I just installed a Meth/Water Injection System (thread is below) and have been thinking about window washer fluid. Now, I have read numerous posts all over the web about the pros and cons of this, BUT, I have never seen anybody discuss trying to use a simple water filtration system to filter out minerals and other hard water contaminants.

I already have a simple 110 volt water pump similar to what is in a RV. If I bought a cheap, less than $15.00 faucet mounted filter system I could pump the washer fluid (yes it has to be at least minus 20 mix with no glycol) through the filter and get some pretty "clean" solution. I can buy a 5-gallon can of methanol from the local race shop for $35 but then what do i do with the can for the several years that it may take for me to use the stuff as I am using MI for cooling not for tuning? I could also fabricate a gravity fed system using the same type of filter attachment. Winter mix fluid is like $2.00 or less a jug and it is normally about a 30% meth/70% water mix. I saw a $12.00 water filter with a 0.1 um rating that is pretty darn small.

https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...and-boost.html

 

Just a hint...water does not burn.
Water takes up "space" where gas , air and methanol COULD be.
Alcohol cools MUCH better than water.
Alcohol cleans the chambers better than water.
See #1, alcohol makes power, water does not.
No reason for water...except that it's a little cheaper..!

In any case, you WILL get some water. Alcohol soaks up moisture like brake fluid does, so you have some amount of water no matter what. Best all around to limit though, in my opinion. I ran it in a small car many years back. I went from 50% / 50%, to 75% to 100% methanol in short order. A difference could be felt, even in the little carbureted engine that I ran it in.

Mike

 

Somewhere there is an article by some race guys on meth and it says something like water does not work well with a carbed engine.

With 5 gallons of meth i could mix up a total of 14.25 gallons of a 35% meth mixture. At the rate I use it either my wife buys a bigger coffin or shes uses whats left to incinerate me when I die.

 

 

I am talking anywhere from a 5 to a 0.2 micron filter and if there are those that do not know what that means then think 7.874e-6 inches. That is like 40 times SMALLER than a human hair.

 

Really doesn't matter how it's going into the combustion chamber..!

See again, naturally aspirated, belt driven super charger, or gas driven supercharger. Once the mixture is in the manifold and entering the combustion chamber, water is NOT a good thing. Been there done that, in my many years of drag racing American cars/engines.

Your engine, your time, but... It's a matter of simple high school physics, water does not burn...why inject a chemical that does NO good for combustion..?! Makes no sense.

Again -
Just a hint...water does not burn.
Water takes up "space" where gas , air and methanol COULD be.
Alcohol cools MUCH better than water.
Alcohol cleans the chambers better than water.
See #1, alcohol makes power, water does not.
No reason for water...except that it's a little cheaper..!

Mike

 

Why water, well as my tank is inside my car I choose not to have a very flammable mixture inside the vehicle with me. There is also numerous studies and articles on how water cools the fuel mixture.

The purpose of this thread is do review whether filtration of a cheap water/meth fluid, that being winter mix windshield washer, is possible.

 

The topic of windshield washing fluid is interesting. There are several high end solutions that utilize deionized water. I managed pharmaceutical projects back in the day so I was around different "types" of water. They had different levels of purification and in fact if you spilled some of the "top shelf" stuff you had to fill in environmental forms as the stuff was a tracked like a major pollutant. It would be logical to think that calcium and other hard water contaminants have been removed in those products during the deionizing process.

A possible issue is that these products also have trace amounts of glycol and a hydrophobic silicone polymer. From what I have read, glycol will thicken oil and in large amounts create a mayonnaise type goo when combined with engine oil. There is also data out there on the oil dilution affect of methanol. Will the thickening affect of the glycol be offset by the dilution affect of the methanol, and, what is the affect of a hydrophobic silicone polymer on the entire engine combustion process? I know that Porsche used Alusil in some of their engines that is a combination of aluminum and silicone. There is also a Nikasil product that is nickle and silicone.

A Safety Data Sheet (SDS), or in years past a Material Safety Data Sheet (MSDS), is a government required document that listed the properties and makeup of any product. This ranged from steel to latex paint. Anybody can obtain a copy of the SDS/MSDS sheet for any given windshield washer solution to determine what the product is made of.

So where is all the data on pumps clogging up and the detrimental affects of window washing fluid when used for engine injection purposes?

 

*water cools and creates steam pressure..
*alcohol cools..

As for your mix/sauce of choice: use pure methanol as it does not contain anything else that could congeal and start to clog your pump/nozzle. Meth systems are good when they are healthy and work.. keep it working longer by using pure meth. For mixing - adding small % of water can keep the mix from evaping as quickly ..which gives an opportunity to remove more latent heat. No question the octane of the meth will get into the combustion, but without water; your meth/mix charge could fully evap before it hits the combustion chamber.. Its my understanding this results in less power and less latent hear removed from the cycle.

 

This thread is not for those that are using 100% or tuning for meth but rather cannot find meth for $5.30 a gallon as I can. Usually the nozzle screens are around 80 microns and the filters are around 40 microns. If you prefiltered the winter mix (no detergent and no glycol) with a 5 micron filter you would have around a 30% mix of meth (by weight) with allot of the minerals removed from the water. The vacuum/boost of the engine may also have a positive affect on the nozzle not developing scale that leads to blockage.

Below is a chart I made up that provides costs of different mix options. A 5 micron garden hose filter is around $15 and with some misc. fittings, a "funnel filter" could be made pretty easy. If I could not find methanol race fuel in my area I would use a filter and create a more purified washer solution to use. In the chart I tried to round things off based upon some "shopping". The costs are not exact but you should be able to get a good idea what is involved.

 

 

It all comes down to personal preference.

This thread, like my threads on Big Brakes and Methanol Injection, is an effort to determine whether there are less expensive means to accomplish a particular "want." I had two Corvettes the last being a LS3 so I know what it feels like to drive a pretty fast street car. Also had two AP1 s2000's and there is not much better than hearing a car engine rev 9,000 rpms. I thought that using methanol injection to mitigate higher manifold temperatures caused by smaller supercharger pulley ratios might work. As I have the smaller ratio, 19%, along with meth injection and have done some data logging, I can say that the numbers prove me correct. Could I gain additional HP from going 100% even without a tune, probably yes, but at this time I do not see the need to do such.

My car has been tweaked so that it handles better, goes faster, has better brakes and pulls harder than any stock Gen1 MINI. Would think it is at least par with any stock Gen2 and possibly better in some of the above aspects.