which would out-perform the other with light modding? drag? track? autox?
(competition with my friend who wants a 330i)

please post even opinions or educated guesses!

-Paul

 

My wifes 330 is a convertible so it doesn't perform as well as a coupe would. I will take my MCS everytime in a performance arena. The 330 is a beautiful car but I like the feel of my car. The fun factor in a MINI is off the charts as far as I am concerned. The 330 performs admirably and feels more civilized but I like the rawness of my MINI. Now my MCS is pretty heavily modded in the suspension but all I have as far as engine mods is an Alta 15% and a JCW intake and full Milltek exhaust. My wifes car is stock. This is just opinion based on the "feel" of the cars, no hard numbers, so I hope that helps.

 

straight line .. 330CI
auto x .. MCS

I have a 330CI sportpack with Bilstein PSS9 (max) handling equivalent to stock MCS sportpack. If your MCS have better tire than stock .. you'll beat him at auto x for sure.

 

That's a very cool picture!

 

I agree, that is very cool picture:th umbsup:

 

i have raced a 330 with the new bmw tuning/sport set up with the lil hp upgrade (235hp i believe) with my mini... and i most say the 330 will take a nouse on the line jump due to the rear wheels drive.. but as soon as the mcs gets some grip its over...
we ran 3 times, out the hole i got him, then 2 rolls at 60mph and the at 80mph and i most say he was unable to even keep up...

the 330 drive was a little mad he spent almost 40k for the 330 tuning... and well got smoke by a 25K mini....

Carlos

 

thanks all so far, keep posting! now I can show my friend once and for all that a MINI is soooooo much better!

that beig said, once again i'd LOVE to see more replies. Isaac needs to be smoked as much as possible on this subject!!!!!!!!!

-Paul

and P.S. could a MCS with better tires, a TurboKompressor, and rear sway kick an older M3? maybe even an '04???

 

It's been awhile since I owned a BMW, but I recall they are very well balanced cars. I am unfamiliar with the 330i's capabilities and I know it is not in the same league as the M3. But I was impressed by an article in Motoringfile by, I believe, the editor Gabe, on driving an M3. His first remarks were about sheer power, but he was also amazed by its handling. He was going to liken it to the MINI for cornering ability until he read the speedo and saw he was going through the same turns a lot faster. The M3 is capable of effortless and deceptive speed. I have sat in an M3 and noticed as a passenger that the MINI has more leg room. The 3 series BMW seems to have below dash padding that restricts my legs and feet that the MINI was clever or self-conscious enough to eliminate. Not quite to the point of this thread, but they are such different cars.

 

the problem is that I want to know about the OLD M3...not the '05 or the '06.
anyone? bump

 

[size=2]Good commentary in here! I currently own a 2001 325CI with sport pachage. It is approximately as fast as the stock MCS – so the 330 wins in a straight line.

Some things about the 330/325. Interior is superb. Nothing comes close IMO. MAX comfort, max utility, best layout of any car I have set foot into. Handling is awesome, transmission is smooth as butter. This is the car that makes me feel like a uber-pimp that has come far in life.

MINI had better handling, and with the SC pulley blew the doors off my 325, and will easily beat a 330. Modding the E46 is difficult to get power cheaply – you have intake, exhaust and software that get you minimal gains for the cost. I loved my mini for making drives to places the MOST fun possible.

Both cars are excellent – it is just a matter of what you want out of them!

[/size]

 

thanks for the input guys, keep 'em coming! the more smoke I can blow at Isaac about the 3-series--especially in the SNOW--the better. any reports on BMWs in the snow? (no, AWD doesn't count) I have personally seen many a BMW and Volvo going through hell (i.e. the speedo is at 60, the car is sliding backwards).

 

You can pick up an '05 JCW for $28k, add the JCW suspension for $1500. Still under $30k and for sure will for sure be faster than a 330i performance coupe in both straight line and around the track.

 

Already got one , but thanx anyway. No plan to go JCW, but after the warranty is gone, hello TurboKompressor!

 

You mean the E36 ('95-'99) M3? I drove JerseyGirl's M3 a few times before she sold it as well as driven her MCS. Hardly a day goes by when I don't look in that garage and miss that car... Part of me says I should have bought it from her, but it was simply not in the financial cards...

The E36 is not without it's problems, but M3 has that engine... that musical sounding, instantly responsive, deliciously torquey engine... which can make up for a lot of deficiencies in other areas... the quirky electrics... the chassis that seems to weaken as it ages (there's a whole industry based around "bracing" the E36)... the fact that one missed shift can cost you $$$$$$ (I think the phrase "money shift" was invented by these guys, although apparently reinforcing the tranny mount helps prevent this)...

As far as handling, I only drove the M3 once in a group of MINIs. Following behind tontobird on a curvy semi-run to Otto's some time ago. I basically left the car in 3rd gear and had no trouble keeping up. Of course, nobody was racing, but they were driving "spiritedly" and bear in mind I rarely drove the car.

Part of the M3's allure is how effortless it is to go fast... However, this can also get you into a heap of trouble as one small mistake can be catastrophic... search Bimmerforums for "wrecked my baby..." (or similar) and you will find a host of "former" E36 owners (mostly young and inexperienced). An easy car to drive fast, but not a forgiving one. The MINI, IMHO, is a more forgiving car.

There are a few non-performance areas where the M3 has the advantage to me. First and foremost is the seats. I could spend hours in the M3, whereas the MCS Sport seats make my back ache after about an hour of driving. The sunroof is another. You can open the sunroof in an E36 and still hold a normal conversation. After experiencing the sunroof in the MINI, it's an option I can do without.

There are certain things I really like about the MINI. The handling. The ease of modding. The community. The fact that it's electronics have had nearly 10 additional years to get sorted out... yeah, that's still sore spot with me and the E36... you people complain about MINI electrical quirks? HA! Go buy an E36... "Lucas engineers didn't retire in the '80's... they crossed the Channel and went to work for Bosch!"....

Stick a gun to my and tell me chose between them? I'd probably waffle back and forth so many times you'ld get frustrated and shoot me anyway...

 

My buddy has a circa 2001 model 330ci and I have an 05 MCSc. We haven't done much driving together but bone stock the 330 has more power but weighs more. He hasn't done any mods and last time I went out with him all I had was a CAI. We didn't race each other but we both were driving pretty hard and I think my Mini was keeping up with him. Now with my CAI, 15% Pulley and MTH I'm pretty sure I can take him and his 330ci cost him $10k+ more than my Mini. Also the 330 is an inline 6 whereas I have a supercharged 4 banger. Anyway IMO the 3 series BMWs are nice but for me if I had to spend cash on a 3 series BMW vs. a Mini I would only do it for a M3.

 

I have taken rides in the old E30's, only riden once in an E36 M3 coupe and have only driven the E46 325i and 325ix sedan/sport wagon. I have never set foot on the 330i or the M3 or convertibles.


The current 325i is a sweet driving car. Is not a MINI, but it is one of the most refined sub $30K 50/50 RWD cars in the market today. The standard 2.5L 189 HP in line six is buttery smooth, so I can't even begin to imagine how much faster the 330 and M3 version must be.

If MINI had not come to the USA, today I would probably be driving a 3 series, but to me the MINI has a premium feel and a fun driving demeanor that is very different from the 3 series driving experience.

Both great cars.

 

Actually, realistically it would be an E36 330ci or an E30 M3. Anyway, how is the throttle response in the Bimmer? so far, compared to the Subaru, the MINI's has been PATHETIC !

 

Hmm... The response in the E36 M3 was instant. I don't remember if that was drive-by-wire as well... I've heard the GIAC chip helps with that a lot in the MINI.

Btw, there was no E36 330ci. Earlier cars were 325i or 325is and later ones 328i and 328is. (technically, the '95 M3 had a 3.0L engine and therefore could be called a "330" but M3 owners would cry "foul!" )

I've heard the E30 M3 has a very similar "feel" to an MCS. However, to say an E30 M3 would not be a great daily-driver would be an understatement. More so than any other BMW before it or since, the E30 M3 was/is a high-strung performance car. While a few do use theirs as daily drivers, the cost of the maintenance required is prohibitive to most.

 

i think it is important to keep in mind that the 3 series are built with luxury in mind and not straight performance (though it is not far off). If I had lots of money to drop on a car I would probably get an M3 (but still hold on to my mini). I would drive both for very different reasons. However, tell me that there is a windy road trip in the future and i would take the mini anyday of the week. And unless I get my mini twin charged, I would always go with the M3 for the power, esp since it is RWD

 

the only problem is, we live in an area that gets a fair amount of snow. I have seen BMWs get into some deep $**t around here...

 

bump

 

With a good set of snow tires and traction control, a BMW can be driven in the snow without people pointing fingers and laughing at you. Alot depends on the driver as well. My first winter in my Cooper I was on the "performance runflats" and had no clue they were not meant for snow - the dealership was slightly misinformed as well...and being this was an '02, everyone was on a learning curve. The car was a bit scary in the snow that year. I have been MINI - less for the past year and now drive a 2000 BMW M Coupe (same engine as the final E36 M3 had) I drove that this winter in New Jersey with snows and ASC and got around okay....

I can say that the throttle response in this car is instant...and at times frightening. BUT - it is a different beast than an E36....

The MCS vs. M3 is not really an apples to apples comparison....the cars have different demographics and price points - but both get the respect of enthusiasts....

 

BMW's are excellent in the snow as long as you have 4-wheel dedicated snow tires for them. Their good balance and handling characteristics apply as much on slippery surfaces as on grippy ones. The traction control helps too, but you've still got to have some traction, or else no control! I've driven my E36 M3 through almost a decade of snowy winters, and other than issues of ground clearance (shared with the MCS) it's not a problem.

With regard to performance, an E36 M3 absolutely spanks a Cooper S at the track. This isn't an opinion: it's a report. Although the Mini has good initial acceleration, the power and superior aerodymamics of the BMW very soon take over. Remember that the Mini basically has the aerodynamics of a brick. A good looking brick, but a brick nonetheless. I've driven an E46 330i PP at the track and while it's certainly slower than the E36 M3 it's not that much slower.

However bear in mind that during track days you're not talking about performance to 60 mph, it's performance from 60 mph that counts. This is very different from street use, where much after that you get into "arrest me now officer" territory. In ordinary give-and-take road use, unless you have a secret test road in Nevada, I expect an MCS could keep up with a Ferrari, since it's more other factors which determine rate of progress.

Neil
05 MCS - Daily driver
96 M3 - Track car
525iT - Long distance comfort
77 MGB - Dinosaur

 

I sold my 2001 330CI (with 6 speed) for my 2004 MCS. On the grin scale I'd give the Bimmer a 6.5, the MCS a 9! On the other hand, the BMW is a much smoother car, and more comfortable. I'd prefer to take a freeway drive in the BMW -- sport seats are more comfortable and adjustable than the MINI's; cabin quieter, HK stereo much better than the HK in the MINI. However, contrary to what most auto writers have said, I find the stick in the MINI preferable to the 330CI's. However, the 3 liter six is an incredible mill. Smooth, constant torque from idle to redline. It always pulls strongly, much faster off the line than the stock MCS with none of the occasional driveabilitty issues like hic-cups, yo-yo, and low end bog that seems to plague our MINIs.
When it comes to six cylinder engines nobody beats BMW. But for just plain everyday driving, occasional AutoXing, etc. the MINI wins hands down.

 

2001 330i or CI did not come with 6 speed.