Has anyone heard of this?
A friend of mine's father is a tow-truck driver, and he recently warned me about driving through puddles in the rain. Apparently, he's been picking up some of MINIs recently that have been getting water sucked into the engine somehow, either through the Cold Air intake or through the intercooler or something. The Water then pretty much ruins the engine or a least costs a lot of money to repair. I guess the puddles really don't have to be that deep either, perhaps only an inch or so. Has anyone else heard anything like this before? Is this purely myth? It sure has been raining here a lot recently, maybe I sould be careful...

 

Well I don;t recommend it but I've forged water, driven through a CAT 3 (At full on highway speeds) hurricane and been in downpours with a CAI, no water damage. It has happened I think it takes 4 or so inches of water (which is ALWAYS deeper than it looks) so I could see where this has happenedin areas getting lots of rain, the real danger from water comes with the exhaust not the intake on a stock car because thats the easiest way for water to creep in. I'd say not really a myth, but there is excessive concern/I need an SUV menatality.

 

Read your MINI Owner's Manual. It specifically warns against driving through deep standing water over 6 or 7 inches deep (I think that's the depth). Water being sucked into the engine will wreck it. And if you do drive through deep-ish water, go VERY slowly, like 5 mph or less.

 

Another reason to avoid puddles is that you could short out the power steering fan. This unit is very low and exposed and is not waterproof.

 

This is all some good info guys thanks. I never would've thought about water creeping in through the exhaust, but it really makes a lot of sense.

 

I never cease to be amazed at how cavalierly some drivers are to driving in rain and blasting through standing water. I recently saw a Land Rover Range Rover go blasting through water that looked to be about 10 inches deep (based on the level of the water on the wheels) and the RR stalled. It turns out the engine hydrolocked from water ingestion, and the owner is out $5,000 for a replacement engine.... When I asked what possessed them to blast through the standing water, they replied that LR states that the RR can ford through 20 inches of water (but not at 35 mph, dumbs**t)....

 

yeah, "water ingestion", that's the term I was looking for earlier.

 

Road & Track's long term Cooper S had to get it's engine replaced b/c a staffer drove through standing water rather quickly.

 

That had to throw off there cost of ownership for that mini.

 

Do any MCS drivers "block" their hood scoops, to go thru the touchless car wash?

My kids like to watch the steaming scoop while I'm drying the just-washed car, but the engine splutters a bit if I leave it running while in the wash bay.

Perhaps this is a moot point now that snow/salt season is likely over - MCS can bathe right in the driveway . Still, I'd like to know...

Tatt

 

My manual says 12 inches.

 

Please pardon my ignorance. I've always heard that it is very bad for water to get inside the engine, but never understood why. What does water do that is so severe that it requires the entire engine to be replaced?

 

You shouldn't experience any problems with a stock MINI in a carwash - touchless or touched. CAI or HAI is another matter. I have run my MCSa through the touchless as well as the traditional touched (the touched carwash guarantees no scratches and so far they haven't scratched yet) carwashes with no problems. Where the problem generally occurs with running through standing water is that the wheels act as a high pressure under-hood spray. With enough spray, water gets into the intake tract and from there to the engine.

 

Water in liquid form does not compress. When liquid water gets into the combustion chamber, and doesn't compress, something has to give. It can be the grooves on the piston where the rings are mounted, the piston itself, connecting rod(s), head gasket, etc. If any of the items that I just mentioned fail, you are looking at a significant repair or replacement of the engine. The variable is how much uncompressible liquid is ingested.

 

Water, being a dense liquid rather than a gas, simply refuses to be compressed in an internal combustion engine. Seems that it would rather hole pistons and break connecting rods that be reduced to 1/10th its former volume.

Both MCS and MC engines (as well as all other engines) are succeptible to hydro-locking. Maybe because of our cars' low stance or the owners' driving styles, MINIs seem to be prominent on the hydro-locked engine parade.

Edit: Oops! caminifan beat me to it!

 

Most simply water and oil don't mix.

 

It is the owner's driving style that causes hydrolocking. I have seen three cases of hydrolocking and every one was due to the operator driving fast through standing water.

 

It is not that oil and water don't mix; it is because water in liquid form does not compress.

 

If it was able to mix with the oil then it properties would be as such where it could compress, and there wouldn't be this issue, so it is and indirect simpler way of think about it and something to remember before you decide to forge rivers in your MINI. Don't disagreeing with you at all.

 

The cause of hydrolocking is that water in liquid form (oil too, for that matter) does not compress. Water in vapor form (and oil in vapor form) does compress - look at water injection as a means of reducing the intake charge temperature, which reduces the octane requirement for an engine. With water injection, a tiny amount of water (~2-4 ml (thousandth of a liter)) is sprayed (initial atomization process, which is further helped by contact with hot intake manifold and cylinder head; by the time the water gets to the combustion chamber, it has been converted to steam, which is the vapor form of water). In an engine that has hydrolocked, anywhere from a teaspoon to a couple of tablespoons or more of liquid water are in the combustion chamber. Oil getting past the rings or valve seals and burning (the blueish-white smoke is on the order of ~1 quart/1,000+ miles) is likewise, a very tiny amount that by the time it gets to the combustion chamber has been vaporized.

 

Though it's in a different location in the COOPER, the air intake is not inline with the hood scoop. If you look through the hood scoop, what you see is the intercooler. Open the hood and look over to the right of the hood scoop, That's the intake.

With the hood closed, water has quite a long and snaking path to take in order to reach the combustion chamber.

The air intake is located above the grill opening. Air (or in this case, water,) has to enter from below the bumper or through the grill slats, then move upward into the intake. There is a drain-off section of the intake hose. Water has to be of sufficient quantity to flood out the drain-off, where it must then enter the air cleaner box through the lower hose, move through the air filter, then make a u-turn and exit the air cleaner box through a higher hose, where it must then proceed through the throttle body, and ultimately enter the combustion chamber.

I'm not saying that it is impossible for water to get ingested by the motor (because it's obvious hydrolock has occurred to at least 3 people). I'm just saying it won't happen by simply washing the car with the hood closed, nor by driving through rain or being splashed with water by other cars.

Driving in deep water higher than the grill slats, or rushing through water where a wave of water can be pushed up above the radiator/condensor and into the air intake, or running the car with the hood open and directing a garden hose into the intake, are the most likely true reasons people have hydrolocked their engines.

Furthermore, getting sufficient quantity of water into the intake path of any vehicle could result in the same, so this can hardly be attributed as a MINI-specific problem.

 

What about water getting sucked up through the exhaust pipe - fact or fiction?

 

If you had to guess, which would you choose, and why?

 

My experience wasn't quite that way. When my Nissan Pathfinder was about 1 week old, I was skimming the surf along the Sea of Cortez in Baja California. The waves came in a bit faster than I expected and the water got into the wheelwell where my air intake was. I then proceeded to start floating in the sea until my buddies yanked my out with a strap. The engine wouldn't crank at all.

I had to pull all of the plugs out and then crank the engine. Geysers of water popped out of the spark plug holes about 3 - 4 ft high. I dried the spark plugs, let the air filter dry in the sun for 1/2 hr, then put it all back together. Turned the key and it started right up. Worked great for about 8 years and then I sold it. Never did see any result from that experience.

Not much to do with MINI's but I thought it might be fun to read about.

 

Hold your hand on the end of your tailpipe with the engine running. Is it sucking or blowing?