Matt....

[font=&quot]There's definitely a problem with some 05 cars when it comes to the TB.
CEL /EML is triggered randomly, for no apparent reason.

Peter
Team M7
562-608-8123

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Based on the $ I have spent and the dynos I have done It's hard to argue with this. I have personaly seen dyno operators put in big correction factors to make clients happy.

I'll brag a little. It is because of the difference in the claims, especially from across the pond that I ..... yes I ...... check it out.....made the sugggestion that we all chip in for a dyno test of the AGS. Thanks to Sid, et. al, for actually doing it. And THIS is my thread. Am I trying to cause trouble,...NO.... I am just tired of spending money and not getting the same results that others post. I don't want to claim BS here but there are no standards....at least nothing I can tell......and I don't have an answer other than to say....look to your own deltas for gains and losses and don't compare your car with other reports......figure don't lie but sometimes people get creative with figures ( paraphrase) to justify there agenda.

That being said, this is a cool place to hang and once you get to know the personalities and can wade your way through, it makes owning a Mini that much more satisfying. I would say that if were not for this board I probably would be driving a new M3 but this Mini community is pretty fun.

Oh yeah, bring back El!

 

What fault codes do you have? CEL/EML are not triggered randomly, for no apparent reason.

 

the peter police are pretty active today, eh?

 

I guess I have all winter to make up my mind and I do have a lot of spare time during the winter months, so I'll be reading and talking to more people that own modified cars and I'm sure eventually I'll know exactly what I want, I might even go for a ride in one of your cars if at all possible, I'd like to compare a few of them, I'm not looking for the maximum hp, I'm looking for a fast set up that will be reliable and can still cruise on the highway without taking too much more gas than stock, I don't mind getting 15 mpg if I drive like I stole it but not when I need to travel a long distance.:smile:

 

Andy is not wrong.

 

If the cause cannot be isolated, then what exactly is apparent about the CELs? Really dude, think about it. Nothing. Likewise, if there is no pattern, then it is random. Right?

 

"random" only means in this case that the true cause has not been identified YET. You guys know that intermittent problems are the hardest to "chase."

 

Patient: "Dr. Ingsoc, why is that heart monitor alarm going off?"

Dr. Ingsoc: "Rather than looking at the machine to see what the readout says, I'm going to tell you that the alarm is triggered randomly, for no apparent reason."

Really dude, think about it.

 

FYI, many medical conditions are directly characterized by random presentations of symptoms. Does that mean that you don't investigate? No! It's actually a very important/characteristic finding in many cases. There is a science AND an art to medicine. Likewise, there is a science and an art to car work. Peter said he was "working on it." He also gave a characterization of the problem. His words upstand. Care to re-phrase?

 

So, if the heart monitor alarm was going off, and you had the ability to look at the readout to see why it was going off, would you?

 

If you were the patient? If you asked nicely and let me do my job . I hope that your later years will find you less critical .

Before you phreak: Just kidding . Get to know me, man, and you'll realize that I may just be a good person after all. And, a good doctor.

 

Gentlemen -

I wouldn't argue with Andy about Vehicle Diagnostic evaluation. That's just...stupid.

 

The apparent random expression of some "medical conditions" (sic) is just a way of indicating that one has not yet identified the actual pattern of that expression. Of course, this is directly related to the etiology of the condition and the multitude of factors that can affect its expression. Gathering of more information and analysis of the data base is very important in one's attempt to define the etiology and mode of presentation of said condition. This is the science, not the art, of medicine.

If we consider certain aspects of the automotive and medical spheres to be analogous, then obtaining the fault codes for the SES/EML lights is an essential part of establishing the necessary data base that will be used to "solve" the problem(s). This is part of the science, not the art, of automotive diagnostics and therapeutics.

If you think a patient may have had a heart attack, you'll obtain an ECG and cardiac enzymes in addition to your history and physical examination. If your car goes on the fritz with SES/EML lights on, you'll obtain the fault codes and other objective information, in addition to defining the circumstances (history) and presence/absence of readily observed mechanical faults (physical examination).

Wouldn't it be nice if doctors' offices had a sophisticated "OBD-II" reader, just like some tuner shops have a stethoscope? --- . Where is that Star Trek tricorder when we need it? ---

 

Isn't that the reason doctors call their business a practice?

From the looks of it a lot of supposed mechanics think they are in the same business or would like us to believe they are. Some even go as far as charging the same fee's, but you know they are just practicing till they get it right.
This is not soft tissue science wrapped around the human enigma.
There are reasons for hardware, mechanical/software failures. Getting to the bottom line of a trouble requires a list of conditions, symptoms and diagnostics. This is cold metal and plastic here, it can't be fixed with feathers and excuses. It's not about the MINI said i just don't feel good today. Is random corrective action needed here? Code for let's try this.

I should have saved my 666 th post for this but somebody else needed the help on that one.

 

Hence why we moved down to a smaller bore throttle body for our late 2004+ build cars. We found this fixes the problem, we have our research and development department to thank for this.

 

RECOOP is totally correct. I'm a medical student, I'm quite familiar with the incredible amount of testing and theory that goes into many manners of treatment. But, any doctor will tell you, and common sense will decree, there must be something more than fact if one is to diagnose anything. You must evaluate the time permitted, the severity of symptom, etc. You must take the best course possible with what is known, progressing towards an incontrovertible understanding. All of this, to fix what ails.

Chaos, though, binds all manner of problem solving. We rarely if ever know every variable. We have only basic theory. Art is what is not known and what is not prescribed.

As this weakly pertains to the topic at hand, clearly M7 is trying to figure out what is necessary to allow 05 TB changes. Likewise, Alta is [presumably] beta testing their intake hoses and accounting for the variability seen between cars. Pilo has been testing their headers. All are, in my opinion, using the best of their knowledge, employing hypotheses, and working towards their goals.

The consequences may not be so severe as in the medical profession, but neither is a car anywhere near as complex as a human body. The anology, though, works fairly well to encapsulate my point. Hope y'all are having a great one! :smile:

 

Do you know what fault codes appeared when using the larger throttle body with the '05 cars?

 

LOL

 

Implicit in what you say is actual testing of the hypothesis, with generation of sufficient data either to prove or disprove the hypothesis. Are you confident that commercial ventures in this aftermarket area really consider the nuances of the scientific method? IMO, some manufacturers/marketers may and some may not ....

 

I agree...somewhere way back I said I didn't think the economies were there for all the mfgs to do the kind of in depth testing/R&D necesssary to satisfy the bloodthirsty.

On the other hand we need champions in this "buyer beware" market place.

 

We need champions, for sure. We need honesty. But, we also need VENDORS, and that means we must at minimum be courteous. Right? This is all my point is, really. This is what I stand for: courtesy.

 

has anyone been able to veiw these faults with gt1?