F55/F56 Ddc
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5th Gear
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 888
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From: Lodi,CA
Ddc
I am thinking about ordering a new MINI S. A little history. I bought an '08S with sports suspension and 17" wheels and changed out to non runflats at 10,000 miles. My second MINI S had a standard suspension and 16' wheels and was a much better driver on less than perfect roads. But, at 20,000 miles I switched to Michelin tires(non runflat) and the car became a wonderful riding car with no loss in handling. My third Mini S was a '15 S with '17" wheels and handled and rode great with the runflats. At 30,000 miles I switched to a Bridgestone all season tire and the car rode even better with, again no loss in handling.
Forward, I am going to buy a new '19 S or JCW and I would like to hear about the DDC suspension opinions. I don't auto cross or drive my car on a track. I have to mention that my current car is a '17 Cayman S. While I appreciate the wonderful performance of the Cayman, it is a horrible car to use on long trips. My old MINI's were a pleasure for my wife and I to drive ( we enjoyed MTTS '14).
Forward, I am going to buy a new '19 S or JCW and I would like to hear about the DDC suspension opinions. I don't auto cross or drive my car on a track. I have to mention that my current car is a '17 Cayman S. While I appreciate the wonderful performance of the Cayman, it is a horrible car to use on long trips. My old MINI's were a pleasure for my wife and I to drive ( we enjoyed MTTS '14).
4th Gear
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 415
Likes: 28
From: NJ
I'm on my 3rd F56. First one a 2014 S std suspension, Second a 2016 S with DDC. I thought the DDC made the car twitchy and I went the normal route of swapping out the run flats. Now I have a 2019 JCW without the DDC and I'm really much happier even with only 1500 miles on the clock I felt an immediate difference in the car. I would seriously drive a mini both with and without. Good luck let us know what you think.
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5th Gear
Joined: Mar 2008
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From: Lodi,CA
Jcw
I'm on my 3rd F56. First one a 2014 S std suspension, Second a 2016 S with DDC. I thought the DDC made the car twitchy and I went the normal route of swapping out the run flats. Now I have a 2019 JCW without the DDC and I'm really much happier even with only 1500 miles on the clock I felt an immediate difference in the car. I would seriously drive a mini both with and without. Good luck let us know what you think.
2nd Gear
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 100
Likes: 21
From: NE US
dpcompt - I have a 19 JCW HT and a ‘18 718 Cayman GTS with Sport PASM. I have the non-DDC sport suspension on the JCW and have logged almost 2000 miles on it as DD. Mixed highway and back road commute. To me, the JCW sport chassis rides similar to PASM sport setting (assuming you have PASM). A bit firm and bouncy but not terribly uncomfortable on the highway except where you have expansion joints and poor surfacing. Also, less overall road noise intrusion in the JCW compared to my GTS. In your situation, you might want to drive a new Mini with DDC to see it the behavior is better than you recall. Or get a Cooper S with the base, non-DDC suspension. Briefly had one of these (a MY 19 also) before upgrading to the JCW and I found it to be a fun car to drive and very comfortable on the road. Hope this helps.
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5th Gear
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 888
Likes: 105
From: Lodi,CA
Ddc?
dpcompt - I have a 19 JCW HT and a ‘18 718 Cayman GTS with Sport PASM. I have the non-DDC sport suspension on the JCW and have logged almost 2000 miles on it as DD. Mixed highway and back road commute. To me, the JCW sport chassis rides similar to PASM sport setting (assuming you have PASM). A bit firm and bouncy but not terribly uncomfortable on the highway except where you have expansion joints and poor surfacing. Also, less overall road noise intrusion in the JCW compared to my GTS. In your situation, you might want to drive a new Mini with DDC to see it the behavior is better than you recall. Or get a Cooper S with the base, non-DDC suspension. Briefly had one of these (a MY 19 also) before upgrading to the JCW and I found it to be a fun car to drive and very comfortable on the road. Hope this helps.
2nd Gear
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 102
Likes: 5
From: Wisconsin
I am thinking about ordering a new MINI S. A little history. I bought an '08S with sports suspension and 17" wheels and changed out to non runflats at 10,000 miles. My second MINI S had a standard suspension and 16' wheels and was a much better driver on less than perfect roads. But, at 20,000 miles I switched to Michelin tires(non runflat) and the car became a wonderful riding car with no loss in handling. My third Mini S was a '15 S with '17" wheels and handled and rode great with the runflats. At 30,000 miles I switched to a Bridgestone all season tire and the car rode even better with, again no loss in handling.
Forward, I am going to buy a new '19 S or JCW and I would like to hear about the DDC suspension opinions. I don't auto cross or drive my car on a track. I have to mention that my current car is a '17 Cayman S. While I appreciate the wonderful performance of the Cayman, it is a horrible car to use on long trips. My old MINI's were a pleasure for my wife and I to drive ( we enjoyed MTTS '14).
Forward, I am going to buy a new '19 S or JCW and I would like to hear about the DDC suspension opinions. I don't auto cross or drive my car on a track. I have to mention that my current car is a '17 Cayman S. While I appreciate the wonderful performance of the Cayman, it is a horrible car to use on long trips. My old MINI's were a pleasure for my wife and I to drive ( we enjoyed MTTS '14).
4th Gear
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 415
Likes: 28
From: NJ
Long trips were never a problem in my first MCS or second with DDC, however between those 2 I did prefer the non DDC. The longest trip I have taken in the JCW to date has been about 200 miles without any discomfort. Good luck , let us know what you decide to do..
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5th Gear
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 888
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From: Lodi,CA
I am going to Niello Mini tomorrow to test the different suspensions and the seats. It will be interesting. My '15S with the stock suspension was fine on long trips. I am thinking that I will end up with a "loaded" S with the JCW add on. But tomorrow I will find out. This will be my fourth Mini.
1st Gear
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 21
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I like my S with base suspension and 16" wheels. Styling wise, 17" looks better but I run around mostly in a very pot holed urban environment so 16" works better for my needs. I am one of the few that likes the security of the run flats over all out performance. I have been curious over the years if there is any meaningful difference in ride quality or noise among run flat options.
6th Gear
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,161
Likes: 105
I have a 2019 JCW hardtop without the DDC. I had my dealer put non run flats on it before I took delivery. I had switched to on runflats on my 2012 when the runflats wore out, and decided I wouldn,t drive a MINI with runflats again. Ride without runflats is great, and the handling is, too. DDC was the last decision I made when I ordered my JCW, and I’m glad I didn’t order it.
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5th Gear
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 888
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From: Lodi,CA
I test drove a JCW with the sports suspension, and an "S" with the stock suspension. I preferred the stock suspension. For me the only upside of the JCW is the extra cooling and the brakes ( I will be purchasing the JCW upgrade kit). My first Mini, an '08 S with sports suspension and the JCW that I drove today felt similar. I am buying this car to use as a daily driver and for travel. The handling with the stock suspension is pretty good. Maybe I would have to trail brake a little more , but for the improvement in ride, it's worth it. I would be spending an extra $4000+ for a JCW. Now, if I could get a JCW with the stock suspension, I might consider.
2nd Gear
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 100
Likes: 21
From: NE US
Based upon your needs and first post, I’d say you made the right choice. The only real weak link in the S from my brief experience is the braking system but you’re upgrading to the JCW front big brakes so that’s a non- issue. Enjoy your new car.
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5th Gear
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 888
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From: Lodi,CA
Mini has changed the way you order options. I get that they're more efficient in offering packages, instead of being able to customize your MINI. It's not going stop me from buying one and the new system has allowed MINI to keep costs down. But, when I was looking at buying my Cayman, I was considering a JCW. At the time, Spring of '16, I could buy a JCW with the standard suspension. I don't think I can now. I think I might be ok with the DDC suspension. Just a rant.
2nd Gear
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 100
Likes: 21
From: NE US
As far as I know you cannot order a JCW HT with the base suspension. It’s either SS or DDC. I like the SS as I noted above plus I can fit the JCW Pro coilover kit (or another type) without complications. That’s my plan next year.
Another option in between a JCW and base S might be a base S with the standard chassis and add the JCW tuning kit if you want more power and the valved exhaust. That’s what I did to my 19 S and it was a hoot. But you are going to need better brakes...
Again, good luck.
Another option in between a JCW and base S might be a base S with the standard chassis and add the JCW tuning kit if you want more power and the valved exhaust. That’s what I did to my 19 S and it was a hoot. But you are going to need better brakes...
Again, good luck.
6th Gear
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,161
Likes: 105
I want to add, the sport suspension is what I have on my '15 JCW...no DDC. It is NOT harsh in my opinion....I think too many are quick to write it off for want of a smoother ride. If you get a JCW why detract from the sportiness you get with the stock sport suspension? The DDC will soften the ride and be around 90% of the firmness of the sport suspension if DDC is set to firm, or if set to soft it is quite compliant based on what others have said. I personally would not go for a standard suspension on the JCW even if it were still offered. But, to each their own. FWIW, I have a horrible back and my JCW is awesome, if nothing else the seats are some of the best I've ever had....I have the suede/dinamica JCW sport seats. You used to be able to get non-sport seats in the JCW too...I'm not sure you can still do that with the current configurator.
Good luck whatever you decide.
Last edited by 02fanatic; Oct 23, 2018 at 09:46 AM. Reason: Added comment about sport suspension & seats
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5th Gear
Joined: Mar 2008
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From: Lodi,CA
Well, I finally made the decision. An "S" hardtop, iconic, stock suspension, with the JCW tuning kit. While I would love to have the big brakes, I don't need them. I have had three Minis and put over 40k miles and never had to have any brake work done. My current car, a Porsche Cayman has maybe the best handling of any car other than exotics. But the road noise makes the car a terrible trip car. My Minis were always enjoyed by myself and my wife. And by the way, my other car is a '17 Audi S6, so I am not wanting for horsepower.
Over the years, the MINI has improved tremendously. There are some who think it has lost some of it's raw nature. So be it.. But the "F" series outperforms the R56 and R53 in every way.
Over the years, the MINI has improved tremendously. There are some who think it has lost some of it's raw nature. So be it.. But the "F" series outperforms the R56 and R53 in every way.
2nd Gear
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 100
Likes: 21
From: NE US
Precisely the spec of my former iconic level 19 S. JCW tune is great. Chassis good. Brakes subjective. Being a 718 owner I would be interested in your take on the stock S brakes. Congratulations and enjoy. What color did you choose?
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5th Gear
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 888
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From: Lodi,CA
Brakes
I had a '15 S before I bought the 718 S and I thought they were fine for me. I don't track or autocross. I am sure if I competed I would end up upgrading the front brakes. But, for a daily driver, they're fine for me. I am easy on brakes. My Cayman brakes were at 80% at 19,000 miles. At 66yo, I am pretty conservative. I like having the reserve power but will hardly ever use it. I will miss driving the Cayman, but the tire noise makes the car a pain on long trips when I have a passenger. I also won't miss the ridiculously, expensive maintenance. For my driving, I just couldn't justify the added cost of the JCW. The dealer gave me a break on the JCW tune and a decent discount on the car ( S with Iconic, black lounge leather ) that is still thousands less than a lessor equipped JCW. Forgot to mention, Lapisluxury Blue, white top and mirrors, and white hood stripes.
Last edited by dpcompt; Oct 27, 2018 at 02:33 PM. Reason: change
4th Gear
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 388
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From: Rocky Mntn High Desert
BRAKES: No mention of transmission.
My opinion and my experiences (worth what you pay for it "$0"). Still have 2 out of 3 MINIS. With the manual transmissions, brakes last (for us) over 50,000. We live in the mountains and about 50% in town driving. If I lived and drove in a metro (which we have), auto. If I were to go with an automatic, I would go with the JCW or "S" with JCW brake upgrade. The concept and practice between the two is totally different. Took the MINI motoring school and they use auto JCW's. The differences between auto and my manuals was quite evident. The auto maybe "quicker" on the track and "maybe" the autocross, but on the ice, snow, and mountain roads I still prefer the manual. Both "systems" are excellent, it is just personal experience/preference.
My opinion and my experiences (worth what you pay for it "$0"). Still have 2 out of 3 MINIS. With the manual transmissions, brakes last (for us) over 50,000. We live in the mountains and about 50% in town driving. If I lived and drove in a metro (which we have), auto. If I were to go with an automatic, I would go with the JCW or "S" with JCW brake upgrade. The concept and practice between the two is totally different. Took the MINI motoring school and they use auto JCW's. The differences between auto and my manuals was quite evident. The auto maybe "quicker" on the track and "maybe" the autocross, but on the ice, snow, and mountain roads I still prefer the manual. Both "systems" are excellent, it is just personal experience/preference.
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5th Gear
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 888
Likes: 105
From: Lodi,CA
auto vs manual
BRAKES: No mention of transmission.
My opinion and my experiences (worth what you pay for it "$0"). Still have 2 out of 3 MINIS. With the manual transmissions, brakes last (for us) over 50,000. We live in the mountains and about 50% in town driving. If I lived and drove in a metro (which we have), auto. If I were to go with an automatic, I would go with the JCW or "S" with JCW brake upgrade. The concept and practice between the two is totally different. Took the MINI motoring school and they use auto JCW's. The differences between auto and my manuals was quite evident. The auto maybe "quicker" on the track and "maybe" the autocross, but on the ice, snow, and mountain roads I still prefer the manual. Both "systems" are excellent, it is just personal experience/preference.
My opinion and my experiences (worth what you pay for it "$0"). Still have 2 out of 3 MINIS. With the manual transmissions, brakes last (for us) over 50,000. We live in the mountains and about 50% in town driving. If I lived and drove in a metro (which we have), auto. If I were to go with an automatic, I would go with the JCW or "S" with JCW brake upgrade. The concept and practice between the two is totally different. Took the MINI motoring school and they use auto JCW's. The differences between auto and my manuals was quite evident. The auto maybe "quicker" on the track and "maybe" the autocross, but on the ice, snow, and mountain roads I still prefer the manual. Both "systems" are excellent, it is just personal experience/preference.
I think the manual vs. auto is more about personal preference than anything else.
Now, I have the 2-3 month wait. I'll just sit back and enjoy the Cayman.
4th Gear
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 388
Likes: 85
From: Rocky Mntn High Desert
It is difficult to shift a manual, tires squealing into a corner with a guardrail looming, trying to check the cone marker at the apex...the MINI auto trans (in sport shift) was excellent, even without paddles. I prefer to have both hands on the steering wheel... On the other hand, the rev matching in the MINI manual is excellent. It is personal and environmental. Hope your wait is not too long.
2nd Gear
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 100
Likes: 21
From: NE US
I think you will be very happy with your S with JCW add ons. The brakes will be fine around town. My JCW is sport auto and, while not close to Porsche PDK, it’s fun enough and shifts come pretty briskly. I commute with mine so manual was out of the question. I wish Mini would bring their DCT to the US. Ridiculous in 2018 they don’t at least put a DCT into the JCW. I think they currently put an 8 speed torque converter unit in ROW JCWs. Go figure...
