Hey, I am quite familiar with this unit. I happen to be the driver of the F5 tornado Mini. By lowering the intake temperature so much the engines computer advances the timing automatically when it senses that the engine is running cooler. With the stock unit the computer retards the timing because the intake temp is so high. With this unit they have found that this unit not only gets rid of that negative 7 degrees but it actually gains another 7 which if my math is correct equals 14 degrees of advanced timing when compared to stock.

Oh yeah by the way I had the fastest car at the challenge.

 

Ok, the engines computer will retard or advance ignition timing depending on engine temp. When the engine is to hot the computer will retard timing to prevent knock and ping which is damaging to the engine. It causes poor detination in the valve chamber where oxygen and fuel are mixed and will damage the pistons. So the computer will retard timing and by doing so you will lose HP. When the engine is cooler the computer will advance timing which will give you HP gains. I hope I have explained this well enough for you. Feel free to ask more questions as you need and I will try to answer them as best I can. If I do not know the answer I will get it for you or anyone else.

 

Not to highjack this thread but I am trying to find some info on how the Mini Challenge went. So far I havent seen anything posted. Any links out there ?
Randy

 

damn smart these machines...!!



thanks

 

Mini Mania's car did not run due to an accident during qualifying. #31 with the new intercooler missed grid by 1 minute due to a belt break in qualifying and Randy Webb blew a belt 2 laps before the end of the race. A classic mini race prepared one the day and his son took second in a classic as well. Charlie with RDR took 1st in autocross for his class.

 

A classic WON ? Oh man they will never let us( new minis ) live that one down As a former 1966 S owner I guess I have mixed feelings about that. Its great that the old box still has it but damn it i won a new one now LOL . Its all good , sounds like you had a great time!Thanks for the update ! I will keep a lookout for additional info.

Randy

 

From Mini Mania:
Jim Fuerstenberg's 1967 Cooper S took an early - if slim - lead over Randy Webb in his 2002 Cooper S, and Terry Milnes' 1968 Cooper S; Fuerstenberg held on in the first place slot for the majority of the 20-minute race. On the last lap, Randy Webb's 02 Cooper S fell victim to mechanical woes and did not finish. While Randy was pulling off the track, Fuerstenberg and Milnes continued their battle to the last minute. The lead changed for the first and last time, and Milnes came out on top for an exciting victory. It was the second time in the three-race history of the event that the winner was driving a classic Mini.
http://minichallenge.minimania.com/

 

what's up with the belt breakage?


on the webb forum, there is a comment that all the 19%-ers broke belts at the west meets east track event. (From strieby: "[size=1]Of note: everyone at the track at the West Meets East Mini Meet (including Randy) that was using the 19% pulley for racing, had a belt failure!') [/size] Any data to correlate?

like:
belt size and type, mileage on belt?
condition of tension idlers?
pulley size and type;
time at redline (or above 6500 rpm)?

 

All of the new minis there were running 19% red. pullies. No one really knows what the exact problem is but I have several ideas. Removing the fender liners which causes rocks to be spit into the belt's path, the belt isnt strong enough (in need of kevlar belts), one of the pullies isnt aligned, not enough surface area on the blower pulley, or something else. I went through 4 belts during the week of the challenge. I was taking the engine up to 7500 for lap after lap and the first belt held for 2 days.

 

Oh by the way, finding a belt for a mini without air-conditioning is a real *****.

 

jlm,
Both the MiniMania and the FMD car used short belts(no ac pulley)
Randy Webb ran the standard belt(with ac pulley).
With the 19% at race speeds, the belts have a short lifespan. I could not find a new belt before race time and so Randy had to run the race with a
belt that should have been changed. It's an "if only" but there was just no spare belt.
HTH

 

And where would you get such an "idea"

 

Personal experience.

that is all I have to say

 

Thats your story and you are sticking with it :smile:

 

One concern I have with a water to air intercooler is what happens if the radiator springs a leak into the intake. Are we talking instant hydro-lock?
The reason I ask is I had a water to oil cooler on a transmission cooler leak coolant into the transmission once. The tranny was expensive.
Hydro-locking the little motor might be too.
I'm not familiar with the design at all so sorry if this isn't possible and is a dumb question.

 

The radiator for the system is in front of the car so not possible. The only way it would be possible is if the intercooler itself were to leak. There are several high temp, high pressure gaskets being used and the unit is put together with high temp, high pressure sealant as well. These unit are being used by Kenne Bell with zero failures to date.

 

Mini Mania was using the stock belt as they are still running A/C on the car. I know this as I helped Don change the belt on his car Monday the first day of practice. Also my car is the other car used by FMD and it is also using the 19% pulley and I have no belt failure to date or excessive wear. That is with driving the car from Denver to Rockford taking it to 140 MPH several times, running 5-6 practice sessions aprox. 30 min. each and the autoX at the event which I took 3rd in the J class in which Randy Webb ran.

 

Clevy the project MCS in Grassroot Motorsports uses a NAPA piece No. 060325, a six rib, 325mm belt. This is with air conditioning compressor removed and lowest idler pulley which was deemed useless.

 

Yea,
I helped Don change a belt also (different time) but I don't remember the
A/C being in the mix Yes, you did take third, but second place was taken by a stock intercooler and a 15% pulley. :smile:
No belt problems 25,000 miles
Under race conditions, no 19% pulley finished. More sorting out is needed.

 

No 19% even finished? Were the majority/all failures due to belt problems?

 

mars finished: " Also my car is the other car used by FMD and it is also using the 19% pulley and I have no belt failure to date or excessive wear. That is with driving the car from Denver to Rockford taking it to 140 MPH several times, running 5-6 practice sessions aprox. 30 min. each and the autoX at the event which I took 3rd in the J class in which Randy Webb ran."


from what I can put together so far:
mars with 19% had no problems;
randy was using a worn out belt and 19% and it failed;
a couple of others with 19% had no AC or lower idler and short belt (and/or no fender liners to keep rocks out of the belt) and failed;

are these the results?:
1 out of 1 standard belt and 19% did fine;
1 out of 1 worn out standard belt and 19% failed;
2 out of 2 no AC, short belt, no fender liners, 19% failed.

 

Summary:
No 19% finished the mini/MINI Challenge race.
All were due to belt failures, regardless of size of belt
mars did not run in the challenge nor did he run in any qualifing session for the challenge.
What mars ran in was a was a 1 lap (1.8mile) timed session.
He also ran several practice laps. (Phil Wicks Driving Academy)
mars car performed well, just not under race conditions.
HTH

 

As an added note this was only my 5th time on a track and I have had no training what so ever, so I feel this was a very good accomplishment for me.

 

I did not attend Phil Wicks accademy while running the practice sessions, I also pushed the car very hard during these sessions to see if I could have any failures of any type. As I said before I pushed every shift point to red line at 7200 RPM's. Not saying that racing wouldn't make a difference but I feal I pushed it as hard as you would in a race during my practice sessions.

 

what is the run time of a race compared to several 30 minute practice sessions?