Or otherwise known as "Event Data Recorders"? (EDRs)

I am asking because I am just finished watching a CNN report which states that about 40 million vehicles made since 2004 come with some sort of EDR device from factory.

Supposedly, the presence of an EDR should be mentioned in the Owner's manual (Haven't looked, yet)

People involved in accidents have been sent to jain based upon results recorded by the onboard black box. Its like having a silent witness there with you all the time. Scary stuff to say the least

 

Holy big brother...you'd think that'd have to be disclosed to you...

But it makes me think of the things people have said about their SA comment on their driving based on something they pulled off the key? I have a hard time believing that though...

 

Have you been to the dealership service department. Did you notice the SA putting your key in that slot thingy next to thier computer. The key will read out lots of things. Ask the SA the next time you are in and I bet they can pull up all kinds of data like RPM in gear etc.

 

Yes, your car does have something like a black box. it doesn't tell where you've been but it tells what your cars been doing. Before they replaced my engine they had to check and make sure i hadn't over-reved it. The black box isn't so they can refuse the warranty but so they can figure out what's going on. these cars have lots of electronics and the mechanics need to be able to see what the cars been doing before they can diagnose that mystery problem you want them to fix.

 

THey have rev limiters to keep from over revving, that was a line.

These 'black boxes' are real. They record somewhere between a 5 and 10 secod loop most typically. The loop stops the moment the airbags are deployed. Typical recorded paramters are brake, brake force, throttle position, vehicle speed, and a few other key things.

GM has put these in EVERY car they have produced since 96 I believe. It's been a while since I did all the reading on thse, but that's all the general information.

IMO, it should be a private thing and require consent before allowed to access. It's an integral part of the vehicle of which is private property!

 

all cars produced after 1996 have that. that's what's called obd2

 

The problem is that once the vehicle is involved in an accident or crime, it becomes the state property while determinig what happened.

BEATNUT

 

The rev limiter only prevents an over-rev on acceleration.

Dropping your car into 2nd gear at 85mph will over-rev it, regardless of any fancy electronic revlimiters

 

the term for that is "the money shift".

 

IMO this shouldn't require consent because once you put this on the road it is no longer really private. It something is private then it should only affect you, but once you put your car on the road how you drive and what happens can affect 100's of people. Yes you might still own the car so I think someone should have to access the car legally but if you are involved in an accident then it should be fair game to the police and insurance company. Just my thought.

 

well, we don't speed on the streets, so wth do we need to worry about?

 

This has been discussed already here https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...&highlight=edr
All the DOT references are there.

64% of all cars made in 2005 have them

Yes its very scary.

No, its not Obdii ... not even close.

 

I don't understand what some of you are worried about. This is not something that is taken from your car when there is a wreck. The term black box is not the right term here. This is used for car diagnostics not proving what really happened in an accident.

You wouldn't believe the amount of people that either don't know what's wrong with their car when it gets to the shop or that don't tell the truth about what happend just to get it fixed for free.

Try it this way. Pretend you own a car company. Someone comes in with a car that doesn't go in third gear anymore. They don't know why but it's under warranty and they want it fixed. That would be a thousand or so dollars for you to fix/replace. Even better say it's an American car with no extended warranty and they want to know why their car doesn't go into third gear anymore. Your techs check the car out to find out that it went into reverse from third gear for whatever reason at 60mph. We don't know how or why at this point but we now know the reason the car is broken.

Did it happen because your teenage kid did it when you lent her the car? Did the passenger do when reaching for the stereo from the back seat? Maybe there are cars like it that have the same problem and there should be a recall.

The information you get from the car is not going to tell you when and where the problem occured. It's going to tell the milage it occured, the engine rpm's, the gear it was in, the exhaust gas content, the fuel mixture, brake pedal positon, throttle position, maybe the angle of the sterring wheel. Not something the local police department is after to see why you rear ended old lady Crabtree.

Relax people no one is out to get you.... Well, most of you.

There is an expensive device I've seen that some rental car companies and wealthy parents use to track the location and speed of the car.

 

Man that guy is longwinded! Who let him on here?

 

Well, the concern is an event recorder, which BMW says they don't plan to place in their cars for a couple years yet. The issue is NOT the diagnostic box.

The event recorder, and the information it records is your private property. Many attorneys maintain the information on a recorder is your property, and that even the manufacturers admit the recorders are not 100% foolproof. People have gone to prison on what they contain, as was reported by CNN.

One person was convicted of vehicular manslaughter because the recorder information said their car was going something close to 100 miles an hour at the time of impact. It was an icy street, and they lost control. Ya think WHEEL SPIN might have fooled the recorder into thinking the car was going a lot faster than it was? The local cops said their investigation based on physical evidence showed more like 50 mph at impact. But the judge allowed the recorder, and jury believed fallable technology, over physical evidence.

 

I'm completely horrified by this.

Victory Coffee, anyone? :impatient

 

I believe that gentleman went to jail for 25-30 years. His 2002 Pontiac Firebird struck a car that was coming out in reverse from a home's driveway. 2 teenage girls were killed in the car backing out onto the street. His EDR box in the Pontiac recorded his travelling speed at time of impact @ 110MPH. Obviously at that speed, this individual would not have survived the crash either.

It is pretty troublesome to think the ways in which these electronic recorders can be used against you in a court of law.

Be careful out there.

 

im not taking either sides here, but if the guy driving the
Pontiac was driving per the speed limit in a neighborhood with
typically 25mph or 30mph speed zones, even if he hit the car
the girls would have probably survived the crash. that's why
we have speed limits and take driving lessons in the first place
to become a safe driver.

the point of all of this is that if you are a selfish offensive
driver your opponents (especially their parents) will use
everything in their power to put you away for a long time.

 

WHen the states pay my car notes ... I will let them look into my private property as they please!

This is something TOTALLY different then OBD2. ODB2 is an emissions standard that all 96 and above cars must follow. It's defined by a universal set of emission related trouble codes. More specific trouble codes do not follow have standards however. Ex, p0300 is always random misfires as is p0301 is a misfire in cylinder 1, p0302 misfire in #2. The o2 sensor codes also follow the OBD2 standard. WHat you are thinking about it the 'freeze frame', which is not a standard, it's more of a diagnostic feature and varies between manufactures.

The 'black box' is different in that it has nothing to do with emissions.

 

Good point ... I wasn't thinking of that.

 

Then in the same case, I should be able to search your car at free will.

 

Because its an invasion of privacy. Read here

Tied into GPS navigation computers, EDRs could give interested parties the ability to take automated ticketing to the next level. Since the data recorders can continuously monitor most of the operating parameters of a vehicle as it travels -- and the GPS unit can precisely locate the vehicle in "real time," wherever it happens to be at any given moment -- any and all incidents of "speeding" could be immediately detected and a piece of paying paper issued to the offender faster than he could tap the brake. ...

EDRs would provide irrefutable evidence of high-speed driving, for example -- or make it impossible for a person injured in a crash to deny he wasn't wearing a seat belt.

Insurance companies will launch "safety" campaigns urging that "we use available technology" to identify "unsafe" drivers -- and who will be able to argue against that?