Hello Everybody! This is my first post on these forums. There appears to be a whole lot of wide-ranging information on the site and I feel a bit overwhelmed so please bear with me.

I have been considering a Mini for a few years now but I purchased a Toyota Yaris liftback a year ago to use as a commuter car (even though I have a relatively short commute). At the time, and I believe even currently, Toyota was having a hell of a time keeping them on the lot. They sold extremely quickly regardless of the options or lack thereof and there was no bargaining...you paid sticker an that was it. To make a long story "sort of" short, I walked into the local Mini Dealer the other day and spoke to a very nice young saleswoman who was knowledgeable and not in the least bit pushy (which I really like).

So...we built up a car with the simulator and the BMW sales manager across the street came over to have a look at my Yaris because I wanted to trade the car in (never done a trade-in before). Considering you folks don't know me...I keep my cars pristine. This is "relative" for many but I am talking about professional detailer level clean. I usually wash and dry the car every week, not one crevice or jamb missed and the interior vacuumed. The engine compartment, underside and paint are flawless and the car has 8,200 miles on it. If I were to put this on any Toyota new car lot tomorrow, it would be the nicest car on the lot and pass as brand new.

The sales manager took the car for a quick spin around the building and parked it. He was not concerned about much only "glancing" at the overall condition of the car. He didn't even pop the hood! So, when they came back with the lowest trade-in value price available...I was very, very disappointed. Not having been through this before, I assume that this is normal practice and that if I wanted to get top dollar I could and should sell on the private market but is there no value added that it's a Toyota and EASILY resalable at the top of the spectrum for Toyota used car prices?

I left and told the saleswoman that I would get back with her either way regarding the deal so I called her a bit later that afternoon and told her that unless the sales manager could give me another $1,000 for the trade-in, there would be no purchase(more than fair in my mind). I really like the Mini but I feel like the trade-in price was just unacceptable...I mean, I could see the lowest end if the car had a ding or was filthy and needed to be gone through. I could see it if I was trading in a jeep or any other American car for that matter but a basically new Toyota Yaris liftback?

So...I guess my question or insight requested falls along the lines of, did I do the right thing and should I expect a call back from the dealership or will they take the "hands-off" approach and just wait for the next guy to come in an order a car? I felt like there wasn't a whole lot of excitement in the building and maybe it was just a slow day but...I don't know. I would consider going to CarMax and selling my car but I really want something that's seamless and uncomplicated as possible (It appears now that this may come with a price). The saleswoman told me that I could drive my car until the Mini came in which was also nice. Sorry for the long-winded, wandering post...I just don't know what to expect I guess and well ....what can I say, I think that I have Mini fever.

Also worth noting....I planned on financing a majority of the price through Mini Financial if that is worth anything.

 

You could always fare better selling it yourself, MINI dealerships even lowball MINIs, most dealerships do this including CarMax. Saleswomen, will continue to be low pressure even when your car comes in. And when someone is interested in your car, they'll be nice enough to ask you if they could sell it. Not sure if that's tactic to get you in gear or a whimsical arrogance. Shopping MINI dealerships for best price is an effective tool, might get some free cool stuff ie: extended warranty, rubber carpets, stripes, or remove cost for dealer add-on, but not below sticker price. For an order try to shoot for MSRP and no additional cost for dealer mark-up or add-on crap. A showroom floor car might be able to negotiate more. Also, try http://www.kbb.com/ and http://www.nadaguides.com/ also http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/index....=1259465021825 for used car values.

Universal MINI? Noticed you said BMW dealer across street.

 

+1 on the post above. If they aren't willing to give you more on the trade in low ball them on the cost of the car. But whatever you do figure these 2 numbers out separately. Figure out the trade in, then figure out the cost of the car not together to many numbers and you might screw yourself. And ask next time not to deal with BMW people cause some of the sales people can be very arrogant and that is from personal experience.

 

What has been the forums overall experience on bargaining the price down? This isn't for a car on the lot...this will be an order. Do you think that I could knock a grand from the price? Is it common for them to negotiate?

 

You don't list any info about yourself, so not sure if you have a MINI car club anywhere near you or not. For me, I belonged to the local club (since I already had one when I was ordering another) and it really helped a lot in so many ways. I got a great deal, extra stuff thrown in, special treatment from the general manager himself; they basically were bending over backwards to make sure I was happy. Was it a grand? Well, we added stuff at the end (dealer add-ons) that we weren't planning on, so I don't have an exact number. But with everything all together, I know I got my car and all its goodies for a lot less than I would have if I wasn't part of the club. I know it was easily over a grand. But I wouldn't say it is common for any of them to negotiate, although with the economy in the crapper as it is now, it's probably more likely now than ever.

 

I highly recommend going to a different MINI dealer and seeing if they can beat the offer of the dealer you just visited. I am sure they will beat the offer from dealer A. Afterwards go back to dealer A, and tell them what dealer B is offering. You may have to go back and forth a few times, but in the end competition will be a good thing to earn your business.

Also, don't even mention the financing part. They don't need to know that up front, just worry about the price of the vehicle and trade-in. If you have a good credit score, you don't have anything to worry about securing financing through MINI financial.

The last point I would like to make is Car Max, although convenient, usually low ***** the crap out of KBB recommended prices.

Finally, you are the guy ultimately paying for the vehicle. The only thing that you should be worried about is securing the best deal for yourself. If you do not think they are giving you the best deal, walk away. In the words of a famous football player, "I gotta do what's best for T.O."

When I bought my Clubman back in February, they were not willing to discount and low balled me on my Accord. I ended up selling the car private party and had them take off 1200 off the MSRP, even though they said up front MINI's sell sticker. The only difference with my situation and yours is they had the vehicle on the lot, so in the end they finally caved in and discounted when they knew I was a serious buyer. If you are ordering the vehicle, most dealers do not discount at all off the MSRP.

Good luck, and keep us posted!

 

+1 on the BMW S.A.'s

Three years ago my brother and I were looking at a 328i. We made an offer to the salesman, and the arrogant s.o.b. asked us, "what other cars are you looking at?" We told him we were also looking at an Infiniti G35. He straight up told us, "maybe you should go with the G35." Guess what? We went with the G35.

 

Will & Kimbo,
Thanks for posting. I have updated my setting to include my location. I am in Connecticut. I can appreciate the car club thing but I am more concerned with getting money off as opposed to getting more for no price. I think that might be a hard thing to do considering the car is not on the lot and would be ordered. Essentially, I won't be taking any "stock" off of their hands so I am inclined to think that I won't be receiving any sort of discount on price?

I haven't had a bad experience with the salesperson or sales manager...just observed that he was extremely nonchalant when looking at my car. He didn't spend very much time at all looking at it which leads me to believe that nice or poor...the trade-in was going to be a low ball regardless.

 

I'd recommend that you try to take the emotion out of the transaction. I know that is easier said than done, but it's a business transaction to the dealer, nothing more.

Some dealers are better than others, but I wouldn't expect a MINI or BMW dealer to be giving you a great deal on both ends (trade and sale). My dealer was very good, but they would only offer $500 - 1000 off of cars on the lot and nothing but MSRP for orders. They threw in a few things like mats, but that was it.

If you feel you're current car is worth more than KBB because it's been maintained better than any other Yaris ever built, that's fine. The dealer isn't going to reward you for this effort as much as another private party, which is just the way it is. The dealer WILL tell whoever looks at the car all about it and try to cash in on it if you allow them to take the car on their terms.

I bough my MINI in April 2009, so the market may be different today and its 7 months later so things can change, but I haven't seen any dealers that would give you a great trade and then a good deal on the new sale. They're out to make money and the used market is depressed.

Best of luck, I think you'll like the MINI if you are able to come to terms that you can live with.

 

It is not very hard to sell your car your self. Put a nice ad in the paper and have a bunch of goofy people come to your house to beat up your car.I think some people just don't have anything better to do except torture people trying to sell their car. The newspaper ad's are usually pretty expensive. That knocks the heck out of the $1000.00 extra you want from your Mini dealer. They are going to let you keep the car until the new Mini arrives so thats gotta be worth something. Go to "CAR MAX" and get the price they would pay for your car.
Take the deal and see if you can get the dealer to throw in the stripes and a set of floor mats which you probably want anyway.

When you trade in a car you will never get the full value as you would selling it outright but when you sell it you have to expect doing a little work and expense in advertising. A lot of people sell their car to a neighbor or friend and eliminate the hassels. "BUT" when selling to a friend or neighbor you better hope nothing goes wrong with the car for at least two years or more years or you will be blamed for cheating them with a lemon.
Ronnie948

 

Thank you for the continued responses. I have taken the emotion out of the buying experience for the most part. Of course it's impossible to completely take it out of the equation but I fully understand both sides of this transaction so, I don't know how reasonable it is for me to expect a middle of the road trade-in value but considering the condition of the car, it seems fair to me(as opposed to the low end). I understand the admininstrative costs that go into the transaction so maybe I am not being realistic. It just seems like the car is more valuable than what they are willing to give me.

I definitely know that the trade-in would relieve the stress of dealing with people coming to my house and kicking tires. I guess that it's just a balance and trade-off and I need to be willing to put a number on that. Also mentioned was the fact that the dealer would be willing to allow me use of the car until the Mini arrives. Again...hard to put a number on what that's worth but it's pretty good nonetheless.

Maybe I am not fully appreciating the whole thing and I need to re-assess.

 

Take your Yaris to AutoMax or other used car dealers (perhaps your Toyota Dealership as well) to have an idea what a MINI Dealer can be expected to offer and if it's worth your trouble to try to 'private-sale' it.

There is generally no incentive for a Dealer to go below MSRP on an ordered car, in fact some dealers have added a 'Premium' above MSRP in the past.

Your BEST DEAL will come on an 'inventory' car, especially at the end of a month. A car that remains 'in-stock' on Tuesday Morning (Dec 1st) can cost that Dealer a lot of money in floor-plan expense and there may be other 'incentives' as well that compute monthly.

You are fortunate to be able to visit a lot of MINI Dealers within a weekend's travel of your location, it is likely that you could find a 'stocked' MINI that had color/equipment that would please you at one of them. Even with this 'luck', you are now an amateur playing with a 'pro', trying to walk out with their 'best' deal.

If you think you might enjoy playing that game, go for it this weekend and may you have the best of luck (but never let that MA know he has exactly what you want). Just make a solid offer and if refused, expect to walk, give him your cell-phone number and tell him you are on the way to the next dealer.

 

I am fortunate that the Mini dealer is 10 minutes from me. This does not, however, impact my purchasing techniques. I looked over the paperwork and made another offer for what I wanted and was willing to pay. It basically went a bit like the following:

I would like to remove the cold weather package from the quote ($500) and wanted to see if you could possibly throw the bonnet stripes in for free ($100). This would reduce the overall price of the car to $25,250. I was then hoping to get the car for a flat $25,000. Atop of this, I would like to see the trade-in climb from $8,700 to $9,000 even. Overall, I don't believe that this changes much but it would be enough to have me sold on the car.

I tried to keep it as emotionless and straight-forward as possible. I hope to hear something back. This would leave me feeling good enough about things to go through with the deal. Feel free to tell me that it's fair or I am an idiot.

 

Yeah, you will get a much better price selling it. For the most part, the dealers just base their trade-in estimate on the model and year of car, not on its condition. When my dad traded in his Odyssey (which didn't have a working HVAC system, failed power door, and an odd sound that can only be described as "helicopter-like"), they gave him the exact same number they did for my uncle's Odyssey (which is in perfect running condition). All they're going to do is auction it for wholesale anyways. In fact, in the end we got $1000 more for our Odyssey--but this was just a thinly veiled discount off the new car, attached to the trade-in price for accounting/sales purposes.

If you want more money for your car, you're going to have to go elsewhere. If you want the convenience of dealer trade-ins... you have to play by their rules. That said, I think you have a good chance of getting the $300 bump in trade-in, definitely on the bonnet stripes, but the cold weather package would take quite some convincing.

 

This is completely general information.

First. Dont let emotion figure into the trade offer. I knoe the Yaris is your baby and you have babied it, but dont take the trade offer personally.

Second. Dont look at all the numbers seperately. Find out how much the trade is worth using the internet. Find out how much the Mini costs them using the internet. Use all the financing calculators you can find in the internet. Go in with a monthly payment in mind. Let the dealer work into your number. Doesnt matter if they come up in trade offer, or down in price, or better financing, what have you. All those numbers dont matter. Mixing all those numbers up in your head are the tools of the salesman.

Last. Allow the dealer to make some money. They are not in business for free. If you know all the numbers beforehand you will be in the catbird seat. All the numbers are out there on the internet.

 

Just FYI, when I bought my Mini in August they were offering 1.9 percent financing. I dropped by the dealer today, now it's 0.9 and no payments til March. Seems like they're somewhat motivated to move some cars.

As for the Yaris, I doubt it will be hanging out on the Mini/BMW lot, so it will be changing hands a couple times, and each party needs to make a profit. No surprise they're low-balling you, you'll have to decide if the convenience is worth it.

 

I noticed you are in CT. Are you working with MINI of Fairfield County? If you are and you are buying a stick, check this thread out. The OP might have some input also, since his fiance bought the car from there.

https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...arranty-2.html

 

The big question here is how do you know whether the trade offered for the Yaris is high or low? If it were so easy as to read some value posted on-line or in some book, why would they need a high priced manager to appraise the car? They could just hire a part time high school kid to do the same thing.

Used car values are subject to current actual market conditions, not a printed guide, and the vehicle is only worth what you can turn it into cash for today. Every other value is only a theory of what you might sell it for someday. As previous posters have mentioned, either shop another Mini store, try to sell it to a Toyota store, or be prepared to go through the process of retailing it yourself. In reality, you might have already been offered a great deal.

 

Yeah MINI dealer usually do not budge on ordered cars, but have been known to negotiate up to $1000 (I heard on this forum) on showroom stock, but unfortunately not on the "bookend" states, mostly middle America dealerships. Another, way to control price is to buy with ONLY the options you need. Like in your case only cold package and that's it. Period, no Sport, Comfort, Convenience, or Metallic Paint, etc. If you feel you need 1 item from package, say MFSW from Comfort Pak, you can buy it individually eventhough its $500 for just MFSW and $1200 for entire Package with 10 more items you don't need. Point is you get what you want and save $700.

 

Hey everybody,
I just wanted to update this thread to let you know that I wasn't able to legitimize purchasing the MINI. I just can't get past the low offer on the trade-in and to be honest, I am not motivated or passionate enough at this point to hit the private market to sell the Yaris. It'd be one thing if the car had issues or was unsafe, etc. but it runs flawless as expected for a new car. I may regain some interest come Spring but I have been put off a bit in dealing with the salesperson.

When she thought I was hook, line and sinker her responses were quick and a little pushy(communication happening via email). As I asked questions, the responses were slower. After coming to the conclusion that the trade-in put me just "too" upside-down financially, I cut off the deal. I have since contacted her to ask a few more questions (still leaving lines open) and she hasn't responded. I could surely understand if she was extremely busy, but both times I have been in there it was "dead." It is my opinion or thought that this is her way of telling me to "F-off" if I am not buying here and now. That is fine though...should I reconsider come Spring, I will not be purchasing from her. I'll walk by her desk and waive though....

Thanks everybody for your insight, thoughts and advice!

 

I couldn't legitimize buying a Mini either...but I still own one! But I wasn't upside down on a trade in either. If things are slow at the dealer, the MA is stupid to blow you off. Can't blame you for not wanting to deal with stupid. Hope things work out come spring.

 

Kinda funny that you talked about Car Max. I went to them after MINI wouldn't give me a decent trade-in value and sold my old car there. I got an extra $1,100 from them.

 

You say ------[quote][/Kinda funny that you talked about Car Max. I went to them after MINI wouldn't give me a decent trade-in value and sold my old car there. I got an extra $1,100 from them.QUOTE]

You sold your Yaris for $1,100 more then the Mini dealer wanted to give you so what is your problem ordering the car you want? I sure am confused!!!!

 

In these times, some MINI dealers will offer a deal off the lot or factory order. Most likely to get the best deal if you get rid of your old car elsewhere.

 

You sold your Yaris for $1,100 more then the Mini dealer wanted to give you so what is your problem ordering the car you want? I sure am confused!!!!
[/quote]

Wow did you really read that wrong! (You didn't have too much beer did you?) My old car was a Dodge Intrepid. I also was saying that I felt Carmax gave me a better deal on the car than MINI offered so I went to the local Carmax, sold the car and took a taxi back to the MINI dealer. Drove off the lot with my Clubbie the same day!