Give me a small,light,well handling car.
Give me as much horsepower as mechanically possible.
Give me smart styling.
Don't apologize for performance over comfort.
Make it sound as mean as it is(weather turbo or supercharged)
Compromise leads to mediocrity.
I hope the MINI of the future follows this credo.

 

Good, cause all I did was refer to my hair line receding

Mark

 

I hope you didn't think I meant that NAM veterans were sin free. I really was only referring to Lotsie who I have learned to respect. Always very well considered and respectful as proven by his recent post here.

I don't like any of the bashing either. SUV bashing, Japanese car bashing, and so on. A lot of bashing happens and I never like it and I never understand why one can't appreciate what they have without bashing others. People have different needs and wants and there is a massive variety of cars to meet the needs and wants of all of the individual tastes.

 

Not at all.

 

munch munch munch,....."want some popcorn?"


I was gonna attempt to unite "fellow motorists" but i would rather watch people babble.

dan

 

I agree with this and will add that I am not sure why by owning a MINI I need to love all things MINI.

Dean.

 

Respect is an earned thing, and I do try to consider things before I post them(it helps that I pick an poke type, and rely on smell checker a lot), but like everyone I do "fly off the handle, and shoot from the hip" sometimes.

When I was first asked by Mark Ferguson to be the Coordinator/Moderator of the Canada/Manitoba forums, I was honored to be able to help with a site that brought the MINI community to me in the rather remote, back water area I lived in at the time. For the most part the only MINI I saw were pictures I took of mine Google Sandy Hook, Manitoba, it's WAY up there

I still enjoy my roll here on NAM, helping new members learn the ropes, answering members tech questions, mostly cold weather ones, again check out were I'm from,
or anything the site needs that I can offer input.

Now when threads/posts show division of the community that means so much to me come up, I tend to hover/lurk/watch them. I try to let my blood return to a simmer after a rolling boil before I post to them if I find something upsetting, but not always, and I apologize for that.

Sorry for the long post, I'm known for being rather pithy in my posting style, but some things just need to be said.

Mark

 

Right. it's the crappy components (PS anyone) that surround the rock solid engine.

 

[quote=checkercoop;2034135]Well I know a few people on this forum that will respond:

"Its because the R56 is watered down and ONLY for the masses...NO 'enthusiast' is in ANYWAY geared toward the R56...BMW just wants the masses now...oh yeah and we need no technology just give me a crate to sit on, a handheld radio to listen to, and a little fan for my face"


Personally I feel BMW is doing a great job and kudos to them for constantly trying to make the MINI different and definitely a round of applause for going for a better (yes I said better) motor


Surfblue says: Right on, Checkercoop! This whole concept of "the masses" vs "enthusiast" is sort of silly, really. What ultimately makes a car/cycle/you name it an enthusiast's car is the person working on it and driving it. The vehicle for all this is just that...a piece of equipment. Let me go off the Mini and give an example from my life history. Back in the early 60's, when the Cotati Drag Strip was still in operation, I had a friend named John, age 18 same as me, and his mother drove a very plain low ranking model of a 57 Ford four door station wagon, green and white, with a small Ford V-8 and a three speed column shift box. John decided he was going to drag race his mother's Ford. Being young guys, we all gave him the needle about this. Well, a drag race Sunday rolled around, and John had personally tuned up Mom's wagon in auto shop the week before. He showed up at the strip, pulled the hubcaps, took out the spare tire and some other stuff, and proceed to register to run in, I think it was, D Stock or E stock. Imagine the looks on our collective faces when John proceeded to beat a whole line of competitors and win a FIRST with his mom's Ford. And he came back to do it at least one more time! I can see him now, strutting around the pit area with that trophy cupped in his right hand, it's top up near his elbow, grinning. It was a great day, and we all laughed and congratulated him on his victory. We all felt great about it, just like he did. He was one of us...a car nut.
I say that makes that 57 Ford wagon an ENTHUSIAST'S CAR. Point: It's not the CAR that makes it an "enthusiast's car", it's the person working on it and driving it. It's a mindset.
And for the record, I'm a guy that likes all Minis. From the old 62 Cooper I once owned to this R56, they're all fine by me. But it's the DRIVER that decides if it's just a commute vehicle or a race winner. And either way, any Mini is far more fun to drive than (insert your own number of PERCENTAGE % here) of the cars on the road! It sure ain't a 57 Ford!
And IF these so called MASSES (whatever that is) buy Minis, all owners should be thankful. Without continuing improved sales, there won't be a Mini for long.
Let's be uniters rather than dividers. How about it?

 

[quote=surfblue;2037182]Well said Im buying a 57 Ford Wagon.

**2003 mini cooper s for sale*** Make an offer**

 

[quote=MiniStupidfun;2037240] Surfblue says: Great post! But keep the Mini! Keep the Mini!

 

[quote=MiniStupidfun;2037240]I had a 59 Ford sedan, now that was cruising

Mark

 

I prefer a '62 Lincoln Continental 4 door convertible. That thing had style and was monster sized! Got to love that huge power top.



Not bad looking for it being 46 years old.

 

2003 MINI cooper S sold!

My new hotwhip!

 

baller!

 

Think Jan will tune it for me??

 

My observation and bone of contention with the r56 versus the r50-53 models is in the interior, to be exact the cockpit dash. the Pizza pie sized speedo and the tonka toy plastic controls between the a pillars just look cheap. The large speedo with the radio makes me wonder what one does if they want the fix or change the radio out. any ideas on that.

 

The interior dash on R56 is actually quite nice when you drive one every day...the switches are where you want them and, contrary to what pictures may show, feel great and have a good amount of heft. I find the silver-on black-scheme useful during driving for easier spotting of controls clusters via peripheral vision. The vertical controls for heat/AC are space-savers...the whole arangement offers a great deal of additional leg room. All in all, it's far better than we'd been led to expect initially, and to really appreciate what's been done one has to spend some time behind the wheel. I honestly think they did a good job on it and there is far more function over form than meets the eye. The speedo is larger, but I suspect a main reason for this was the new nav system which fills the entire screen. In any case, that "radio" isn't just the radio any more, so we really have to forget that notion. There is a lot of OBC and bluetooth display and controls stuff also happening there and it is really quite handy for daily driving. Remember, there is a display in the first gen speedo, too...this one expands on that. If I were into replacing audio components, though, you're right...I don't know where I'd start. I use the single audio control know to turn the unit on...that's about all. Everything else I use the MFSW for. Anyway, everything is pretty well integrated, which I think is great for daily driving in that everything is pretty much right at hand.

The point is that, while everybody has their preferences, it seems driving experience is showing both cars offer real-world benefits and so I think there's less to talk about concerning which is better or worse.

If I were to identify a single difference between first and second gen cars it's be in the suspension setup and handling. They are very different cars in their OEM configuration, but again, one can dial either in to suit. Both will appeal to enthusiasts, too...but for different reasons, I think we're just going to have to come to grips with that. R56 did some great things to the setup for the folks who use them as daily drivers (in response to customer concerns) but the enthusiast will probably still like the R50/53 setup or go to the other tuned suspensions available for R56. Should be no problem.

I will say...and this is in response to the OPs reference to MCs.....the Cooper got a big improvement in almost every regard with R56. Engine, tranny, appearance, interior finishes...everything. Now...how do you say that and still say the first gen Ccooper is still highly desirable? Because it is. Again, there's something very Mini about the first gen MINI, even though it feels like a frantic roller coaster ride when I get back in my R50 from driving my R56...it's still a blast. I do also have a soft spot for those cheeky little bumper strips...although they served no real function. A great car....I'd still proudly drive it if my daughter hadn't taken it.

 

This thread has really gotten me to thinking ...and you know what ...I'm not at all sure I am an enthusiast. Sure, I love my R53, but would not buy an R56 and while I really like the original MINIs, they are too impractical for me and I'm not mechanically inclined, which I think most owners of original MINIS probably are.

I've not yet read the manual on my MINI, as it didn't seem necessary. Everything appeared self explanatory and with MINI taking care of all the service for the first 50K, I just never felt compelled to read it. I know how to check fluids and all of the controls work pretty much like you would expect them to. Nothing needed explaining.

I will never do any performance mods to my MINI, auto cross it or track it and am unlikely to attend any MINI gatherings. I participate here because it is fun and fits in with my schedule ...since my livelihood has me in front of a computer nearly 14 hours a day.

I do have great pride of ownership, take very good care of my MINI and take pictures of it to share with you folks. Does that make me an enthusiast ...or just a guy having some fun?

So, why did I buy a MINI? Because its wicked cool and way different than all of the Honda's I've been driving for the last 20 years. Because it reminds me of my first car ...a'66 MGB. Because it's very good for my mid-life crisis.

I love how fast it is, I love the way it handles, I love the way it pulls so well once you get it over 3K rpm in 3rd gear, I love feeling so connected to the road, I like the burble ...but most of all, I'm crazy about the way it looks.

But not the R56. I know it is said by many they are hard to tell apart ...I can tell them apart from 50 yards, from the front, side or rear and would bet most of you can too. To me, they are very different. The inside is not to my liking either and when I drove them they evoked little emotion ...the ride was smoother and quieter than what I was looking for. Please don't tell me I am wrong or I am crazy ...I am entitled to this opinion and am not bashing. Face it, the cars are different.

An enthusiast? I just don't know, especially if part of being an enthusiast is embracing the evolution of a car that is headed in a direction that does not suit me. If the successor to the R56 is even less R53-like (and it no doubt will be), well, this will probably be my last MINI ...unless I can find a low mileage '06 once I wear mine out, or if my attitude changes.

Yes, I do the wave and consider myself part of the cult. I drive in a spirited manner whenever I think its safe to do so and enjoy chatting with other MINI owners when I see them in parking lots ...most of whom look at me like I'm nuts because to them its just a car.

An enthusiast? Sure, I am enthusiastic about owning my R53 ...but is there more to it than that? And where is the shame in being called a non-enthusiast or having it said you drive a non-enthusiasts car?

What got me to thinking about all of this was folks negative reaction to the R56 being called a non-enthusiasts car. For all I care, the R53 could be considered a non-enthusiasts car. What difference does it make? Why does everyone care what others think? Why are folks so insulted when they read that someone else doesn't like their car? Is everyone that hangs around a car forum and talks about cars an enthusiast?

I'm just a guy that really, really likes his car. I'm happy for the folks that have an R56 and love it and even happier for the folks that had an R53, now have an R56 and like it better ...because that's what its all about ...owning a car that suits you well and makes you happy.

Opinions be damned ...and neither of these cars is better than the other as a matter of fact.

Dean.

 

Good post. Sometimes the label of "enthusiast" is connected to people who enjoy a more "sporting" car, which then leads us down the slippery slope of what's a "sports car" and what isn't.

I think some of the angst we R53 enthusiasts feel about the R56 (when driving it) is that it doesn't quite hit the sporting side of our enthusiasm. No doubt, though, that one can be extremely enthusaistic about what the R56 does do well. Are R56 fans enthusiasts? Sure. But we've used the term in this thread generally, and I think we've used it to connote a sporting nature or sportiness.

The sports car argument has been had, too. My take is that the Mini is athletic, like me, but not a sports car, like Ahmad Bradshaw.

mb

 

That is a slippery slope, isn't it. I'm sure my definition of a sports car would be far too broad for most enthusiasts.

I like the label of athletic. That works for me.

Dean.

 

The whole sports car thing is a slippery slope, one that normally crashes at the bottom of the hill. So for the sake of the direction this thread seems to now be taking, for the better IMO, lets let it end now and move on.

Mark

 

Agreed I can't ignore, though, the connection (in this thread) between the term "enthusiast" and the unspoken term "sports car". I wonder if under everything this is the sports car debate, just on a different front.

Anyhoozle, back to your regularly scheduled thread...

mb

 

Here is my last word on "enthusiast". Here is a pic of my other "enthusiast" vehicle; my '72 VW Bus with an air cooled 68 hp engine that does 0 to 60 in 31.5 seconds:

 

My daughter has one of those, yours is a rocket in comparison to hers

Mark