For the umpteenth time - that problem is NOT a DSC problem, it it an ASC+T problem.

Sheesh - I wish people would get their technology right when they try to bash it.

 

Are you trying to insult me Scottie old friend??

 

Yep he's bashing the wrong nanny. But since that ASC nanny lives in the same bundle of wires as the beloved DSC nanny what's a guy to do? Me I only have ASC nanny & she's dead.

 

.....And I really don't have to try to hard, you make it soooooo easy.

 

You're hurting my feelings.

 

Seriously Scottie and Crashton, I respect you both, and think you both are too mature for this constant bantering on this thread. I think everyone gets that you disagree with each other. Crashton, you don't like the ASC/DSC, Scottie, you do. I would recommend leaving the snide swings back and forth to PM. It just ain't what this should be all about. This is a forum for discussion, not discourse. It just adds nothing to a real discussion on the pros/cons of each system.

 

Edit: I'll be a man and take my reply to PM's!

 

Amen! learn proper acronyms damnit!! there's no other way you'll be able to understand Edge's signature if you don't!

 

^^

 

that most posts in this never ending debate fall into the "pointless" camp. Sorry, but almost all of them are anecdotal at best, subjective opinion at worst and I can count the number of times that actual statistics have been used on the fingers of quadraplegics! Almost every conversation of the pros/cons of the systems talk right past the others claims and complaints and really sound like broken records.

I guess I've just been reading these DSC sucks/doesn't suck debates for too long.... What I really suggest many do is to do some reading on system efficacy and long time stats on accident reduction, then one would have a better basis to actually judge if the benefits provided are worth the shortcomings in the Minis systems software...

Me, I've all but given up on writing about the benefits of the system, and how to get the benefits while minimizing the shortcomings. If one wants a really massocistic excersize, one can use the seach system on NAM to find the information...

Here's an idea for Crashton and Scotty, try to not post a single comment in a DSC thread for over a month or two..... Not that the comments have no value, but both of you have made your points abundantly clear.... But then again, have at it if you want to. Who am I to judge?

Matt

 

But Matt......someone has to offer the truth.

 

On and MCS with DSC, toggle the switch labeled DSC (no matter what it actually controls)--enabling the indicator light--prior to making a turn from a stop onto a busy road. Toggle the switch again, disabling the indicator light, after you are through the turn. Otherwise you could end up having lurched out into traffic with the engine dropping down to idle while you have the accelerator floored and a bus coming at you. I can replicate this behavior, minus the bus, at will. I am amazed that no one has been killed by it yet.

 

I remember reading a couple of years ago about how if you held the toggle down for 10 or 15 seconds it would put the system into half mode or something, where the traction control part is not on. Anyone else remember this? Kind of forgot all about it until I started reading this thread. Probably BS since I never heard anymore about it. I turn mine on & off depending on what I'm doing, if I'm out in the dry and interested in accelerating as fast as I can, or carving up a familiar stretch of twisty back road where I want to slide a little bit I turn it off, other than that I leave it on.

 

quick question, when the yellow indicator on the speedo is lit, does that mean DSC is turned off? thanks

 

Allegedly.

 

Light on, DSC off

And the question about the part-time mode.......not true. Several of us have debunked that one.

 

This is good advice, but you could just adapt and learn to modulate the throttle so you don't spin the tires also. Traction control won't engage until the tires start spinning.

 

Yes one can modulate the throttle, but sometimes one can be caught out by just a bit of sand, gravel, salt or wet pavement in the intersection. It really doesn't take much to induce enough slip to trigger the ACS. Hopefully not when a bus is coming.

Amen

 

You neglected to mention the reported post too.

You may have noticed that I have already edited my post (and the quotes) to tone it down. I apologize for coming on a bit strong, and I'll respond to your PM shortly. As it stands now, I've been offline since ~12pm EST because of a critical network outage at the office - the entire datacenter has been without power, which also meant no Internet access. I just came home for a short rest before going back in to bring things back up and test after the electricians get the power restored (which means running 400 ft of new cable from the garage under the building up to the server room)... but I digress...

(I guess I said all that because I was in the middle of responding to this thread earlier today, and to your PM... when all hell broke loose at work. I was not ignoring the issue.)

As for my initial reaction to your post, for a long time now I have been fighting misinformation about DSC, what it does, and what it doesn't. It's important to understand the distinction, because although ASC+T is very annoying at times, it is something that every new MINI gets now anyway (since 2nd Gen), and every MCS has always gotten, standard.

Those annoying features are therefore impossible to avoid, short of turning it off manually (or using an aftermarket circuit to do it for you). However, DSC adds additional features on top of ASC+T that are not intrusive and are very life-saving in unexpected situations. So much so that the government has mandated that all new vehicles must have the technology (in one form or another - it has different names, all falling under the general name of "Electronic Stability Control") by the year 2012. See this link.

So you see, what I'm fighting against is people who say (or suggest) "don't get DSC, it's dangerous"... because it's NOT. Telling people so is doing them a huge disservice, IMO, because you're talking them out of what I (and many experts) consider to be a very important safety feature. Sure, there are a few stubborn detractors out there, but those are the same type of stubborn people who railed against seatbelts, anti-lock brakes and airbags.

The problematic features are the underlying ASC+T technology that you can't avoid having installed on your MINI anyway - and even then, only when you cause wheelspin due to accelerating too hard. Don't get me wrong, I turn it off on occasion, such as the "turn through intersection" moves as mentioned by others. Then I turn it back on after the turn, just as mcs22004 suggested. Of course, going easier on the throttle is another way, but it's hard to have that self-control sometimes.

In an ideal world, we'd be able to have DSC, disable the underlying ASC+T functions but leave the DSC-specific functions on. Unfortunately that isn't an option made available in MINIs. HAHA good one Dan. It isn't just about proper acronyms though, it's about being accurate about the correct technology.

I hate it when good technology is slammed for the wrong reasons. Same goes for good people. I believe that only works on BMWs, if at all, not MINIs.Yep. A shame too.

 

someone tripped over the powercord of your datacenter?? we had someone do that...shorted a battery stack with a wrench during business hours. Luckily, he lived to get fired.

 

Worse. One of the main phase cables that supplies 200A of power to the server room basically fried up. That's why they're running 400ft of brand new power cable up 5 floors tonight.

There were some good (and freaky... since it's obvious this could easily have become an electrical fire) pictures of the damage taken today - I'll be sure to post one once I get ahold of it.

 

You would do better to "adapt and learn" never to be on sand, gravel, or ice at a stop.

Though it could not be more obvious, I did not state that I always spin the tires when stopped at intersections and do so on dry pavement; I stated that I can reproduce the behavior whereby the system cripples the car immediately after getting it rolling, thus endangering the occupants.

 

As can I. I never said I didn't think there were ever good reasons to disable the system(s) - there certainly are, and I disable them sometimes too. I am only concerned about people reading this and thinking that DSC has no value. Absolutely not true. In fact, DSC adds value to a problematic ASC+T system.

However, I also believe that ASC+T has value too, in some situations - most notably gentle hill climbs in icy conditions, where appropriate throttle control is much more difficult.

 

Now many of you won't need to think about this but with my DSC on it robs power in really deep snow. When trying plow through the deep stuff it just cuts the power when you need it most to keep momentum going. If you try and corner in the deep snow it really fouls thing up and you will end up stuck. Once I turned it off.... no problem. Even with the snow rubbing the uncercarriage this baby just kept plowing through it.

 

Sounds like the solution for you might be a little patience. Wait for the hypothetical bus to go by so you don't have to gun it to make it safely out into the road.

I make 90 degree turns all the time and the only time I get the "DSC" light to come on is if the road is wet or I'm intentionally trying to accelerate like someone compensating for something small.