Amp is shot, what options do i have if i don't want to replace the amp? can i install a non hk mini system? will i have to replace everything, speakers etc.

 

It all depends on how much you want to spend and how much work you want to do.

First, look around in the marketplace, there may be some people who want to sell their amp for pretty cheap. Usually from people who redid their whole system.

Second, the speakers currently mounted are all 2ohm speakers, so any amp or HU you get will have to be properly powered to accommodate for that, unless you want to replace the speakers.

Third. Currently all speaker wires lead to the boot where the H/K amp was. This means that to install a new HU, you are going to need to re-wire your car so that the speakers lead to the front.

Unless, of course, you want to run a pre-out for both the high/mids and lows from a new HU to a couple of amps in the boot, then you're golden. (of course, you'd have to buy a new HU which handles that).

I would think that finding a used H/K amp would be the cheapest and easiest route to take.

But that is just my 5/8 cent.

Sorry to hear your amp took a poop.

 

I'm an audio neophyte (so if I say anything stupid here, just ignore me ), but given that the wires lead to the boot and assumeably wires then run from the boot to the speaker locations, couldn't one just wire jumpers in to amp connector(s) any bypass the amp? Even if you had to replace the speakers, at least that would save some rewiring...

 

In the H/K system, no.

The signal that runs from the current HU to the H/K location is a digital signal. The wires that run from the H/K amp location to the wires are the speaker level / analog signals.

 

One more important factor is that the H/K amp does the crossover filtering.

So:
If you remove the H/K amp, you really need to replace the speakers with new ones that include crossovers.
You could jumper the front speaker feed from HU which goes to H/K amp position, and use that to drive the replacement 4ohm door speakers which would now have their own crossovers.
Or you could install an amp in the rear position to drive new door speakers; it could also drive the rear speakers without replacing them so long as the amp has a low pass filter option for two of it's four channels (which many do).
Most easily, feed the new amp with the speaker levels already run to the H/K amp position - ensure the amp has speaker level inputs.

One other thing: the rear H/K speakers are dual voice coil, so each speaker is actually 2 x 2 ohm coils. You could simply drive one coil (less power to the speaker), or you need an amp that can drive 1 ohm (not common), or you should wire the coils in series to give 4 ohms (and then you want enough amp power to drive 4 ohms with enough volume).


I could go on much more - it all depends what you're prepared to do and how much money you want to spend.
Someone needs to open one of these broken H/K amps and figure how to repair it!

 

Pardon from the OP if this a hijack, but given that the HU is the same for either system, does that mean that our regular OEM speakers have crossovers, or is there some sort of pre-amp in line to the HK amp?
TIA for the education.

 

The regular speakers have a sort of crossover - the main lower door unit gets all frequencies and simply can't respond to the higher frequencies; it's wasted energy into the speaker coil but doesn't much distort sound.
The upper door speaker is a tiny tweeter, and it has a small capacitor in series with it to prevent it getting the lower frequencies (which would harm the coil).
Hardly a high precision crossover / system, and more distortion / muffling than with proper filters, but cheap!


The H/K amp gets full range speaker signals from HU, converts them internally to digital data and "software filters" to get the different frequencies - then sends appropriate frequencies to the electronics which drives the separate speakers; so the mid/tweeter pair in the door doesn't get sent any low frequencies and the lower speaker doesn't get any high stuff. This gives the possibility of much more precise crossover filtering. Note that there's still a capacitor, to split the mid and tweeter feeds - some inaccuracy there on the H/K system, but less critical since the mid / tweeter speakers will have some ability to handle the same mid-high frequencies, and are in physically the same location (so no sound imaging problems).

 

---------Edited for ****-poor research which led to misleading information.-----------

 

So then couldn't the OP get a set of OEM speakers, and do a jumper at the amp connector to 'forward' those unadjusted signals to the speakers?
Or is there something else that involves the rear speakers?

Just trying to 1) understand a bit more, and 2) find an alternative solution for those increasing # of owners who experience dead HK amps.

 

This is misleading - or not true! Sorry.
The only digital messages from HU to amp are the settings of volume/tone/etc. The actual audio is sent from the speaker amplifier circuits in the HU, in analog format, and digitized at the H/K amp inputs.

 

Yes.
As I wrote in an earlier reply

 

Crap. When I'm wrong. I'll admit it. I didn't research enough and believed one source that told me the source was digital.

The digital signal processor in the H/K does, in fact, take the analog signal from the HU, convert it to digital, alter the signal as necessary, then convert it back to analog.

Ian, once again you reign in audio knowledge.

Thanks for setting me straight.

Sorry to everyone else for the misleading information.

 

Alright, this has been bothering me all night. (ok... that's a lie... only the times I was conscious.)

I could understand if there was some sort of pre-out situation coming from the HU to the H/K, but why would the HU send an amplified signal to the amp. That's just a lot of wasted power (and a lot for the H/K to handle), since the signal gets converted to digital and any notion of audio power gets lost.

I agree that the signal the amp gets is analog, but is there some sort of switching mechanism that converts the line to low power instead of sending the full amplified signal?

 

Lots of replies, looks like I'm SOL though. I have looked for a used Amp, this must be a common problem because they get snatched up pretty quickly.

 

Be patient if you can - they come up on ebay and here regularly, if not frequently. You might also try auto wreckers.

 

Does anyone know the part number for the H/K Amp?

 

Looks like 65126959010

Interesting that there is a new PN - it was changed in 09/04

 

Actually, you might be surprised that the HU increases it's output when driving the H/K amp!
When the H/K is connected, the HU amp outputs run at a fixed high level that gives about 4V audio levels. The primary reason for this I think is that the low impedance signal is much less likely to pick up interference from the other electronics in the car. I know from personal experience that line-out levels can pick up some noise

The power "waste" is not as bad as you might be thinking - I don't know what the input impedance is to the H/K amp, but it certainly won't be 4ohms like a speaker. It could easily be 1000ohms or higher which due to power squaring would reduce the HU output load by a factor of thousands!

 

Thanks for all the help everyone, I found one on e-bay for $120.

 

Excellent! That's a good find.

 

I have some questions/concerns...1) how does one know if their hk amp is 'shot'?
2) my speakers provide good sound at moderate levels- but when turned up the sound quickly deteriorates- is this speaker problem or amp problem?
3) i went to circuit city tonight and the guy in the install department said i need to replace my speakers ( 6x9 in rear and 6" or 6.5" in front-can't recall exactly ) and amp the speaker replacements would be polk-----i could have it all installed for about $450.....is polk better than hk????

05 cabrio has 20k miles ---any thoughts from this BRIGHT group would be appreciated!...thx michael

 

Do not replace the H/K speakers with non-factory speakers unless you really know exactly what you're doing!
The factory speakers are tailored to match the H/K amp (for example 2 ohm impedance) and the amp does the crossover filtering - any aftermarket speaker set would have it's own crossovers which would not be compatible with the H/K install.


Most H/K amp faults have shown themselves at all volume levels; a problem that occurs only at higher volumes could be an amp issue, but could also be a speaker issue.
Since your car is in warranty, you should simply get the dealership to sort the issue!

 

I just wanted to add that if you are really particular about your sound, you might also find that if you are running an iPod through your head unit that your sound tends to seem more "distorted" as well compared to CD's, but that's a whole other situation with mp3/aac etc...

I looked around for this previously and couldn't find something more specific, but I was looking at shankrabbit's install, where did you pick up your line-level input, from the headunit or from the amp in the back? I was going to add similar set-up (12" with amp in back, would like to avoid wiring from head unit which is stock HK) especially since I love the rear-mounted battery, so much easier than my last few cars if you ran it off the HK amp, is there a diagram of outputs to tap into? Feel free to point me to a prior post, I apologize if this is repetitive.

---EDIT---
Please allow me to direct myself to your website, with a nice photo-install I like it, I knew it could be done! Thanks for posting that.