What's teh min/max values in teh ECU tables? For example, as a percentage, how far up or down can the ECU scale the injectors?

Also...what's the proper tool to check IDC with (not OBDII readings, but actual)?

 

<crickets>

 

PGT do you refer to the ecu as a stand alone unit through the λ-sensor or in general?

 

in general. In other words, what capability does the ECU have to control the injectors?

the same Q for the R56 as well but figured we'd get more answers for the older cars since the R56 ECU hasn't been fully exploited yet (only piggybacks).

 

i think that the ecu can contol the injector up to 3000 (through the λ-sensor), after that you need a program in the ecu

imagine a car running on stock program on the ecu and wearing 440cc injector. Logically after a couple of miles there would be a problem since the car would be running to rich on fuel…but….if you run the car until 3000 the ecu will mix air with fuel on the correct ratio…as far as the higher limit, you can run you car up to the limit you choose to but…you have other problems there (e.g oil pump…after 7500)

 

right...of course you need a tune for bigger injectors (like the JCW reflash to handle 380cc JCW's). I'm talking bandwidth here....what are the parameters for the Siemens ECU? Can it scale 30% over stock? 20%? In other words, at what point does the hardward (injectors) overwhelm the software's ability to control it?

anybody who's done a turbo conversion on their MINI will have run into this unless they run a piggyback.

 

so you are asking for the bandwidth that the ecu asks the injector to send the appropriate pulse and so the corresponding fuel to the engine(limited by the the fuel pump and the the fuel tube)?do i understand that correctly?

 

at what point are injectors too big for the stock ECU with tune to handle? 400cc? 440cc? 500cc?

 

i think 450 are the ones...as far as i know...(unless you mess up with unichip)

there is always the solution of the fuel regulator though

 

sure, but I'm not talking about maintaining proper IDC's as much as the ECU's ability to control them for proper drivability and emissions cycle.

 

I think it's something in the range of +/- 28%. With my turbo-project the ECU was able to scale for 440cc/min injectors over time and end up at a 0% long-term fuel trim but could never fully scale for 550cc/min injectors [without a piggyback].

Does that help? What do you have in the works?

 

I sold the current car but will eventually pick up another. I'd like to avoid the issues I had and do it right this time. There were idle issues on 440cc injectors and I never got a clear answer as to why (nor what IDC's were to prove that they were even needed). If stock is 330cc then 440's are a full 33% step and outside the ECU's control.

 

I have electronics to measure IDC's but then I'd have to send a couple of wise guys visit you. Just kidding, the 440's are needed on the setup you had(I have datalogs of my car, similar setup). But as I said in the past, every car is different, and my factory JCW car had horrible idle issues for years the dealer couldn't fix before I started modding the car. As they say, your mileage may vary.

 

I'm not talking about teh cold start issue from the factory....that's a given on MINI's.

I'm talking about craptastic idle from teh 440's. A few PM'ed me last time this came up and said they swapped to 380's and checked AFR's and everything was kosher and idle problems were gone.

What were teh IDC's from your setup? I'm guessing that the extra fuel isn't needed to keep IDC's in check but rather for cooling the charge at high rpm (one way to make big numbers....meth would be a good fix here).

 

No, my cold start was a different issue. This is hot idle problems from the JCW 380's. Right from the factory it had bad issues. The car would act like it was running on 2 cylinders. Short of leaving the car at the dealer for months or trying to get them to buy it back the only solution was to deal/live with it. Multiple flashes and upgrades did nothing.

At that point it was damn the warranty as I wasn't getting anywhere with the dealer and start modding the car. The idle has actually gotten much better since then. I think it's something buried deep in the code of certain ECU builds and various things can make it act up differently on different cars.

 

Unless I'm mistaken, the fuel trim only needs to pull 25% duty cycle [440cc/min x 0.75 scaling = 330] to get the same approximate volume. [not accounting for open/close times]. The 440's I ran were dyno'd, perhaps yours were actually higher flow and thus beyond your ECU's trim tolerance? Also, I had an '04, which used a different ECU than your '05/'06. That may be a difference too.

 

damn math!

yeah...that's quite possible, diff year ECU's etc. A few others had commented on the crappy idle with tune and head and injectors surely, when one goes that deep in modding, stock like attributes may go out the window.

just trying to decipher this a bit more. The closed nature of MINI tuning is in stark contrast to other marques where open source guys keep the vendors honest.

 

" The closed nature of MINI tuning...".
Aye, it be.

 

I am running 550cc without any problem..

 

On a stock ECU?? I think the OP is asking about the stock ECU's ability to run larger injectors without flashing.

 

on stock ECU, with flashing.. Ive heard of 380cc without a tune on non-JCW software, but I wouldnt run anything larger without a tune.