here. So there are significantly more MC's on the road than MCS's.

However, demand is about 50-50, MC vs MCS. Which is why you can get an MC almost immediately in most of the country, but the S still has waiting lists in most of the country; as much as 1 year in CA.

The Diamler/Chrysler produced engine in the MCS is well made and proven. The compression ratio is low and the internals are of the highest quality. Judging from the gains being made with simple add-ons by some on these forums, it would seem the stock MCS is slightly de-tuned. For these reasons, I believe with proper car and treatment, the MCS engine should be good for at least 150k miles.

For performance results with different mods, take a good look through the performance mods forum on this site. There is a ton of information there, it just takes some effort and time to dig it out.

Cheers,

James

 

The sound of the supercharger spooling up at higher revs is worth the price of admission. The slick shifting Getrag 6 speed gearbox is just an added bonus. As far as telling the difference between the two models on the street; the "S" has the hood scoop in the front, the "S" badge and white marker lamps on the side and the two centered exhaust tips in the rear, not to mention the differences in bumpers, grilles, gascaps, tailgate latches and rear spoilers.

 

<< When a Mini goes by you on the street, you can't tell if it's a Mini or an S.

I think the difference is pretty obvious, especially if you see it head on. You can't miss that engine scoop.

 

I prefer the Cooper rather than the S.

I'll take the non-aspirated roar of my MC (helped slightly by Viper intake & Rogue exhaust) over a supercharger whine any day...

 

I would actually love to see a statistical breakdown of the demographics of people who buy MCs and MCSs. It would be interesting to compare.

IMO, they're really different cars, with different audiences.

 

Here are my thoughts [for the 20th time :smile:]

I've never driven a car where there was more gearbox change from 100 miles to 8,000 miles as in the Cooper. The difference is dramatic. A couple weeks ago I drove a friend's MCS extensively back to back with my Cooper. I had driven an MCS several times before but this was the first time I was able to put both through their paces on challenging roads back to back. The biggest surprise to both of us was how fast the Cooper was 0-30. It actually felt faster than the MCS. Also of note to us was the MC's clutch was much more precise (The MCS's felt like a truck in comarison) while the MCS's gearbox was a definate notch above the MC's. One thing that became obvious to me was the Sports Suspension Plus make a big difference in sporty driving. It's optional on the MC and standard on the MCS.

All things being considered if you're planning on doing performance drivng the MCS makes more sense. If you're planning on doing extensive mods the MCS makes more sense. If you live in an urban area and like "sporty" driving either make sense. The thing is there is no one right answer for everyone. I'm sure someone properly trained driving an MC could run rings around some MCS drivers. Sure the MCS is by and large the faster car - but that doesn't make it the better car in every case.

 

All things being considered if you're planning on doing performance drivng the MCS makes more sense. If you're planning on doing extensive mods the MCS makes more sense. If you live in an urban area and like "sporty" driving either make sense. The thing is there is no one right answer for everyone. I'm sure someone properly trained driving an MC could run rings around some MCS drivers. Sure the MCS is by and large the faster car - but that doesn't make it the better car in every case.

Gabe:

Agree completely, I've driven both, immensely enjoyed the MC and the MCS. In the end I chose the MCS partly for its ability to mod the engine, and partly for its gearbox. I too felt that the MC was quicker off the line, and has a much easier clutch take-up.

 

Here is my point on why I went for an MC.. As I have kept my original Mini for 30 (yes 30) years I would like to keep my New MC for at least I0 years. Over this period the MCS will cost me £7000 ($10,000) more than the MC with the increase Car cost (£3000), increase in fuel consumption (9miles to UK gallon) (as per brochure figures) and increase in insurance (£300 a year). Although I still think about an S I still feel I have made the right descision. :smile:

 

John,

I am considering a Viper for my Cooper and have a few questions.

What are your thoughts on the Viper intake, in general?

Did you notice a performance increase, perceived or real, with just the Viper as the only engine mod? This question is applicable only if you did the intake before the Rogue.

Is it mounted to the engine bay or hanging lose? I've seen pictures of it installed but can't tell if it's mounted to anything.

Thanks for your feedback.

retroom



>>I prefer the Cooper rather than the S.
>>
>>I'll take the non-aspirated roar of my MC (helped slightly by Viper intake & Rogue exhaust) over a supercharger whine any day...

 

I agree with Gabe and MGCMAN; both are excellent cars; both have their unique qualities and purpose; you can't go wrong with either.

Maybe someday I'll manage to have one of each!

Cheers,

James

 

>><< When a Mini goes by you on the street, you can't tell if it's a Mini or an S.
>>
>>I think the difference is pretty obvious, especially if you see it head on. You can't miss that engine scoop.


Let's not forget the chrome tailgate latch on the cooper vs bodycolor on S and same with the grill. And the dual exhaust on the S is also easy to spot from a distance.

 

>>However, demand is about 50-50, MC vs MCS.

I can't say wat the "demand" is, but sales are 60% Cooper and 40% Cooper-S



The data came from roadfly.com where a saled dude posts updates.

 

>>>><< When a Mini goes by you on the street, you can't tell if it's a Mini or an S.
>>>>
>>>>I think the difference is pretty obvious, especially if you see it head on. You can't miss that engine scoop.
>>
>>
>>Let's not forget the chrome tailgate latch on the cooper vs bodycolor on S and same with the grill. And the dual exhaust on the S is also easy to spot from a distance.

And from the side, the gas cap

 

>>>>>><< When a Mini goes by you on the street, you can't tell if it's a Mini or an S.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I think the difference is pretty obvious, especially if you see it head on. You can't miss that engine scoop.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Let's not forget the chrome tailgate latch on the cooper vs bodycolor on S and same with the grill. And the dual exhaust on the S is also easy to spot from a distance.
>>
>>And from the side, the gas cap

Perhaps us uneducated S drivers are only imagining these suttle differences

 

>><< When a Mini goes by you on the street, you can't tell if it's a Mini or an S.
>>
>>I think the difference is pretty obvious, especially if you see it head on. You can't miss that engine scoop.

The taillpipe location defines the difference in the back (and the red S).

 

you people are funny

 

>>>>>><< When a Mini goes by you on the street, you can't tell if it's a Mini or an S.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I think the difference is pretty obvious, especially if you see it head on. You can't miss that engine scoop.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Let's not forget the chrome tailgate latch on the cooper vs bodycolor on S and same with the grill. And the dual exhaust on the S is also easy to spot from a distance.
>>
>>And from the side, the gas cap

Not so obvious for the poor folks in the minivan poking along in the right lane when you blast by on the left, though.

 

>>Are ther more Coopers or "S" 's on the road? Also with the "S", do you think the engine is too stressed thus killing the long term life. Will it last 80k? Adding an exhaust and intake to a Cooper, do you really feel the difference? Has anyone tested a 0 - 60 time difference with the changes? Any dyno numbers?<<

Just by virtue of the production numbers there should be more Cooper's than S's on the road. The "stress" on a motor comes from driving styles more than design. I'd say driving the two identically, the standard motor would be subject to more stress as you would have to push it a little harder to get the same amount of weight rolling. After the exhaust and intake instilation, the freer breathing motor seemed to rev faster. No ideas on the time difference though. Personally, I prefer the S. To me, it represents better value for the dollar. The $3000 difference in price is more than made up for by the better manual tranny, the better suspension and the added hp. That's not to mention, what I consider, slightly better styling, to boot.

_________________
03 B/W S model; Madness intake; Cibie 45 lamps; Magnaflow exhaust

 

"When a Mini goes by you on the street, you can't tell if it's a Mini or an S"

You can tell by color - EB (MCS) or Silk Green (MC) and the host of reasons above.

 

If the S didn't have the mail slot and more pug-nosed front, I'd have been more interested. I thought about it, then test drove the Cooper and asked myself what I was willing to do for a new ride. I decided not to test drive the S, so as not to be too tempted. I got all packages and a more graceful looking Cooper for the price of the base S. I don't much like the sound of a supercharger, though I'm sure I'd like the extra horsepower. I simply couldn't see waiting an extra 8 months for it (I waited 4 months for my MC). Looks, features and not waiting a year were the 3 deciding factors in my getting my PS/B MC. I have not regretted my decision.

 

>>>>When a Mini goes by you on the street, you can't tell if it's a Mini or an S

let's not forget the Scoop on the S!

 

>>I prefer the Cooper rather than the S.
>>
>>I'll take the non-aspirated roar of my MC (helped slightly by Viper intake & Rogue exhaust) over a supercharger whine any day...

I'll take 163 stock hp and 155 lb-ft of torque and put up with the MCS's supercharger “whine” over 115 stock hp and 110 lb-ft of torque of a modified normally aspirated MC's induction system "roar". That’s a 42% increase in hp and a 41% increase in torque. You would have to do a LOT of modifications on a MC to achieve the performance levels of the MCS. The MCS with its increased power, taunt go-cart suspension and slick shifting Getrag 6 speed gearbox makes the $3,000 increase in price a bargain.