Does anyone have an opinion on this?

 

Its your money spend it how ever you choose

 

Neither. Just save you money and get a real sports car.


Paul

 

I always say aftermarket, because you can get just as fast or faster in half the price than the JCW kit. But many people are scared about their warranty so they do nothing since they cannot spend the big bucks for the JCW kit. And in the end they wonder why they waited. It’s a personal choice you have to make. If your car runs fine after 2000 miles I say do it and don't look back! Good Luck!

 

It does depend on how you want to spend your money and keep your warranty. Aftermarket parts do get you the same or sometimes better numbers then the JCW. The couple of dyno runs I've seen ( One was a Webb Motorsports kit. I think it was posted on the NAM site, but I don't remember the thread.)seem to indicate aftermarket power comes in strong at about 5000 RPM. Before that the JCW has the same or better numbers. To me this shows that the JCW has its' power spread throughout the RPM range (smoother?) and aftermarket puts its' power into the high RPM area. Again your money your preference.

 

JCW.

It gets installed by a genuine MINI dealer, comes with badges, and can be financed as part of a new car purchase. Brilliant!

 

Love those ads!
Cheers.

 

The JCW kit will probably depreciate like any factory approved dealer-installed option, so if you sell the car, part of the JCW price will be returned to you. For non-factory peformance parts you are unlikely to get any return, and they may even subtract from your resale value.

 

There are a number of ways to get to the island of manhattan, you have to find out which one is best for you why don't you just wait until mini comes out with a world ralley championship car with an honest 265 hp all wheel drive model.

 

Badges? BADGES???

We don't need no stinking BADGES!!!

 

The question I always pose to potential aftermarketeers pondering JCW vs. aftermarket Tuner:

"Will the cost of the aftermarket Tuner's 200HP package plus whatever power-induced powertrain repair in the first 50k miles of the car meet or exceed the cost of the JCW?"

I have yet to see any MINI, including heavily modded cars, need any serious powertrain work (newbies with blown clutches don't count, sorry) that could possibly offset the cost delta between aftermarket and JCW. If resale is your concern, keep in mind that an enthusiast in the know will never pay a premium for JCW on a car he will mod with aftermarket parts anyway.

Let's rephrase: "If there was no warranty, would you JCW or aftermarket". Yes, of course you would aftermarket, there's no way you'd spend another $4k on a badge....right?

 

You miss the biggest part for those of us without deep pockets----YOU CAN FINANCE THE JCW.

pAUL

 

I agree. Keep that $4k as a self insured "warranty" fund. Then after you hit 50k miles if you feel you "need" to spend it on the car. Go for it

 

VISA

 

Your joking right?

Use visa and pay it off in 3 years--you totally lost you $$$ savings.


Paul

 

He's pointing out that financing the JCW is only making it even more expensive, by tacking on an APR.

 

Agreed but not by the credit card rate but the new car loan rate. Also I am pointing out that if you went aftermarket with your discover card and took as long as I will to pay my car your savings wouldn't be the same. Probably evaporate.

Of course when I use my mont blanc fountain pen, or nakimichi I always get those Bic/Pilot/Space Pen guys telling me how much less their pen cost and it does the same thing.

Paul

 

Your pen comparison, I think is valid. I just picked up my '05 JCW (210hp) yesterday from Classic Mini. My previous car was a typical modded '03 MCS. The difference in my opinion is quite noticeable. Some of it is due to the gear ratio as well. My '03 felt more raw, but the '05 feels much smoother, more refined, and much more like a factory car. I haven't quite broken it in yet, so I haven't pushed it. But it already feels quicker than my '03 even keeping it under 4000 rpm. You do save money going aftermarket, no doubt about it, and you may get similiar hp numbers, but in my opinion the cars feel night and day. What is the price for that? I don't know. But in my opinion for my scenario it was money well spent. A lot of people say you can get the same power for $400. But in reality the average modder is paying probably in the $2000 to $3000 range for performance parts (i.e. exhaust, pulley, intake, header, and chip). This is not so far off from the $4650 I paid for my kit. Regardless of what dynos are shown here the car feels more responsive and more "integrated" than any modded MCS I have been in, and it feels quicker than most. There are some people with real screamers that blow the door of the JCW, but they spend a lot more money than I can spend. I think the features of the 210hp kit will be much more evident once I break it in and can take up to 6500rpm+.

So I think the stereo and pen comparison is really proper. It is like comparing a Bic, which can still write, last you a long time, and you can buy 30 of them for a fraction of the cost of the Mont Blonc. But that doesn't stop from making the Mont Blonc a really nice pen, that in some people's mind is worth the extra money. You cannot just compare the costs of the two paths. Just like Ryephile said you can buy a whole engine with the money you saved. The JCW is quite like a lot of factory tuned cars. The factory kits are almost always quite a bit more than the same power aftermarket. Compare the M3, and Turner Motorsports 330 power kit. Same can be said for AMG and a host of others. Does that mean the M3 is a waste of money and you are stupid for buying one? No, they are just two different designs and visions.

You really have to figure out what you want out of the car. I think both options have their pro's and con's. I have had both and I truly liked both cars. There are some great aftermarket kits on the market, and great products. The Mini has also shown to be capable of a lot of extra power and still maintain it's reliability. I don't think you will go wrong either way. I wouldn't be worried of blowing up your engine if you go aftermarket. And I think the warranty scares have never really substantiated themselves. I am not aware of any real warranty denials on the Mini (based on posts on the various Mini Boards) because of aftermarket parts. Good Luck with your choice.

 

Funny, I've never owned a Mont Blanc. Always thought of it as a tiny ego trip that can leak in your pocket.

I used to wear a $25 Rolex knockoff. My boss had a blueface that never kept good time and was always in the shop. Mine kept perfect time and it used to drive him crazy. I was always a bit afraid that someone would put a gun to my head in the elevator for my fake Rolex. But then they might be getting a better deal.

Some brands are worth the premium price as they offer superior engineering, proprietary taste, looks or service. These days, world markets have become very efficient and those true brands are very hard to come by.

The Mini is hanging in there and despite some serious competition probably doesn't need refreshening for a couple of years yet. IMHO, the JCW engine package has always been too dear, too little, to late.

 

Said the guy the admits to never owning one. They are a nice fountain pen and not even the priciest. Typical as you have a lot of comments about the JCW. I do not make comment on driveability of the modded ones. Just comment that I have direct knowledge of. The fact that I don't have to look for a shop to do installs. Don't have to worry about voiding warranty or having to argue my parts aren't responsible.

I guess you don't understand. I too own a nice mechanical watch. Paid more than 3 times your knock off. But inherrent with mechanicals the run fast/slow and need maintenance. A timex is just as good... . Thats if keeping time to the millisecond is your goal.

It's like stereos. I like Bose. I understand I can get "better" for less. If I get x amp, y speakers and do all sorts of work. Audiphiles have awesome systems and look down at my choice. But I'm not out for the perfect sound. I like the sound, the ease of use and integration. No work, just set it up and it works well. I have the Acoustic Wave, I love it. I have had people tell me all about what I could of got. I tell them this I got exactly what I wanted and am not dissappointed.

If my goal was the fasted Mini i would have got the mod route. But It wasn't what I wanted and I got a faster than stock MCS, all down at the dealership, no work. And of course, the Badges . Because when it comes down to it in the parking lot, sitting still thats what counts.

Jag XKE or my JCW Works? Hands down...XKE. It about more than fast and cheap.

Paul

 

It's a tough one, no doubt about it. I've spent many an hour reading threads on this forum about this very issue.

Ultimately, I decided to go aftermarket. It's not that I can't afford the JCW, because I can. But $6000 installed for a 37hp upgrade is ridiculous, especially since you can match it for (roughly) a third of the cost in the aftermarket. I think BMW is being inexcusably greedy with the JCW package. Speaking for myself, I'd have paid $4k, maybe even $5k, but $6k seemed ludicrous. And JCW owners, please understand that I'm not knocking you at all. I have no doubt you love your Mini as I love mine.

I've never modded a car in my life until the Mini, as I've always been too chicken to mess with the warranty, if that's any indication of my normal mindset. But now, my Randy Webb-installed 15% pulley and Alta intake make me smile every day, and the sway bar and H Sports are probably next, topped off by the Uni-Chip and I'll be done, having spent less than $2k total.

I drove 11,000 miles on my car before modding, btw, if that matters at all.

 

The same people who complain about excessive pricing for the JCW, purchase an aftermarket pulley and pay someone $300 install costs at a pulley party for 1 hour worth of work. The pulley install at that price has been installed in 39 minutes by one technician (almost $600/hour) and most competent technicians can do it in 1 hour. Talk about excessive pricing.

That is almost one third of what I paid for the JCW kit install. I know there is a lot of fun at the parties and that is worth something, but if you argue that point, then you see that there is more to our Minis then just a pure dollar and numbers comparison. Because if it was just numbers and dollars, then you all have been ripped off, big time.

 

Blown clutches? whats that all about?

 

newbies with blown clutches? People that've never owned a manual tranny before, and have never been taught. They ride the clutch pedal or do too many redline side-steps and trash/wear-out the clutch in only a few thousand miles. The clutch is a wear item, like brake pads - it'll last exactly how well you take care of it.

This thread has kind-of turned into a designer-label lifestyle discussion. For that type of person the JCW is perfect. No U.S. tuner has that sort of cachet. The type of person that only "wants the goods, minus marketing hoopla" obviously isn't attracted to JCW. Dif'rent strokes, right? As long as you're happy with your MINI.

 

That’s a pretty weak statement, but umm, okay, sure, it’s a deal. I’ll get ripped off on aftermarket labor but save $4000 overall, you can get ripped off on excessive JCW pricing but get a better labor rate. Again, that’s me with $4000 more in my pocket by the time we’re both done, and our Minis perform on a similar level. I’m happy if you are.

The issue for me is performance gained + prestige/dollar spent, not labor/hour. Personally speaking, the intangibles for the JCW package are overpriced, to the point where I can't justify the sticker with bleating cries of "it's not just about the numbers, it's the prestige, it's the warranty, it's the badging, seamless execution, exclusivity, etc." For some people, $6000 for the JCW is just right. For myself, it's about $1500 beyond what I feel constitutes a reasonable outlay. Hell, some people would pay $10k for the JCW package and still staunchly defend its value.

Diff'rent strokes, like Rye said, as long as you're happy with your Mini. I’m pretty sure I echoed that with my line of "JCW owners, please understand that I'm not knocking you at all. I have no doubt you love your Mini as I love mine."