Ok, with Alta's new release of their own TC kit for the MCS I think we should have a thread comparing the different Twincharge Kits. Price, parts, power, etc.

What I have so far:

Alta TwinCharge Kit: None actually tested. Dyno's to come shortly. (At least that's what Alta said, MONTHS AGO...
Basic Kit: low boost?
Price: $4,000
Parts List: GT3071R Turbo, header (1.5" primaries, 2.5" to turbo), catless downpipe (3" to 2.5"), o2 simulator, BOV, oil lines, coolant lines, fittings, boost tubes, silicone intake hose, filter, air box, fresh air pipe, couplers and clamps, and nuts and bolts
Power (Goal): 250WHP, ??? LB/FT TQ

Stage 2 Kit: 20psi
Price: $6,000
Parts List: GT3071R Turbo, header (1.5" primaries, 2.5" to turbo), catless downpipe (3" to 2.5"), o2 simulator, BOV, oil lines, coolant lines, fittings, boost tubes, silicone intake hose, filter, air box, fresh air pipe, couplers and clamps, and nuts and bolts, Hydra ECU, 550cc injectors, fuel pump/adapter, AFC, boost controller, and uprated pistons
Power (Goal): 300WHP, ??? LB/FT TQ

Psi-Fi/Helix TurboKompressor:
Basic Kit: Peak 21.5psi
Price: $4,800
Parts List: Garrett GT28RS Turbo, Turbosmart eboost boost contoller/boost gauge and pod, custom cast exhaust manifold, 2.5" SS downpipe with cat, Turbosmart blow-off valve, Psi-Fi PowerPaq computer, 500cc injectors
Power: 250WHP, 237LB/FT TQ

JCW Vs. TurboKompressor


SPI PowerExcel Kit:
Stage One:
Price: $5,850
Parts List: GT28R Turbo, Super Sequential Blow Off Valve, 440 CC injectors, Intercooler, all Charge Piping, intake piping, exhaust manifold, Foam Filter, Oil/water lines, custom machined fittings, Apexi AFC Select
Power: 250WHP, ??? LB/FT TQ

Stage Two:
Price: around $6,500
Parts List: GT28R Turbo, Super Sequential Blow Off Valve, 440 CC injectors, Intercooler, all Charge Piping, intake piping, exhaust manifold, Foam Filter, Oil/water lines, custom machined fittings, Apexi AFC Select, uprated pistons + more
Power: 290WHP, 275 LB/FT TQ

Tuls MCS with the SPI Stage 2 Kit


Stage 3-X:
Price: $?,???
Parts List: GT28R Turbo, Super Sequential Blow Off Valve, injectors, Intercooler, all Charge Piping, intake piping, exhaust manifold, Foam Filter, Oil/water lines, custom machined fittings, Apexi AFC Select, uprated pistons + more x2 lol
Power: 300-400+WHP

 

SPI KIT: $5850
Stage one: 250WHP
PARTS LIST...TOO LONG...I'll put it together asap
here's what I'll rattle off the top of my head

440 CC injectors
Intercooler
all Charge Piping
intake piping
Foam Filter
Oil/water lines
custom machined fittings
GT28R Turbo
SSQBOV

and so on...


Stage Two: 290 WHP
Price: around $6500

Stage: 3-X
300-400+ WHP
call...LOL

 

I think the Helix kit puts down 272whp and is priced at $4800, no?

http://store.webbmotorsports.com/ind...roducts_id=135

This is a good idea to keep all of the kits together...

 

Webb claims 272WHP in Colorado, don't doubt it for a second, but Helix's website lists it as 250WHP and has the dyno to prove it... I did fix the price though, thanks!

 

Nice thread, helps out alot when time comes to write out a check. It would be nice if there were some pics... hahahah...just a personal preference, since that's almost what I'm totally basing my choice on. I doubt I'd be able to tell the difference between them...

That being said, how can SPi Stage 3, using el diabolito make 274 whp, while SPi stage 2 makes 290 whp?

 

Is the water/air IC optional? I didn't see it mentioned at the site...

 

I hadn't thought of pics, I do have some on my computer of the Psi-Fi/Helix and maybe one of the SPI Kits so I'll add that in later. About EDR's dyno, i didn't mean for it to be grouped with the Stage 3, all i know is that he had an SPI Kit, dunno what stage (maybe an early stage 2, who knows) so i'm leaving it down there under SPI but w/o stage specs.

 

I live in a state that does emission testing on cars over three or four years old.

Are any of these kits street legal or are they for "off road use" only?

I think the Alta kit is classified as off road use only.

Knowing which (if any) of these kits are intended to pass emission testing may help a few of us decide which (if any) of these kits to pursue.

 

I have the stage 2 and I am making 295 WHP (mustang)

El falls into the MAD MOD X catagory or Stage X cause his is custom

also El is making 350 WHP (dyno Jet)


for anyone who wants a total list of the SPI kit....go to the FTR forum and ask there you shall recive...

FTR FORUM

 

so what is extra in the SPI stage 2 compared to the stage 1 that makes another 40 hp

 

Go re-read Randy's marketing text...it's all in how he qualifies that number by saying as installed on his "development car". I seriously doubt that his "development car" has the stage 1 Helix turbo components installed on an otherwise stock car. I see an a/w intercooler in the picture. Who knows what other things are tricked out in the engine. Maybe Randy can drop in and explain what's on his car to get 272 whp.

 

If I'm not mistaken, pistons. I'm sure Tuls wills chime in.

 

Basically everything you do to mod your car will claim it's for "offroad use only." This includes the SC pulley. I believe it is for the vendors to cover themselves, but still doesn't always mean it's going to fail emissions

 

yeah pretty much pistons...hence the reason the price didn't change much...but honestly no matter what you can just go to the FTR forum and get what you want...for me the price was almost the same as stage one and I got different turbo/injectors/pistons....cause when hubie and I set it up he was very specific with me...as in...."where do you want to go with this"

as she sits right now 24 lbs of boost with 295 WHP she's a GREAT daily....and everyone should understand how that works...once you cross in to a certain boost and or HP range you should really run at the least 101 octane OR drive accordingly if your not....which some do not have the restraint...this is where problems are caused....and things start to break..like with out pistons...you'll loose one if you are over certain boost...every motor varis too....but it's ussually around 25 lbs for stock pistons...especially on pump gas...with race gas you can get away with a little more

that isn't for everyone...for me, I knew where I was going with my mods before I started so I got Pistons....plus I know I go to the track/racing on the week end...so on fridays...I fill up the tank with 104!...plain and simple...during the week if I have 91 I shift at 5k...well not right now...cause I am making low boost...but it's just good practice

 

The car that Randy was reffering to does have lots of upgrades. Its not a stock car by any stance. It has a water to air, head/cam, exhaust, ported intake and runners.. etc. But, the numbers we posted on the website are un-tuned numbers. It was tuned and is now running around 310whp.

-Brian

 

This should be sticky so those who have an interest in twin kits can find it easely

 

Hey Tuls, I got two questions. 1) How much whp can you make on pump gas (93 in Texas) while being able to utilize the full rev range without going over that 25lbs of boost. I guess what I'm saying is what if a lazy owner is driving around town normally and doesn't like looking at his boost gauge all the time, how much whp will the SPi kit make? 2) If your car is running uprated pistons, how much boost can it handle? more than 25lbs?

**I want a daily driver that is basically fool-proof (i.e. - possible to go over 5000 RPM and not blow a piston)

I also think it should be mentioned that Helix can only be installed at their shop as I'm sure that's a major consideration for potential buyers.

I second the move to sticky this post.

 

Thanks Tuls (whats the keystroke again? lol) for the quick list. If any vendors browse through this thread, please feel free to chime in with a parts list, prices, and claimed power.

 

Add: Apexi AFC Select (computer to adjust A/F settings)

Good thing that the AFC (air-fuel controller) was included. With the 440s my car ran very very rich with the kit installed. We had to remove fuel from the system to get the A/F from below 10 (off the chart) to 11's near the high RPMs and to 12's in lower RPMs.

 

What is the MCS' stock AFR? I've never quite understood where exactly you would want the AFR to be. Are the power gains better with the S-AFC or a chip? You would want both correct? One last question, with the bigger injectors, would the S-AFC be able to use the larger injectors full potential?

 

I aint no expert but From what I know the AFR should be 14.7/1 or as close as,
this is stioch or the optimum amount of air to burn all the fuel in the combustion process,
the S-AFC is designed to control the injectors duty cycly i.e. the ammount of time they are open and closed,
the size of the injectors is to do with the ammount of fuel they can deliver while in the open part of the cycle,
the more boost you make the more fuel you need to add to keep your AFR as close to Stioch as possible.
I am open to correction on my above statement.

 

For light throttle conditions, where the engine is sucking in its own air (under vacuum), you are correct about 14.7/1 being close to optimal. However, with pushing the air into the engine things get a little tricky. You've gotta run a lot more fuel into the system while under boost You need to be at 12.0/1 or so to run safely. There's some good threads of discussion on this on NAM, as well as on the internet...do a search and you will find.

By default, the stock ECU tends to run on the rich side of best power output.

FWIW, the Apexi doesn't control the fuel going to the injectors, it merely changes some signals going to the ECU so that the EXU will "think" it is running too rich or too lean, causing the ECU to remove fuel or add it.

 

it's not uncommon to see 10:1 at WOT for the stock ECU; that is pig rich and a power eater. Maintaining 12.5:1 at WOT can easily pickup 10-15hp at the wheels

 

oh well that might be a problem for me!!!!!!!!!
the only fuel available here is 95RON (europe) which is about 90DON (US)
what is the max amount of boost that can be safely run on this fuel??????

 

This is why I keep telling people you can just get some genaric flash...cause every car is different...

I have tuned 5 minis in the last month or two....and all of them went to 8:1 after 5k this was the stock ecu....it was crazy....I couldn't believe it...I'll post the charts if I can....we tuned them and made 25 WHP ever time....it was awsome...some were stock...some were modded....it was unreal...

That's great in away to find out...heck now insted of doing a pulley one can just get a tune...it feels the same....or both at the same time...that woudl be inpressive...

I am not saying this is supposed to be the case with the AFs.....but even mine was like that...it's just what I have seen over and over