Drivetrain (Cooper S) MINI Cooper S (R53) intakes, exhausts, pulleys, headers, throttle bodies, and any other modifications to the Cooper S drivetrain.

Drivetrain Direct Air Scoop for the Intake

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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 12:27 PM
  #51  
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Originally Posted by PARTSMAN109
A NACA duct would work well right above the throttle body location.
How would we seal a filter to it?

What about an opening on the flat right inside the drivers' headlight?
Airflow isn't quite linear enough right there to use a NACA duct. Closer back towards the stock box location, and you're getting closer. Above the TB any opening would work really, since that's more an area of collision rather than flow.
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 12:27 PM
  #52  
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Originally Posted by PARTSMAN109
A NACA duct would work well right above the throttle body location.
How would we seal a filter to it?
EDIT: ok so much for that

What about an opening on the flat right inside the drivers' headlight?
The head lamp would be a great spot...I think FBT's drag Mini did just that...it looks like they removed the cover and the low beam for an intake...Downside...it looks bad...
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 12:31 PM
  #53  
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Originally Posted by MSFITOY
Actually, if you stood on your head Bart, you can see that it is a constructive comment

Honestly, the best ideas to take air in are in these order:

1-Lower grill area (bumper level)...highest pressure zone...closer to center the better...

2-Upper grill area...again, closer to center the better...I know most people are not buying my version of the AGS as a true "Ram Air" design but that's debateble...

3-Right where the IC intake is but sharing the air is at best a compromise without a wider scoop design and is also difficult due to the height restriction...

4-Above the TB location as show in the race car example...

5-Above the airbox...needs tall scoop to work...

6-Through the cowl...same problem...low pressure zone...needs tall scoop to work...the ones that are sold are not tall enough to be functional...
amazing what a little proding will do

so in your estimation how tall would the scoop have to be if over the CAI?
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 12:33 PM
  #54  
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Originally Posted by Bahamabart
amazing what a little proding will do

so in your estimation how tall would the scoop have to be if over the CAI?
Maybe 5"?
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 12:38 PM
  #55  
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Originally Posted by MSFITOY
Maybe 5"?
terrific - when do we start making the hole in your hood?
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 12:39 PM
  #56  
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Already answered by Will.
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 12:39 PM
  #57  
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Cool, now we got Will in on the deal!

Originally Posted by MSFITOY
The head lamp would be a great spot...I think FBT's drag Mini did just that...it looks like they removed the cover and the low beam for an intake...Downside...it looks bad...
I don't think FBT was too worried about appearance aspect. A nice little opening just inside the headlight could be a good source for good air.
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 12:42 PM
  #58  
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Sid got me thinking though. I have my seat set pretty low so I have never watched rain on the hood to see how it flows. Without a wind tunnel that's about the next best option.


Anybody watch the rain blow around on their hood?
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 12:45 PM
  #59  
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Originally Posted by Bahamabart
terrific - when do we start making the hole in your hood?
When I install the louvers
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 12:48 PM
  #60  
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Originally Posted by MSFITOY

6-Through the cowl...same problem...low pressure zone...needs tall scoop to work...the ones that are sold are not tall enough to be functional...
The cowl isn't a low pressure zone.
I measured it years ago with Andy's help.
It actually develops high pressure but didn't register on his Magnehelic until ~50mph. Even at 80 mph is was on the order of something less than 1 psi.

No measurable difference if the pickup was pointing down or upwards in the cowl.
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 12:52 PM
  #61  
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I don't think it would have to be 5" high if it's facing forward.

In truth, this is a pretty easy setup, complete with ram air, water catch and drain, and all the goodies. It's a little difficult to explain, but the air goes in, is routed 180 degrees, through a panel filter, and down to the TB. If you can convince obehave to cut up his car, I'll be happy to go to the Hamptons and help him build it.
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 12:53 PM
  #62  
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Originally Posted by obehave
No measurable difference if the pickup was pointing down or upwards in the cowl.
Where did you measure at?
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 01:00 PM
  #63  
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Originally Posted by Will @ M7 Tuning
I don't think it would have to be 5" high if it's facing forward.
In truth, this is a pretty easy setup, complete with ram air, water catch and drain, and all the goodies. It's a little difficult to explain, but the air goes in, is routed 180 degrees, through a panel filter, and down to the TB. If you can convince obehave to cut up his car, I'll be happy to go to the Hamptons and help him build it.
Is the scoop above the air box or throttle body?
Do you already have a parts list?
any drawings? pics?
I want to keep the intake tract as short as possible
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 01:09 PM
  #64  
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Originally Posted by PARTSMAN109
Is the scoop above the air box or throttle body?
Do you already have a parts list?
any drawings? pics?
Parts list would mostly be aluminum sheet. The scoop would sit approximately where Sid's louvres are sitting, though in a direct path with the airbox. Scoop opening would be maybe 3" high and 5-8" wide, I'll have to play with the numbers a little. Maybe I can mock up a drawing or two tonight.
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 01:14 PM
  #65  
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Originally Posted by Will @ M7 Tuning
I don't think it would have to be 5" high if it's facing forward.

In truth, this is a pretty easy setup, complete with ram air, water catch and drain, and all the goodies. It's a little difficult to explain, but the air goes in, is routed 180 degrees, through a panel filter, and down to the TB. If you can convince obehave to cut up his car, I'll be happy to go to the Hamptons and help him build it.
Uuuuhhhh.......hmmmmmmm...No!

It's Hampton not "The Hamptons" big difference. Don't want people thinking I have money they might start hitting me up for something I don't have.
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 01:17 PM
  #66  
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Originally Posted by obehave
Uuuuhhhh.......hmmmmmmm...No!

It's Hampton not "The Hamptons" big difference. Don't want people thinking I have money they might start hitting me up for something I don't have.


Yeah, I used to live down that way. Definately not the Hamptons, but it's easier than saying Hampton Roads.

I might play with this on my spare hood after I get my upcoming project completed on the new hood.
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 01:26 PM
  #67  
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Originally Posted by Will @ M7 Tuning


Yeah, I used to live down that way. Definately not the Hamptons, but it's easier than saying Hampton Roads.

I might play with this on my spare hood after I get my upcoming project completed on the new hood.
Like to see that. Even if I have to drive to Richmond
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 03:03 PM
  #68  
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Yes and No. Yes in that I direct the airflow to the Alta airbox, that as we all know, does not seal the top entirely. NO, in that it is not a complete path. The shape of the hood, just over the filter - inside the Alta airbox, has a curved down shape that redirects the air down to the filter box. I realize that right now is not ideal. But it proves the concept.

I did cut the foam at the opening in the back,where the air exits, so it is a direct shot to the the airbox with the plastic tube aiming the air. My filter is very dirty on the top area, so I know that the air is going there. The gap between the air tube and the airbox also helps to keep most of the water away from the element.

To me, SAI solves a problem, vortex over the IC. It can be used to direct air to the airbox or if HAI or AGS is used, to either set up.


Originally Posted by PARTSMAN109
bomboasy, I see exactly where you are coming from. I have repositioned the foam seal under the hood to come down directly around the core of the IC, onto a "shortened" stock diverter that no longer hangs over the IC outlet.
Your idea is good, but are you directing the non-IC air from the scoop through a sealed tube to the air filter?
Bomboasy
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 03:05 PM
  #69  
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Originally Posted by MSFITOY
NACA Ducts has good potential but requires a fairly flat surface linear to the airflow in order to function properly...


Problem with our Minis is that they're short, round and stubby...
Sid, a poster in another thread got me thinking about what happens to the air that passes through the DFIC (or any other opening to the underhood area). Would there be any appreciable upside to seeking a way to utilize the low pressure area at the base of the windshield to pull air through the DFIC and out of the engine bay?
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 04:06 PM
  #70  
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Originally Posted by 62Lincoln
Sid, a poster in another thread got me thinking about what happens to the air that passes through the DFIC (or any other opening to the underhood area). Would there be any appreciable upside to seeking a way to utilize the low pressure area at the base of the windshield to pull air through the DFIC and out of the engine bay?
Yes...That's exactly the reason I'm cutting two huge holes into my hood and hence, "Project M7 Louver" thread Using the cowl as an extraction point is not as effective due to the proximity to high pressure just above it higher up on the windshield and the route is quite ciruitous...also requires cutting/removing much of the plastic underhood shrouds...

When I say the cowl area is "low pressure"...that is relative...it is more like neutral stagnant...on the other hand, the area above the hood surface is relatively flat and more likely to have a high flow boundary layer to take advantage of the reverse louvers to extract hot air directly behind the DFIC...
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 04:14 PM
  #71  
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I'm thinking left side for the DFIC and the right side for DAI (direct air intake)
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 04:22 PM
  #72  
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Originally Posted by MSFITOY
Yes...That's exactly the reason I'm cutting two huge holes into my hood and hence, "Project M7 Louver" thread Using the cowl as an extraction point is not as effective due to the proximity to high pressure just above it higher up on the windshield and the route is quite ciruitous...also requires cutting/removing much of the plastic underhood shrouds...

When I say the cowl area is "low pressure"...that is relative...it is more like neutral stagnant...on the other hand, the area above the hood surface is relatively flat and more likely to have a high flow boundary layer to take advantage of the reverse louvers to extract hot air directly behind the DFIC...
Any ideas for those of us "less adventurous" types that aren't quite ready (or have spousal approval ) to cut the hood?

If we could cut smaller openings, would a conceptual "naca duct in reverse" (i.e. mounted to pull air from under the hood to the outside) work? It would be an elegant solution, and look cool too!
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 05:00 PM
  #73  
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OK ... I did this long ago

I "opened up the drivers side of the grill and fabricated this.

 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 05:03 PM
  #74  
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Originally Posted by bpago
OK ... I did this long ago

I "opened up the drivers side of the grill and fabricated this.

what is it?
 
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Old Jul 24, 2006 | 05:13 PM
  #75  
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Originally Posted by SpiderX
All this talk lately about scoops and louvers etc has got me thinking...... the DFIC is a complete winner... a really great product...... why, because it turn the IC so it can take a direct hit of air and expell it.....why not a scoop for the intake..... surely there is a place on the bonnet where the air pressure/stream is right to take in massive amouns of fresh air ...... direct out of the engine bay.....away from any source of engine heat...... I am on a mission
I was answering the original post.

Air to intake

Opened grill
"duct" to chanel outside air .. to inlet area

Other photos in gallery
 
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